Transcript: World Trade Centre - Pentagon - Terrorism | Sep 11, 2001

(music plays)

A title appears inside the shape of a house: More to Life. Words spin against a red and orange background: Health, Family, Home, Money, Fitness, Life. Fast clips show images related to the previous concepts, such as a dollar bill, a wheat field, and strands of DNA.

In animation, the title appears inside the shape of a house: "More to life."

Then, Mary Ito sits in a studio with textured yellow walls and the logo of the show in the background, which reads "More to life."

Mary is in her late thirties, with short black hair. She's wearing a lavender blazer.

Mary says HELLO, I'M MARY ITO AND WELCOME TO "MORE TO LIFE." WELL AS YOU'VE PROBABLY HEARD BY NOW, THE UNITED STATES HAS BEEN FACING A TERRORIST ATTACK IN NEW YORK, WASHINGTON AND IT SEEMS SOME MORESET COUNTY NEAR PITTSBURGH. ALSO A NUMBER OF PLANES THAT HAVE BEEN HIJACKED AND ALSO THE GOVERNMENT IN THE UNITED STATES DOES NOT KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THEM AND THEIR WHEREABOUTS. WE ARE FOLLOWING THE SITUATION AS WE SPEAK ON THE SHOW. TO MAKE SOME SENSE OF THESE EVENTS, AS YOU'RE SITTING AT HOME AND WATCHING THIS STORY UNFOLD, WE'VE INVITED A GUEST IN FORMERLY WITH THE RCMP, CHRIS MATHERS, NOW PRESIDENT OF CORPORATE INTELLIGENCE, INCORPORATED. THANKS, CHRIS, FOR COMING IN.

Chris says MY PLEASURE.

Chris is in his forties, balding, with a stubble. He's wearing a gray suit, shirt and tie.

Mary says I THINK AS FAR AS THE VIEWER AT HOME GOES WHO'S WATCHING THE STORY UNFOLD, THE FIRST QUESTION THAT COMES TO MIND IS, HOW COULD SOMETHING LIKE THIS HAPPEN? IT'S MASSIVE, IT'S A MULTIPLE ATTACK ON A NUMBER OF AREAS IN THE UNITED STATES. IT SEEMS COORDINATED. HOW DO THIS HAPPEN, IN YOUR OPINION?

The caption changes to "Chris Mather. K.P.M.G. Corporate Intelligence."

Chris says I THINK THE FIRST REASON IS WE'VE DECIDED WE, THE AMERICAS, WE DECIDED THAT WE WANT TO LIVE IN A FREE AND OPEN SOCIETY, WHERE OUR MOVEMENTS AREN'T RESTRICTED, AND THIS... IN THAT KIND OF SOCIETY, THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY FOR PEOPLE WITH THIS PURPOSE TO TAKE THESE KIND OF ACTIONS.

Mary says YOU KNOW, BUT WITH THE CIA, HOPEFULLY IN PLACE, YOU KNOW, YOU THINK, WAS THERE SOME KIND OF A WARNING FOR SOMETHING THIS MASSIVE? I JUST HEARD GENERAL WESLEY CLARK ON CNN, FORMER COMMANDER OF NATO, AND HE'S SAID THE U.S. GOVERNMENT HAS KNOWN ABOUT GROUPS APPEARED THE POSSIBILITY OF ATTACK FOR A WHILE, AND HE SAID WE DIDN'T DO ENOUGH, QUOTE, UNQUOTE. NOW, WHAT COULD HE POSSIBLY MEAN BY THAT, "WE DIDN'T GOOD ENOUGH"?

Chris says WELL, WITH RESPECT TO THE GENERAL, THERE WILL BE A LOT OF PEOPLE MAKING A LOT OF COMMENTS WITH 20-20 HINDSIGHT ON WHAT'S GONE ON. PART OF LIVING IN THE FREE SOCIETY IS WE'RE NOT ALLOWED TO INTERCEPT PEOPLE'S PRIVACY WITHOUT WHAT WE CAN PROVE TO BE DUE CAUSE, AND SO IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO GATHER INFORMATION ON THE ACTIVITIES OF THESE INDIVIDUALS. THEY CONCEAL THEIR UNLAWFUL ACTIVITIES BEHIND SUPPOSEDLY ILLEGAL ACTIVITIES, AND YOU CAN'T INTERCEPT EVERYONE'S TELEPHONE AND YOU CAN'T HAVE INFORMERS ON EVERYONE. AS WELL, AN ORGANIZATION LIKE THIS PROBABLY IS SET UP, MOST TERRORIST ORGANIZATIONS ARE SET UP UNDER... AS A CELL, SO THERE'S NOT A LOT OF CROSS TALK. IF YOU AND I ARE BOTH IN A TERRORIST GROUP, WE MAY NOT EVEN KNOW ABOUT THE EXISTENCE OF EACH OTHER, SO THAT IF I'M CAUGHT, I CAN'T TELL ABOUT YOU. ALL I CAN TELL ABOUT IS THE GUY THAT TOLD ME WHAT TO DO. THE FIRST PERSON ON THE FIRST PLANE THAT WENT TO THE WORLD TRADE CENTRE MAY WELL NOT HAVE KNOWN ABOUT THE SECOND GROUP. THAT'S THE WAY THESE THINGS ARE ORGANIZED, FOR SECURITY.

Mary says WELL, AT THIS POINT, NO ORGANIZATION HAS ACTUALLY BEEN NAMED.

Chris says NO.

Mary says BUT MY UNDERSTANDING IS FOR SOMETHING ON THIS SCALE TO HAPPEN, THERE ARE ACTUALLY ONLY SO MANY ORGANIZATIONS THAT COULD POSSIBLY DO THIS. WHAT'S YOUR OPINION ON IT?

Chris says WELL, TO MOUNT AN OPERATION LIKE THIS REQUIRES FINANCING, AMAZING LOGISTICAL STRUCTURE, LOTS OF TALENTED PEOPLE. I DON'T SAY THAT WHAT THEY DID WAS GOOD BUT PEOPLE WHO HAD THE TALENTS TO CREATE BOMBS OR TO HIJACK AIRLINERS, THESE PEOPLE ARE NOT ON EVERY STREET CORNER, THEY HAVE TO BE TRAINED. SO IT WOULD REQUIRE AN ORGANIZATION WITH CONSIDERABLE RESOURCES. THERE'S NOT THAT MANY NON-STATES-SPONSORED ORGANIZATION IT IS IN THE WORLD THAT COULD MOUNT AN OPERATION LIKE THIS.

Mary says DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA, SPECIFICALLY, WHO MIGHT BE INVOLVED IN SOMETHING LIKE THIS, WHO COULD BE?

Chris says I WAS WATCHING EARLIER THIS MORNING, BEFORE THE INTERVIEW, THE INTERVIEW OF THE TALIBAN FOREIGN MINISTER IN AFGHANISTAN WHO ARE, AND RIGHTFULLY SO, CONDEMNING THIS ACT, BUT THE FIRST NAME THAT'S GOING TO COME TO EVERYONE'S MIND IS OSAMA BIN LADEN AND HIS ORGANIZATION, AND HE'S IN AFGHANISTAN, SUPPOSEDLY BEING HELD INCOMMUNICADO BY THE TALL I BEEN, AND IF THAT'S THE CASE, PERHAPS HE'S NOT BEHIND IT. THERE ARE NOT THAT MANY PEOPLE IN THE WORLD THAT HAVE THE SINGLE YOU ALREADY OF PURPOSE, PERHAPS, TO TRY TO PETITION THE UNITED STATES.

Mary says WHAT DO WE KNOW OF OSAMA BIN LADEN?

Chris says OSAMA BIN LADEN IS A SAUDI NATIONAL WHO... QUITE A WEALTHY MAN, ALLEGEDLY, WHO HAS TAKEN IT UPON HIMSELF TOO, YOU KNOW, DECLARE HIMSELF THE NUMBER ONE ARCHENEMY OF THE UNITED STATES, AND HE IS BELIEVED TO BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE DOUBLE EMBASSY BOMBINGS SEVERAL YEARS AGO, AND HE DEMONSTRATED AT THAT TIME, I THINK, HIS ABILITY TO DO A... TO SYNCHRONIZE AN ATTACK, IF IT IN FACT WAS HIM THAT DID IT. SO THERE IS A POSSIBILITY THAT HIM OR HIS ORGANIZATION OR BOTH ARE BEHIND THIS, BUT IT COULD BE SOMEONE ELSE, AS WELL.

Mary says YEAH, WE JUST DON'T KNOW AT THIS POINT. WELL, WE'RE GOING TO AN EYEWITNESS ACCOUNT OF WHAT HAPPENED THIS MORNING IN NEW YORK CITY AT THE WORLD TRADE CENTRE. ON THE LINE, WE HAVE MIKE SPEARLESS, A LAWYER IN LONDON, ONTARIO. THIS MORNING HE FLEW TO NEW YORK CITY, AND I BELIEVE WE HAVE HIM ON THE LINE. HELLO, MIKE.

The Caller says HI.

Mary says THANKS VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US. WHERE ARE YOU TALKING TO US FROM RIGHT NOW?

The Caller says I'M IN MIDTOWN MANHATTAN, IN A HOTEL. I'M LOOKING OUT THE WINDOW DOWN TOWARDS THE SMOKE.

Mary says WHAT EXACTLY DO YOU SEE?

A caption appears on screen. It reads "Mike Peerless. On the phone from New York City."

The Caller says WELL, ALL I CAN SEE FROM HERE REALLY, I'M PROBABLY CLOSE TO 50 BLOCKS FROM WHAT WAS THE WORLD TRADE CENTRES AT THIS POINT AND ALL YOU CAN SEE IS A LOT OF PEOPLE ON THE STREET, VERY FEW CARS, ALMOST ALL THE CARS HAVE NOW LEFT. A FEW MINUTES AGO, IN FACT, I WALKED ABOUT 30 BLOCKS RIGHT ON BROADWAY BECAUSE THERE REALLY ARE NO CARS OUT AND ALL I COULD SEE FROM HERE NOW IS REALLY SORT OF BROWN SMOKE. IT'S THE ONLY THING YOU CAN SEE, YOU CAN'T REALLY SEE ANY BUILDINGS.

Mary says DID YOU WITNESS THE EVENT THIS MORNING?

The Caller says I ACTUALLY SAW THE SECOND... WHAT I KNOW NOW TO HAVE BEEN THE SECOND CRASH. AT THE TIME, I ACTUALLY LANDED IN NEW YORK THIS MORNING AFTER FLYING FROM TORONTO. MY FLIGHT LANDED IN... JUST AFTER 8:30, IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN 8:35 OR SO AND WHEN WE FLEW IN, OVER THE CITY, I-OH I'M FROM LONDON, AS I SAID, STILL ENOUGH OF A SMALLTOWN GUY, I GUESS, THAT THE SIGHT OF NEW YORK CITY IS ALWAYS AMAZING TO ME, AND I CERTAINLY DIDN'T NOTICE ANY SMOKE COMING OUT OF THE WORLD TRADE CENTRES AS WE LANDED. I DON'T THINK IT COULD HAVE HAPPENED YET, AT THAT POINT. AND I HAPPENED TO BE NEAR THE FRONT OF THE AIRPLANE, I HAD NO BAGS CHECKED SO I SORT OF GOT OUT OF THE PLANE AND IMMEDIATELY WENT AND GOT IN A CAB AND AS I GOT ALMOST TO THE MIDTOWN TUNNEL I WAS TALKING TO A FRIEND ON THE PHONE WHO SAID, HEY, ARE YOU SEEING WHAT'S GOING ON? I SAID, WELL, WHAT? AND HE SAID, WELL THEY SAY A PLANE JUST CRASHED INTO THE WORLD TRADE CENTRE, AND I COULD... I COULD SEE IT RIGHT THERE AND ALL OF A SUDDEN, I LOOKED UP AND IT WAS ALMOST ABOVE ME, YOU COULD SEE ALL THE BLACK SMOKE POURING OUT OF IT. I HUNG UP THE PHONE AND TRAFFIC WAS VERY SW BY THAT TIME, WE JUST CREEPED... CREPT ALONG THE FREEWAY, AND AS I WAS WATCHING, THE SECOND PLANE APPEARED TO TURN AND AIM DIRECTLY INTO THE SECOND TOWER, LOWER THAN THE FIRST FIRE AND SMASHED RIGHT INTO THE BUILDING, AND, AGAIN, I WAS PROBABLY A MILE... MAYBE A MILE AND A HALF AWAY. IT SEEMED VERY CLOSE AND IT SEEMED UNREAL. SEEMED LIKE WATCHING A MOVIE.

Mary says NOW, YOU SAY FROM YOUR VANTAGE POINT THERE, THE STREETS SEEM PRETTY EMPTY.

The Caller says WELL, THERE'S VERY LITTLE TRAFFIC AND EXTREMELY QUIET. IT'S VERY UNUSUAL FOR MANHATTAN BECAUSE THE ONLY SOUNDS, REALLY, ARE... WHEN YOU'RE ON THE STREET ARE PEOPLE TALKING, A LOT OF PEOPLE STANDING AROUND, LOOKING AT TELEVISIONS IN VARIOUS SHOP WINDOWS AND TIMES SQUARE. I WALKED THROUGH TIMES SQUARE, THERE ARE MANY, MANY THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE IN TIMES SQUARE WATCHING THE BIG TV SCREENS THERE, AND REALLY, THE ONLY MAJOR SOUNDS YOU CAN HEAR ARE THE OCCASIONAL SIREN OF POLICE AND SWAT TEAMS AND AMBULANCES, ALL THOUGH THAT'S QUITE RARE NOW. ORIGINALLY THERE WAS A LOT OF THAT AND YOU CAN HEAR... QUITE OFTEN, YOU CAN HEAR FIGHTER PLANES FLYING OVERHEAD AND THEN YOU CAN SEE THEM. SOME OF THEM ARE FLYING QUITE LOW AND THERE'S A CONSTANT STREAM OF WHAT HAPPEN ON F-16 FIGHTERS FLYING AROUND.

Mary says MIKE, HAVE YOU BEEN TOLD ANYTHING BY HOTEL OR SECURITY STAFF THERE?

The Caller says NO. REALLY NO ONE KNOWS WHAT'S GOING ON. THE ONLY THING WE'VE REALLY BEEN TOLD THAT... I FELT FORTUNATE TO BE ABLE TO GET A HOTEL ROOM, I WASN'T PLANNING TO SPEND TONIGHT BUT CLEARLY I'M NOT GOING TO BE LEAVING. THE HOTELS ARE ALL FULL NOW IN MANHATTAN. THEY DO HAVE SOME SECURITY SET UP. YOU CAN'T GET UP TO YOUR ROOMS WITHOUT IDENTIFICATION AND ROOM KEY. AND, YOU KNOW, THERE'S TALK OF HOTELS MAYBE BEING EVACUATED ALTHOUGH THAT SEEMED TO BE FADING, THAT WAS ORIGINALLY AS I ARRIVED BUT THEY DON'T TALK ABOUT THIS ANYMORE. IT'S REALLY QUITE QUIET. PEOPLE ARE NOT AROUND HERE IN ANY KIND OF PANIC. IF ANYTHING, THERE ARE THERE ARE MANY PEOPLE WHO ARE UPSET BECAUSE THEY KNOW PEOPLE WHO WORK DOWN IN THE FINANCIAL DISTRICT OR IN THOSE TWO BUILDINGS THEMSELVES, AND IT SURE DOESN'T LOOK LIKE THAT'S LIKELY TO BE A HAPPY STORY FOR ANYONE WHO'S THERE.

Mary says MIKE, HOW DO YOU FEEL YOURSELF AT THE MOMENT?

The Caller says YOU KNOW, I FEEL... IT FEELS QUITE UNREAL, AND I GUESS I'VE GONE THROUGH A RANGE OF EMOTIONS INCLUDING... I SPENT ALMOST ALL DAY YESTERDAY ATTEMPTING TO GET TO NEW YORK FROM LONDON. I THOUGHT I'D HAD A BAD TRAVEL DAY BUT I GUESS I HAVEN'T, YOU KNOW, IN THE REAL BALANCE OF THINGS. YOU KNOW, I GUESS ALL I'M THINKING NOW IS THEY'RE CALLING FOR BLOOD DONORS AND I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHERE THE CLOSEST HOSPITAL IS SO I CAN GO AND DONATE SOME BLOOD MYSELF.

Mary says FOR YOU, MIKE. THANKS FOR TALKING TO US TODAY. THAT'S MIKE PERLESS, A LAWYER IN LONDON, ONTARIO. WE ARE GOING TO BE JOINED BY ANOTHER GUEST HERE AT "MORE TO LIFE" WHO WILL GIVE US SOME MORE CLARIFICATION AND... ON THE ONGOING STORY THAT'S HAPPENING BUT FIRST, JUST TO UPDATE YOU ON THE EVENTS THAT HAVE ACTUALLY OCCURRED TODAY, WE'D LIKE TO SHOW YOU SOME FOOTAGE. WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT THAT AND EXPLAIN THAT TO YOU.

Footage from WNYW plays on screen with the caption "Chopper 5. Live. Lower Manhattan."

The feed shows smoke coming out of a huge crash hole on two sides of one of the World Trace Center towers.

Mary says THIS MORNING, AS YOU CAN SEE, JUST BEFORE 9:00, A PLANE CRASHED INTO ONE BUILDING OF THE WORLD TRADE CENTRE. THAT WAS AT ABOUT 10 TO 9:00 THIS MORNING. CHRIS, WERE YOU ACTUALLY... DID YOU SEE THIS EVENT HAPPEN ON TV YOURSELF?

The clip shows smoke coming out of both towers. Then, another clip shows the moment a plane impacts the second tower, causing a huge explosion that releases a fireball and black smoke.

Chris says NO, OUR ANALYSTS WERE MONITORING CNN AS THEY ALWAYS DO AND THEY CAME TO TELL ME THE MINUTE IT HAPPENED, AND THEN CAME BACK AGAIN TO TELL ME ABOUT THE SECOND ONE.

Mary says AS YOU CAN SEE IN THIS footage, THE SECOND BUILDING WAS HIT, THE SOUTH BUILDING THERE, THE PLANE HIT THE SECOND BUILDING FURTHER DOWN, AND THERE'S JUST BILLOWING SMOKE FROM BOTH BUILDINGS.

Chris says QUITE HORRIBLE.

Mary says APPARENTLY, 50,000 PEOPLE WORK IN THE WORLD TRADE CENTRE. AND I BELIEVE THE FIRST PLANE HIT THE NORTH BUILDING AT ABOUT THE 80th FLOOR, SO THE AMOUNT... I CAN'T IMAGINE THE AMOUNT ALSO OF JUST THE DEBRIS AND, YOU KNOW SFALG DOWN...

Chris says SOME OF THEM ARE LOGAN. SUPER COMBUSTIBLE.

A short clip shows a cloud of smoke coming from the Pentagon.

Mary says NOW WE'RE ALSO LOOKING AT THE PENTAGON, OF YOU... WE'RE BACK TO THE WORLD TRADE CENTRE, BUT THE PENTAGON WAS ALSO HIT. A PLANE DID CRASH INTO THE PENTAGON AND I BELIEVE PART OF IT COLLAPSED?

Chris says YEAH, THERE WAS... THE ONE STORY I HEARD ON THE CNN WAS THEY THOUGHT AT FIRST THAT PERHAPS IT HAD LANDED AT THE MALL, THE GRASSY AREA OF THE PENTAGON AND THEY WERE EVACUATING THE PENTAGON BECAUSE OF THE FIRE BUT SOME PIECES APPARENTLY DID HIT THE PENTAGON. JUST A SHOT THERE OF THE TOWER COLLAPSING.

A clip shows the second tower collapsing.

Mary says SO MUCH SMOKE, YOU CAN'T EVEN TELL. BOTH TOWERS HAVE NOW COLLAPSED.

Chris says VERY GRAPHIC FOOTAGE.

Mary says THE FIRST TOWER ACTUALLY COLLAPSED AND NOW THE SECOND TOWER IS GOING DOWN.

Chris says OH, MY GOD.

Mary says IT'S JUST... YOU KNOW, WE WATCH THIS AND, I MEAN, THE WORLD TRADE CENTRE HAS BEEN SUCH A SYMBOL, AN ICON OF THE UNITED STATES, IT'S JUST REALLY HARD TO BELIEVE THAT IT'S NOT THERE.

Chris says IT'S HAPPENING, AND NOW WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH IT. MY ONLY CONCERN IS THAT WHEN THEY DO FINALLY IDENTIFY WHO THESE INDIVIDUALS ARE, OR SOME OF THEM, THAT THEY DIDN'T GET INTO THE UNITED STATES THROUGH CANADA.

Mary says AND THESE SHOTS, YOU KNOW, EARLIER SHOTS I SAW, CNN WAS RUNNING SHOTS OF NEW YORK CITY, AND MANHATTAN, I MEAN, PARTS OF IT LOOK LIKE A WAR ZONE. THE AMOUNT OF DEBRIS AND SOOTHE AND... SOOTHE AND PEOPLE WALKING THE INJURED. I HAVE TO INVITE OUR SECOND GUEST INTO THE CONVERSATION WHO'S JOINED US. THANK YOU FOR COMING IN, JOSEPH BAROFSKY, PROFESSOR OF INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS AT RYERSON UNIVERSITY AND WE HAVE CHRIS MADERS, FORMERLY WITH THE RCMP, NOW VICE PRESIDENT WITH CORPORATE INTELLIGENCE INCORPORATED.

Joseph is in his sixties, with short, receding blond hair and a mustache. He's wearing glasses, a tan suit and a pale blue shirt.

Mary says NOW, JOSEPH, WHAT IS YOUR TAKE ON THIS SO FAR? YOU'VE BEEN AT HOME WATCHING THE EVENTS UNFOLD.

The caption changes to "Professor Joseph Zboralski. Ryerson University."

Joseph says WHEN I FIRST GOT THE CALL THIS MORNING FROM RYERSON, TELLING ME THAT THE MEDIA WANTED TO SPEAK TO ME, I INITIALLY THOUGHT THAT MY FRIEND, BRUCE, AT RYERSON WAS KIDDING ME, BECAUSE I HAD JUST COME BACK FROM OUTSIDE AND I WAS... I WASN'T EVEN AWARE THIS WAS HAPPENING. SO I THOUGHT IT WAS A BIT OF AN HE LAB .08 HOAX ON HIS PART BECAUSE HE DOES THIS OCCASIONALLY. WHEN I STARTED WATCHING THIS ON TELEVISION, I WAS... I COULDN'T BELIEVE IT. IT'S AN EVENT WITHOUT PRECEDENTS. WHAT ITS IMPLICATIONS...

Mary says IS IT IN FACT AN EVENT WITHOUT PRECEDENTS? PUTTING IT INTO SOME KIND OF CONTEXT OR PERSPECTIVE AS FAR AS TERRORIST ACTS GO.

Joseph says TERRORISM HAS ALWAYS BEEN PART AND PARCEL OF POLITICS, THEY'VE ALTERED WORLD HISTORY, BUT I KNOW THERE HASN'T BEEN ANYTHING ON THIS SCALE, WHERE... WHICH WILL INVOLVE ENORMOUS LOSS OF LIFE, ENORMOUS LOSS OF PROPERTY, OBVIOUSLY, AND...

Mary says POTENTIALLY, DO WE HAVE ANY IDEAS ABOUT THE LOSS OF LIFE?

Joseph says I WOULDN'T WANT TO SPECULATE BUT IF YOU JUST SORT OF CALCULATE HOW MANY PEOPLE WORK IN THE AREA AND EVEN IF HALF OF THEM GOT OUT OF THERE, THAT STILL LEAVES TENS OF THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE THAT WILL HAVE BEEN KILLED OR INJURED BY THIS EVENT. SO I'M AT A LOSS IN A SENSE. I'M NOT SURE HOW A GOVERNMENT RESPONDS TO SOMETHING LIKE THIS.

Mary says MY QUESTION IS, WOW, WHAT KIND OF PROTOCOL WOULD BE IN PLACE FOR THIS KIND OF A NATIONAL EMERGENCY?

Joseph says I'M NOT SURE THERE'S ANYTHING SPECIFIC IN PLACE, BUT AN EVENT OF THIS MAG ANY STUD, ESPECIALLY SORT OF A SERIES OF EVENTS SORT OF UNFOLDING IN THE COURSE OF A NUMBER OF HOURS AND MAYBE MORE TO COME FROM SOME INDICATIONS. THE GOVERNMENT, I THINK, HAS TO INDICATE TO THE PEOPLE THAT IT'S IN CONTROL, THAT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE IN CHARGE, ARE IN CHARGE, THAT THE RIGHT DECISIONS ARE BEING MADE, THAT THE PRESIDENT IS RUNNING THE SHOW AS HE SHOULD BE. WHICH IS IMPORTANT FOR KINDS OF SOCIAL STABILITY, FOR POLITICAL STABILITY IN THE COUNTRY AND YOU DON'T WANT THE PEOPLE GETTING NERVOUS AND SO FORTH. AND THEN THE APPROPRIATE INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES HAVE TO GET INVOLVED AND START TRYING TO FIND OUT WHAT THE SOURCE... WHAT THE SOURCE OF THIS WAS, AND TRY TO TAKE THE APPROPRIATE RESPONSE. THERE HAS TO BE A RESPONSE, BUT THE QUESTION WILL BE WHAT IS THE APPROPRIATE RESPONSE, AND IF IN FACT IT WAS SOME TERRORIST ORGANIZATION, CLEARLY IT MAKES IT THAT MUCH MORE DIFFICULT. IN A SENSE, IF A COUNTRY ATTACKS A COUNTRY, THERE IS A SCENARIO THAT PLAYS OUT. IN TERMS OF RECEIPT TRY BOUGSZ, BUT IN TERMS OF A GROUP OUT THERE, SORT OF A NEBULOUS GROUP OUT THERE, HOW DO YOU RESPOND TO THIS KIND OF GROUP. MAKES IT DIFFICULT FOR THE GOVERNMENT OF THE UNITED STATES.

Mary says SO ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT RULES OF WAR, AND IN THIS CASE, THIS IS A WHOLE NEW BALLGAME. WE DON'T KNOW WHAT TO MAKE OF IT THERE ARE NO RULES.

Joseph says THERE ARE NO RULES, REALLY N THIS KIND OF SITUATION. I THINK... THEY'RE GOING TO BE THINKING ON THEIR FEET THROUGH THIS ONE.

Mary says DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT, CHRIS?

Chris says I AGREE THERE ARE NO RULES OF WAR, THERE ARE RULES OF ENGAGEMENT FOR THESE PEOPLE AND I THINK WHAT THE U.S. GOVERNMENT WILL PROBABLY DO, WHAT PRESIDENT BUSH WILL DO IS JUST HAVE HIS INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES AND THE FBI INVESTIGATE AND ATTEMPT TO DETERMINE WHO THESE PEOPLE REALLY ARE, WHO'S BEHIND THIS. IS IT STATE-SPONSORED, IS IT AN ORGANIZATION ACTING ALONE. FIND OUT WHO IT IS. I THINK THERE'S GOING TO BE, ONCE THEY DO THAT, SOME TYPE OF MILITARY DISPLAY OR ACTION, BUT SECONDARY TO THAT, ONLY IN... ALONG A TIMELINE, THERE WILL BE OTHER ACTION WHERE THESE PEOPLE WILL BE IDENTIFIED AND EITHER BROUGHT TO JUSTICE OR DEALT WITH IN SOME OTHER FASHION.

Mary says WE'VE BEEN TOLD THAT PRESIDENT BUSH IS NOT RETURNING TO WASHINGTON, THAT IN FACT HE'S BEEN FLOWN TO SOME MILITARY INTELLIGENCE BASE, UNDISCLOSED. WHAT DO YOU THINK HE WOULD DO NEXT?

Chris says WELL, THEY HAVE FEMA, THE U.S. AGENCY, THE EMERGENCY MEASURES AGENCY, HAVE TAKEN OVER PART OF THIS AND THEY DO PROJECTIONS AND GAMES AND PRACTISES ON THESE KINDS OF THINGS ALL THE TIME. I DOUBT WHETHER THEY'VE EVER CONTRIVED ONE THIS SUBSTANTIAL BUT THEY ARE ALL SET UP TO DEAL WITH THIS, PROPER HOSPITALS AND PROPER MILITARY SUPPORT. AS FAR AS THE PRESIDENT'S ACTIVITIES, I WOULD SUSPECT THEY USE THE SAME PROTOCOLS THEY DO IN THE EVENT OF A POTENTIAL NUCLEAR ATTACK, THE ENTIRE CABINETS AND PRESIDENT ARE TAKEN TO ANOTHER LOCATION AND THEY HAVE ANOTHER WHITE HOUSE, DOESN'T LOOK THE SAME BUT THEY'RE ABLE TO DO ALL THE THINGS THEY HAVE TO DO IN THE EVENT OF A NUCLEAR ATTACK, THEY HAVE THE ABILITY TO COMMUNICATE, SECURE COMMUNICATIONS AROUND THE WORLD, ET CETERA.

Mary says OKAY. I'D LIKE TO REMIND OUR VIEWERS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE TERRIBLE SCENARIO THAT HAS UNFOLDED IN THE UNITED STATES TODAY. WE'D LOVE TO HEAR YOUR COMMENTS, YOUR CONCERNS, WHAT THIS MEANS TO YOU. WE INVITE YOU TO CALL IN TODAY ON "MORE TO LIFE." THE PHONE NUMBER IN TORONTO IS 416-484-2727. YOU CAN ALSO DIAL LONG DISTANCE TOLL-FREE, AT 1-888-411-1234.

A caption reads "416-484-2727. 1-888-411-1234."

Mary says AND WE ARE NOW GOING TO GO TO ANOTHER EYEWITNESS WE HAVE ON THE LINE, DAN DILKES, A CANADIAN CURRENTLY LIVING IN BETHESDA, MARYLAND AND LIVES ABOUT 15 MINUTES FROM THE PENTAGON. DAN, ARE YOU THERE?

The Caller says I AM.

Mary says HOW ARE YOU?

The Caller says I'M DOING JUST FINE.

Mary says WHERE WERE YOU THIS MORNING WHEN THE PENTAGON ATTACK OCCURRED?

The caption changes to "Dan Dilks. On the phone from Bethesda."

The Caller says I WAS IN MY HOME, WORKING IN MY OFFICE. SOMEBODY HAD TO CALL ME AND TELL ME THIS WAS GOING ON, I HAD NO IDEA. SO OF COURSE I GRABBED THE TV CLICKER AND THERE I WAS WATCHING EVERYTHING. IT WAS SHOCKING.

Mary says WHAT WAS YOUR REACTION AS YOU WATCHED THIS UNFOLD?

The Caller says YOU KNOW, MOST OF MY REACTION BECAME FEAR VERY QUICKLY BECAUSE YOU KNOW, I WANTED TO KNOW WHERE MY FRIENDS WERE AND THOSE KIND OF THINGS AND I HAVE A NUMBER OF FRIENDS THAT WORK AROUND THE PENTAGON, AND SO QUICKLY IT SORT OF STARTED INTO MASSIVE TELEPHONE CALLING AND E-MAILING AND TRYING TO GET HOLD OF PEOPLE TO MAKE SURE THEY WERE ALL OKAY WHICH THEY WERE.

Mary says WHAT'S THE MOOD... I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'VE HAD A CHANCE TO TALK TO NEIGHBOURS, BUT HOW WERE THE PEOPLE YOU GOT IN TOUCH WITH?

The Caller says I THINK THE MAIN THING WAS FEAR, BUT QUICKLY YOU CAN REALLY FEEL IT TURNING TO ANGER, THE FEAR FACTOR IS GOING AWAY REAL QUICK, SO THE ANGER FACTOR IS REALLY, I THINK, TAKING HOLD NOW.

Mary says UH-HUH. HOW DO YOU FEEL AS A CANADIAN, GOING THROUGH THIS RIGHT NOW?

The Caller says I HAVE TO SAY, I THINK MY MOOD IS MIRRORING EXACTLY THE REST OF THE PEOPLE HERE. I MEAN, I WAS TOTALLY SHOCKED BY THE WHOLE THING, AND INITIALLY, WHEN THINGS STARTED TO GO THE WAY THEY WERE HERE, I MEAN, MY FIRST REACTION WAS, OKAY, THIS HAS BEEN FUN LIVING HERE BUT MAYBE IT'S TIME TO GO HOME AFTER ALL. I JUST KIND OF FEEL NOW, I AM SORT OF A LITTLE BIT NUMB AT THE SAME TIME BUT, I DON'T KNOW, I'M QUITE ANGRY ABOUT IT MYSELF, I THINK.

Mary says THAT WAS DAN DILKS, LIVES AND WORKS IN WASHINGTON, BETHESDA, ABOUT 15 MINUTES FROM THE PENTAGON. I WAS TALKING EARLIER ABOUT THE ASSUMPTION THAT THIS WAS A FOREIGN TERRORIST ATTACK AND THAT THE POSSIBILITY OF WHICH GROUP OR GROUPS COULD HAVE THAT KIND OF RESOURCES, INTELLIGENCE, CONNECTIONS, TO LAUNCH SOMETHING ON THIS SCALE. WHAT'S YOUR OPINION ON THAT?

Joseph says WELL, IT WOULD EITHER HAVE TO BE A GROUP THAT HAS SIGNIFICANT STATE SUPPORT FROM SOME COUNTRY OUT THERE THAT HAS THE RESOURCES TO PROVIDE, OR IT WOULD HAVE TO BE A GROUP THAT HAS ITS OWN RESOURCES, FROM ALL ACCOUNTS OSAMA BIN LADEN'S GROUND DOES HAVE THESE RESOURCES IN TERMS OF BOTH PERSONNEL AND MONEY, AND CERTAINLY HAS A GRIPE AGAINST THE UNITED STATES. SO I WOULD SUSPECT THOSE ARE PROBABLY YOUR TWO BEST BETTER IN TERM OF WHERE THIS IS COMING FROM. WHEN I WAS COMING UP HERE IN THE CAB, I HEARD ON THE RADIO THAT THERE'S BENEFICIAL STATEMENT FROM THE TALIBAN GOVERNMENT IN AFGHANISTAN AND THEY WERE DISTANCING... OBVIOUSLY DISTANCING THEMSELVES FROM THIS PARTICULAR EVENT, AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT MEANS ANYTHING, BUT OBVIOUSLY, THAT'S WHERE BIN LADEN HAD A NUMBER OF HIS OPERATIONS, AND THE GOVERNMENT OBVIOUSLY FEELS THAT THEY DON'T WANT TO BE TAINTED BY THIS SO THEY QUICKLY MADE A PUBLIC STATEMENT DENOUNCING THIS EVENT AND DENOUNCING TERRORISM AND THAT WE'RE NOT BAD GUYS AND ALL THIS STUFF. I THINK IT'S TOO EARLY, LIT TAKE SOME RESEARCH TO FIND OUT WHO'S BEHIND THIS BUT SOMEBODY WITH A LOT OF RESOURCES.

Mary says PRIME MINISTER JEAN CHRETIEN HAS ALREADY MADE A STATEMENT, HE'S EXPRESSED HORROR AT THE ATTACKS, CALLED THEM COWARDLY AND DEPRAVED AND THAT SUCH AN ATTACK IS AN ASSAULT NOT ONLY ON THE TARGETS BUT AN OFFENCE AGAINST THE FREEDOM AND RIGHTS OF ALL CIVILIZED NATIONS. WHAT DOES THIS MEAN TO CANADA? LET ME ASK YOU FIRST, JOSEPH.

Joseph says WELL, WHAT IT MEANS TO CANADA IS THAT IT'S UNFORTUNATE THAT OUR NEIGHBOUR IS IN THIS SITUATION. I MEAN, IT'S UNFORTUNATE... GOING TO HAVE ECONOMIC REPERCUSSIONS, ANY TYPE OF ECONOMIC DAMAGE TO THE UNITED STATES, THERE'S GOING TO BE ECONOMIC DAMAGE THAT WILL RESONATE UP HERE. I'M MORE DEFENSIVE, I'M MORE ISOLATIONIST, MORE AGGRESSIVE UNITED STATES POSSIBLY COULD EMERGE OUT OF SOMETHING LIKE THIS IS NOT IN OUR ADVANTAGE, NOT TO OUR ADVANTAGE. AND, YOU KNOW, THE FACT THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE LIVING IN WHAT WILL BECOME POTENTIALLY A MUCH MORE PRECARIOUS PART OF THE WORLD. IN A FUNNY SORT OF WAY, NORTH AMERICA HAS BEEN SHELTERED FROM MUCH OF THE UP HAEFLS OF THE WORLD FOR THE LAST COUPLE HUNDRED YEARS IN MANY WAYS, CERTAINLY THE MAJOR WARS, AND IN A FUNNY WAY, THINGS ARE COMING HOME TO ROOST IN SOME WAYS. THERE IS A CERTAIN ANYONE JEFFABILITY ABOUT THIS, THE UNITED STATES HAS ASSUMED A MAJOR GLOBAL ROLE OVER THE LAST 50, 60 YEARS AND HAS MANAGED TO ENGAGE IN A NUMBER OF CONFLICTS SUCCESSFULLY WITH THE EXCEPTION OF MAYBE SENIOR CITIZEN NAME AND THE UNITED STATES HAS A LOT OF ENEMIES AROUND THE WORLD. AND FOR ANY NUMBER OF REASONS, SOME NOT VALID, SOME PARTIALLY VALID. BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF REASONS PEOPLE DON'T LIKE THEM. WE'RE THEIR NEXT-DOOR NEIGHBOURS MOST CLOSELY IDENTIFIED WITH THEM. IN A LOT OF PARTS OF THE WORLD, WE ARE... THERE'S NO DIFFERENTIATION BETWEEN CANADIANS AND AMERICANS, WE'RE ALL NORTH AMERICANS. I'M JUST SPECULATING HERE BUT IN A SENSE, IT CAN'T HELP US IN ANY SORT OF WAY, I DON'T THINK.

Mary says YOU SAY THE WORD "SHELTERED," AND I SAW ONE U.S. CONGRESSMAN SAYING THAT THE INTELLIGENCE, THE C.I.A. INTELLIGENCE HAS BECOME FAR TOO LAX, THAT PEOPLE HAVE TO TAKE A REALLY CLOSE LOOK AT WHAT'S HAPPENED THERE TO ALLOW SUCH A THING LIKE THIS TO HAPPEN AND THAT THE UNITED STATES HAS BEEN TOO LAX SINCE THE SOVIET UNION. WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THAT?

Joseph says THAT'S HOGWASH. THE UNITED STATES SPENDS MORE ON DEFENCE AND MORE ON WEAPONRY AND MORE ON R AND D IN THESE AREAS AND MORE ON INTELLIGENCE THAN ANYBODY ELSE ON THE PLANET. I MEAN, BECAUSE THEY HAVE GLOBAL INTERESTS, THEY SPENDS A LOT OF MONEY ON THIS STUFF. THIS KIND OF ATTACK REALLY CANNOT BE PREVENTED. I MEAN, IF A TERRORIST TAKES OVER A PLANE AND RUNS A PLANE INTO A BUILDING, YOU CAN'T STOP THIS SORT OF THING. DOESN'T MATTER HOW SOPHISTICATED YOUR SYSTEMS ARE AND IN THE PAST THEY HAVE MANAGED TO PREVENT A NUMBER OF TERRORIST ATTACKS ON AMERICA. I MEAN, THERE WAS THE PLAN TO SORT OF DROP THE JUMBO JETS IN ASIA, OBVIOUSLY THE WORLD TRADE CENTRE BOMBING WHICH COULD HAVE BEEN WORSE AND ALL THOSE GUYS THAT HAVE BEEN STOPPED AT THE BORDER WITH TRUNK LOADS FULL OF EXPLOSIVES AND SO ON U SO THE INTELLIGENCE WORKS. YOU CAN STOP MOST OF THEM BUT YOU CAN'T STOP ALL OF THEM. I HEARD THIS COMMENT FROM THIS AMERICAN CONGRESSMAN EARLIER TODAY AND HE'S USING THIS FOR SORT OF PART... I COULDN'T BELIEVE IT, THAT HE'S USING THIS PARTICULAR MOMENT FOR PARTISAN ADVANTAGE. HE'S RANTING AND RAVING SAYING, YOU KNOW, WE'VE BEEN TALKING TOO MUCH ABOUT HEALTH AND TOO MUCH ABOUT EDUCATION, EVERYBODY HAS THEIR INTERESTS IN THOSE AREAS BUT THE REAL INTERESTS ARE THE INTERESTS OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE BASICALLY IMPLYING THEY SHOULDN'T BE SPENDING THERE BUT SPENDING ON MORE GUNS, MORE WEAPONS, ON MORE INTELLIGENCE, AS IF THAT'S GOING TO MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE.

Mary says WHAT DO YOU THINK, CHRIS?

Chris says I THINK IT'S KIND OF IRONIC BECAUSE THE COUNTRY THAT SORT OF PRIDES ITSELF AS BEING KNOWN FOR THE BIRTHPLACE OF FREEDOM AND DEMOCRACY WILL END UP AS A RESULT OF THIS AND OTHER ACTIONS PROBABLY BEING A VERY RESTRICTED SOCIETY. I THINK THAT'S PRETTY SAD. I AGREE WITH JOSEPH, YOU CAN'T STOP STUFF LIKE THIS. SINGLE EVENTS AND THIS IS A LARGER ONE, BUT IN THE KIND OF SOCIETY THAT WE LIVE IN, YOU CAN'T STOP THEM. HOWEVER, THERE WAS OBVIOUSLY A HUGE LAPS IN SECURITY AND LOOKS LIKE THE FINGER IS POINTING AT LOGAN AIRPORT IN BOSTON BECAUSE THAT SEEMS TO BE WHERE EVERYTHING CAME FROM. THE RESULT OF THIS IS MORE DIFFICULTY FLYING.

Mary says TIGHTENING IS RIGHT BECAUSE THE U.S. SEEMS TO BE SHUTTING ITSELF UP LIKE A BOX RIGHT NOW, WITH ALL THE AIRLINES STOPPED, THE BORDER TO MEXICO CLOSED.

Joseph says TO MAKE SURE NO MORE PROBLEMS COME IN BUILT ALSO THAT NOBODY GETS OUT.

Chris says THERE HAD TO BE SOME TYPE OF SUPPORT FOR THESE GROUPS THAT WEREN'T ON THE AIRPLANES, AND THOSE WILL BE THE ONES THAT THE INTELLIGENCE AND THE LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES WILL BE KEYING ON OVER THE NEXT SEVERAL MONTHS.

Mary says COULD CANADA HAVE HAD AN INDIRECT ROLE ON THIS?

Chris says AS I MENTIONED TO YOU DURING THE CLIPS, I'M JUST PRAYING IT DOESN'T COME OUT AT THE END THAT SOME OR ALL OF THESE PEOPLE CAME THROUGH CANADA. WHO KNOWS, BUT WE HAVE HAD... WE DO HAVE A PRETTY BAD TRACK RECORD WHEN IT COMES TO SCREENING PEOPLE IN THIS COUNTRY AND, YOU KNOW, THE AHMED RASSAM CASE WHERE HE USED CANADA VIRTUALLY AS A PLAYGROUND, ARRIVING WITH FALSE IDENTIFICATION AND BEING WELCOMED WITH OPEN ARMS AND PLANNING BOMB ATTACKS ON THE UNITED STATES. YOU KNOW, THAT WAS AN ALGIER YOU KNOW GROUP BUT WE ARE SO MUCH AND SO FORGIVING, I GUESS, IF YOU WILL, THAT I'M JUST HOPING THAT AT THE ENDS THEY DON'T DISCOVER SOMEBODY USED CANADA TO GET IN THERE. THAT WASN'T THE CAUSE OF THE THING BUT IT HELPED, IF IT'S THE CASE.

Mary says WE HAVE A CALLER ON THE LINE. LEAH IS CALLING IN FROM HAMILTON. HELLO, DO YOU EVER A QUESTION OR A COMMENT?

The Caller says YEAH, I DO. HOW DO WE STOP TERRORISTS FOR NO VALUE FOR LIFE? IF THE UNITED STATES ATTACKS BACK, WILL IT REALLY AFFECT THEM?

Mary says JOSEPH, WOULD YOU LIKE TO TRY THAT?

Joseph says I DON'T THINK YOU CAN STOP TERRORISTS WHO ARE FANATIC KLEE COMMITTED TO THEIR CAUSE. IT'S A VERY PECULIAR MINDSET. THEY BELIEVE THAT THEY ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT AND THAT THE ENEMY, AND THE ENEMY TENDS TO BE SORT OF DEPERSONALIZED, SO IT BE AMERICAN IMPERIALISM OR CAPITALISM, WHOEVER IT HAPPENS TO BE, BUT THE ENEMY IS DEPERSONALIZED AND ANY PRICE IS WORTH PAYING. SO IF YOU KILL A NUMBER OF AMERICANS, THAT'S ALL THE GOOD FOR YOU AND IF THEY STRIKE BACK AT YOU, WELL, THAT'S PART OF YOUR... THAT'S PART OF THE PRICE YOU PAY FOR THE ACHIEVEMENT OF YOUR CAUSE, AND SOONER OR LATER, YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU'RE GOING TO BE SUCCESSFUL IN YOUR GOALS. IT'S HARD TO STOP THAT KIND OF MINDSET.

Mary says YOU KNOW, I'M WONDERING I MENTIONED EARLIER ABOUT LOOKING AT THE SCENES OF NEW YORK AND IT JUST LOOKED LIKE WAR FOOTAGE FOR A WHILE WITH ALL THE DEBRIS AND INJURED PEOPLE. THIS ISN'T THE FIRST BOMBING THAT'S HAPPENED AT THE WORLD TRADE CENTRE. I BELIEVE IT WAS IN THE EARLY '90s, '93 THAT THE FIRST ONE HAPPENED. DID THEY LEARN LESSONS FROM THAT? ARE THERE EMERGENCY MEASURES IN PLACE IN NEW YORK TO ADEQUATELY HANDLE THIS KIND OF SITUATION?

Chris says WELL, I THINK YOU CAN SEE... MAYBE YOU CAN'T SEE FROM THE FOOTAGE BUT THERE ARE EMERGENCY MEASURES IN PLACE ALL OVER THE UNITED STATES, BUT PARTICULARLY IN NEW YORK AND SPECIFICALLY IN MANHATTAN TO ZEAL WITH ALL MANNER OF... TO DEAL WITH ALL MANNER OF THESE... THEY ARE WELL PREPARED ALTHOUGH IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO BE SUFFICIENTLY PREPARED FOR A CALAMITY OF THIS MAGNITUDE. THERE WILL BE SO MANY DEAD AND PUT IT BLUNTLY, IT'S NOT THE DEAD PEOPLE YOU'RE WORRIED ABOUT IT'S THE INJURED PEOPLE YOU HAVE TO TEND TO AND THERE WILL BE TENS OF THOUSANDS OF THEM. IT WILL BE VERY DIFFICULT. A HUGE STRAIN ON ALL THE HOSPITAL AND AMBULANCE SERVICES, EITHER REMARK AND IN THE MEANTIME, THE CITY KEEPS LIVING AND OTHER THINGS KEEP HAPPENING THAT HAVE TO BE DEALT WITH. THERE'S STILL BANK ROBBERIES AND STILL COMPLAINTS AND THE POLICE HAVE TO RESPOND TO THOSE, AS WELL. A MONDAY YOU MEN TO US TASK.

Mary says THANKS, CHRIS. WE'RE GOING BACK ON THE LINES. WE HAVE BEVERLY CATCART ROWS, THE CO-FOUNDER OF THE PARENT EDUCATION NETWORK. ALSO A REGULAR CONTRIBUTOR TO THIS SHOW. BEVERLY, ARE YOU THERE? THANKS FOR JOINING US.

The Caller says I AM HERE.

Mary says WHEN IT COMES TO OUR FAMILIES, MANY OF US HAVE BEEN SITTING AT HOME WATCHING THIS. THERE ARE CHILDREN WHO ARE WATCHING THIS, THEY'LL BE HEARING BIT IN THE NEWS OR READING ABOUT IT. WHAT DO WE TELL OUR CHILDREN ABOUT THIS KIND OF TRAGEDY?

The caption changes to "On the phone: Beverley Cathcart-Ross. Parent Education Network."

The Caller says WELL, CERTAINLY, OUR REFLEX AND ITS... IS GOING TO BE TO PROTECTS OUR CHILDREN, TO SHELL TIER THEM, KEEP THEM CLOSE TO US AND HOPEFULLY WE'LL GET PAST THAT REFLEX FAIRLY QUICKLY AND REALIZE THIS IS NOT GOING TO PREPARE THEM FOR LIFE AND FOR THE WORLD, IT'S NOT GOING TO EQUIP THEM WITH THE SKILLS THEY NEED TO COPE WITH DAY-TO-DAY LIFE, AND ONE OF YOUR GUESTS HAS ALREADY SAID, THERE IS NO GUARANTEE. THERE IS RISK OUT THERE AND WE NEED TO LEARN TO LIVE WITH RISK. PZ.

Mary says I UNDER YOU WERE AT A SCHOOL WHEN THIS EVENT WAS ANNOUNCED.

The Caller says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

Mary says AND WHAT ABOUT SCHOOLS, HOW SHOULD THEY BE HANDLING THIS?

The Caller says I THINK THE SCHOOLS ARE... IMPORTANTLY, THEY'RE LOOKING AT THE CHILD'S NEED TO BE WITH THEIR FAMILY PERHAPS AT THIS TIME SO I KNOW A LOT OF SCHOOLS ARE ALLOWING CHILDREN OUT OF THE CLASSROOM. THEY'RE EXPOSING THEM TO THE INFORMATION ON TVS, IF THEY'RE IN THE OLDER GRADES. THEY'RE DISCUSSING IT. THERE'S GOING TO BE A LOT OF CHILDREN THAT ARE GOING TO HAVE PARENTS THAT ARE MAYBE ON PLANES RIGHT NOW, AND TRAVELLING TO OTHER PARTS OF THE UNITED STATES AND SO THERE WILL BE SOME PANIC AND THOSE CHILDREN NEED TO HAVE SOME... SOMEBODY TO TURN TO. SO I THINK THE SCHOOLS ARE OPENING UP THEIR DOORS TO HELPING CHILDREN. I HAVE ONE DAUGHTER HOME FROM HIGH SCHOOL AND THAT'S THE APPROACH THEIR SCHOOL TOOK, LETTING CHILDREN OUT, RELEASING THEM IF THEY WANT TO GET HOME, CONTACTING PARENTS. THEY'RE USING THE PHONES, THEY'RE TIED UP WITH CHILDREN TRYING TO REACH FAMILIES. CHILDREN NEEDS THE SENSE OF SECURITY, TOO, THAT THEY'RE TALKING TO A VOICE THAT IS PROTECTIVE IN THEIR LIFE.

Mary says THANK YOU VERY MUCH, BEVERLY, FOR TALKING TO US. BEVERLY IS THE CO-FOUNDER OF THE PARENT EDUCATION NETWORK, AND WE ALSO HAVE A Dr. RICHARD MEAN ON THE LINE. Dr. MEAN IS A PSYCHIATRIST AND HE JUST FINISHED SPEAKING TO A GROUP OF CHILDREN ABOUT THIS TRAGEDY IN THE UNITED STATES. Dr. MEAN, ARE YOU THERE?

The Caller says I'M HERE, YES.

Mary says HI, THANKS FOR JOINING US.

The Caller says THANK YOU.

Mary says WHAT HAPPENED IN YOUR DISCUSSION WITH THOSE CHILDREN?

The caption changes to "On the phone: Doctor Richard Meen. Child Psychiatrist."

The Caller says WELL, THIS WAS IN A FACILITY WHERE THERE ARE YOUNG ADOLESCENTS AND I MET WITH THEM FOR LUNCH. THEY DID NOT KNOW ABOUT THE CRISIS AND THE CATASTROPHE AND SO WE WANTED TO PREPARE THEM BEFORE THEY TURNED ON THE TELEVISION. FIRST THEY OF COURSE WERE IN SHOCK AND DIDN'T REALLY IMPACT THEIR LIVES BECAUSE IT WAS SO FAR AWAY, BUT THEN WITH DISCUSSION, THEY RECOGNIZED THAT PERHAPS IT COULD BECAUSE TORONTO IS NOT FAR AWAY AND THEY'D HEARD THAT THE CNE TOWER WAS GOING TO BE EVACUATED AND THE PLANES WERE COMING TO TORONTO, AND THEY WERE CLOSE TO IT. I CAN'T HEAR YOU, I'M SORRY.

Mary says Dr. MEAN, WHAT CAN PARENTS EXPECT TONIGHT AT THE DINNER TABLE? THIS WILL BE A SOURCE OF DISCUSSION FOR MANY, MANY FAMILIES. WHAT KIND OF REACTIONS CAN PARENTS EXPECT FROM CHILDREN?

The Caller says WELL, I THINK THAT IT DEPENDS ON THE INDIVIDUAL CHILD, OF COURSE, AND WHAT THEIR LIVES HAVE BEEN LIKE THEMSELVES. IN CANADA, A LOT OF OUR CHILDREN HAVE BEEN KEPT AWAY IN SUCH HORROR STORIES, BUT WE HAVE SOME YOUTH HERE THAT ARE REFUGEES AND SO THEY'VE EXPERIENCED EVENTS LIKE THIS. SO IT WILL DEPEND ON THE INDIVIDUAL CHILD EXPERIENCES IN LIFE. AND ALSO THE PARENTS' LIFE EXPERIENCES, I MEAN, LOTS OF GHOSTS WILL BE SURFACING FOR MANY, MANY PARENTS.

Mary says DO YOU THINK IT'S BETTER FOR PARENTS TO BE OPEN IF THEIR CHILD DOES BRING UP THE ISSUES?

The Caller says ABSOLUTELY, IN THIS DAY AND AGE BECAUSE OF THE MEDIA AND IT'S SO READILY AVAILABLE, IT'S IMPOSSIBLE FOR CHILDREN AND YOUTH NOT TO HAVE THIS INFORMATION AND I THINK IT'S MUCH BETTER TO PUT THE CARDS ON THE TABLE AND DEAL WITH THEM AS HONEST FLEE AS POSSIBLE.

Mary says BUT THAT BEING SAID, I THINK THERE IS A CONSTANT WORRY OF PARENTS, OF GIVING TOO MUCH INFORMATION. HOW DO WE KNOW?

The Caller says YES, I MEAN, I THINK ONE HAS TO LISTEN TO CHILDREN. I SPEND MOST OF MY TIME LISTENING TO THEM AND THEN ADJUSTING ACCORDING TO WHAT I'M HEARING FROM THEM. THIS IS A TIME TO HEAR RATHER THAN RUSH IN AND MAKE JUDGMENT CALLS.

Mary says THANKS VERY MUCH FOR TALKING TO US, Dr. MEAN.

The Caller says THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

Mary says Dr. RICHARD MEAN IS A PSYCHIATRIST. CHRIS, JUST GETTING BACK AGAIN TO THE UNFOLDING STORY AS IT'S HAPPENING RIGHT NOW, WHAT ABOUT OTHER COUNTRIES? WHAT DO YOU EXPECT WILL HAPPEN NOW WITH OTHER COUNTRIES ADDRESSING THIS SITUATION?

Chris says WELL, THERE ARE OTHER COUNTRIES THAT HAVE MORE SEVERE SECURITY AT AIRPORTS THAN THE UNITED STATES, AND THERE'S QUITE A NUMBER OF COUNTRIES THAT HAVE VIRTUALLY NO SECURITY IN AIRPORTS, I YOU TRAVEL A LOT, YOU'LL SEE. I THINK THAT... YOU KNOW, NORMALLY SECURITY MEASURES INCREASE PROPORTIONATELY TO THE SERIOUSNESS OF THE EVENT BUT THAT'S ALWAYS AFTER THE EVENT, YOU KNOW, SO NOW SECURITY MEASURES WILL BE VERY HIGH, AND SO THE THE INTERNATIONAL AIR TRANSPORT ASSOCIATION WILL PROBABLY RAISE THE LEVELS OF SECURITY AT OTHER AIR PORTS OR THE F.A.A. WILL SAY THAT ONLY CERTAIN... ONLY COUNTRIES THAT HAVE A CERTAIN LEVEL OF SECURITY CAN FLY INTO THE UNITED STATES, ALTHOUGH THE SECURITY ISSUE ON THIS IS IN THE UNITED STATES AND IT'S BEEN DEMONSTRATED OFTEN MANY OCCASIONS IN... ON MANY OCCASIONS IN OTHER COUNTRIES THE PROBLEMS WITH SECURITY AT AIRPORTS, AND OBVIOUSLY THE SECURITY AT THIS ONE PARTICULAR AIRPORT HAS BEEN SUBVERTED IN SOME FASHION AND I THINK IT'S PRETTY OBVIOUS THAT THEY MAY HAVE HAD A CONFEDERATE, YOU KNOW WORKING AT THE AIRPORT TO BE ABLE TO BYPASS SECURITY IF IN FACT THEY GOT WEAPONS ON THE PLANES, WHICH I ASSUME THEY DID.

Mary says WE HAVE A QUESTION ON SECURITY FROM ONE OF OUR VIEWERS. MONICA IS CALLING FROM TORONTO. HELLO, MONICA? HI, ARE YOU THERE? OKAY. WE'LL TRY TO CATCH MONICA LATER. LET ME TURN OVER TO JOSEPH. WHAT WOULD BE YOUR PERSPECTIVE ON THIS AND THE RESPONSE OF OTHER COUNTRIES TO THIS KINDS OF EVENT?

Joseph says I'M SURPRISED AS CHRIS SAYS, HE PROBABLY KNOWS THIS BETTER THAN I DO BUT HE SAYS THAT AMERICAN SECURITY AT AIRPORTS IS NOT AS GOOD AS IT IS IN OTHER PLACES. ONE WOULD THINK THAT THE UNITED STATES GIVEN THAT THEY'VE HAD SOME EXPERIENCE WITH TERRORIST PROBLEMS WOULD HAVE PRETTY SOPHISTICATED SECURITY ARRANGEMENTS.

Chris says PLACES LIKE COLUMBIA, FOR EXAMPLE, WHERE THEY HAVE HUGE PROBLEMS, BODY SEARCH AND HAND SEARCH OF YOUR LUGGAGE AND THEY SEARCH YOU SEVEN, EIGHT TIMES AND STICKER YOUR PASS PART, YOUR BOARDING PASS, COMPARE THE TWO. IN THE UNITED STATES, YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE A BOARDING PASS TO GET THROUGH SECURITY AT AN AIRPORT, ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS WALK THROUGH AND PASS, WHEREAS HERE IN CANADA YOU HAVE TO SHOW YOUR BOARDING PASS TO THE SECURITY GUARD. IN MOST U.S. AIRPORTS, THEY SEE YOU RIGHT UP TO THE DOOR OF THE PLANE. THAT WILL CHANGE. NOT THAT IT WILL MAKE A DIFFERENCE ON SOMETHING LIKE THIS, BUILT THAT WILL CHANGE.

Mary says JOS RECEIVE, WERE YOU GOING TO ADD SOMETHING ELSE?

Joseph says NO, NOT AT THIS POINT.

Mary says I THINK WE'VE GOT MONICA CALLING FROM TORONTO. HELLO, MONICA. DO YOU HAVE A QUESTION?

The Caller says YES, I DO. THIS KIND OF ACT JUST MAKES ME SO ANGRY. I MEAN, WHY CAN'T YOU STOP TERRORIST FROM BOARDING AIRLINES IN THE FIRST PLACE? HOW IS IT POSSIBLE THAT TERRORISTS CAN BOARD A PLANE WITH AMMUNITION? IT JUST REALLY JUST MAKES ME SO ANGRY. I'M AFRAID TO FLY ON PLANES NOW.

Mary says LET ME TURN OVER BACK TO CHRIS THAT QUESTION.

Chris says HOW DOES A TERRORIST OR ANY KIND OF BAD GUY GET ON A PLANE WITH AMMUNITION AND GUNS? WELL, OBVIOUSLY, SOMEHOW THEY CIRCUMVENTED THE SECURITY AT THE AIRPORT AND THERE ARE PLENTY OF WAYS TO DO THAT. THE B.B.C. DID A LITTLE EXPERIMENT, I BELIEVE IT WAS B.B.C. OR MAYBE OF THE PAPERS IN THE U.K. SEVERAL YEARS AGO WHERE USING FALSE NAMES, THIS THEA EMPLOYED FOR JOBS AT HEATHROW AND I THINK WITHIN TWO WEEKS OF GETTING THEIR JOBS, AND THESE FALSE NAMES, THEY WERE CLEANING THE EL-AL AIRCRAFT AT HEATHROW AND THEY ARE IDENTITIES WERE COMPLETE CON THRIVE ADVANCES AND IT WAS A HUGE SECURITY BREACH AND THEY MADE OH MOVES TO MAKE SURE THAT DOESN'T HAPPEN. I WAS INVOLVED IN MANY... MANY VISIONS INVOLVING DRUG TRAFFICKING AND IF YOU GO TO AIRPORTS, YOU NOTICE PEOPLE WEAR I.D. BADGES. THOSE BADGES GET LOST AND IF YOU LOSE YOUR BADGE, THEN YOU HAVE TO GO AND GET A NEW ONE AND THERE'S NOT... WHAT ARE YOU SUPPOSED TO DO TO FIND THE NEW BADGE AND THE PICTURES ARE THE SIZE OF A POSTAGE STAMP, YOU CAN'T SEE THAT'S THE RIGHT GUY.

Mary says THIS SOUNDS LIKE CARELESSNESS TO ME, THOUGH, SLOPPINESS.

Chris says WE LIVE IN A FREE SOCIETY. YOU LOSE YOUR I.D. BADGE, YOU'RE FIRED. THAT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN, YOU GO TO THE UNION AND COMPLAINED, GO TO THE BOARD AND COMPLAIN, THAT WON'T HAPPEN.

Mary says YOU SAID THERE ARE A NUMBER OF WAYS THAT SOMEONE CAN GET ON BOARDS AND BRING AMMUNITION, A NUMBER OF WAYS. ARE THEY IMPOSSIBLE TO FIX?

Chris says YOU KNOW, TO TELL YOU THE TRUTH IN A PUBLIC FORUM LIKE THIS, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S APPROPRIATE TO TALK ABOUT THE ACTUAL TECHNIQUES.

Mary says NO, NOT SPECIFICS, BUT...

Chris says THERE ARE STEPS YOU CAN TAKE BUT PEOPLE HAVE TO BE PREPARED BECAUSE ALL OF US, WE DON'T CARRY GUNS ON TO AIRCRAFT SO ARE WE READY TO GO THROUGH THE SECURITY MEASURES AND THE RESTRICTION ON OUR MOVEMENT THAT WILL PREVENT GUNS FROM GETTING ON PLANES. I CAN DESIGN A SECURITY SYSTEM THAT WILL PREVENT ANYONE FROM GETTING ON A MEN WITH A GUN BUT NO ONE IS GOING TO WANT TO TRAVEL IF THEY HAVE TO GO THROUGH IT. YOU KNOW, SECURITY ONLY GOES TO THE LEVEL THAT WE WILL ACCEPT. WOULD YOU ACCEPT ME STOPPING YOU ON THE STREET AND SAYING WHO ARE YOU, WHERE ARE YOU GOING, WHY ARE YOU GOING THERE? YOU'RE FROM CANADA, YOU WON'T PUT UP WITH THAT. SO WE... YOU KNOW, WE'LL ONLY TAKE SO MUCH AND IT DOESN'T MATTER IF I IMPORTUNE ON THE STREET AND SAY WE'VE HAD SOME TERRORIST ACTIVITIES, AND YOU SAY I'M NOT A TERRORIST, DON'T BOTHER ME. BUT THE BAR WILL RAISE, IT WILL RISE AND THEN FALL AND LEVEL OUT AT THE LEVEL THAT WE'RE PREPARED TO ACCEPT AND THAT APPLIES TO EVERYTHING IN SOCIETY. YOU KNOW, WE LIVE IN A DEMOCRACY WE'LL VOTE FOR THE PEOPLE WHO SAY WE'RE GOING TO DO THIS AND WE AGREE WITH THAT SO WE'LL VOTE FOR THEM.

Mary says HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THAT, JOSEPH?

Joseph says I AGREE. I DON'T THINK YOU CAN GUARANTEE ABSOLUTE SECURITY IN AN OPEN SOCIETY. PEOPLE HAVE FREEDOM OF MOVEMENT AND FREEDOM OF EXPRESSION, FREEDOM OF ALL SORTS OF THINGS, RIGHT, AND TO WHAT EXTENT YOU CAN CURTAIL THESE THINGS IN ORDER TO PROVIDE SECURITY IS A VERY DIFFICULT QUESTION. I'LL BE CURIOUS TO SEE WHAT THE... WHAT HAPPENS IN THE U.S. AS A RESULT OF THIS. MY GREAT FEAR IS THEY'LL START LURCHING IN SOME AUTHORITARIAN DIRECTION AND START BREG IN REALLY DRACONIAN MEASURES TO PROTECT THEMSELVES AGAINST A THREAT THAT THEY CAN'T PROTECT THEMSELVES AGAINST ANYWAY.

Chris says ONE THING THAT SOME OF THE AIRLINES HAVE BEEN TOYING WITH, ONE IDEA, IS ISOLATING THE FLIGHT DECK FROM THE REST OF THE PLANE. I THINK EL-AL HAVE SOME AIRCRAFT WITH THAT, WHERE YOU HAVE NO ACCESS TO THE FLIGHT CREW. THEY HAVE THEIR OWN DOOR AND THERE IS A BULKHEAD IN BETWEEN, THE IDEA BEING THAT THEY CAN'T GET AT THE PILOT, CAN'T PUT A GUN TO HIS HEAD OR PUT A GUN TO THE STEWARDESSES HEAD.

Mary says NO MORE OF THE FRIENDLY ATMOSPHERE OF BRINGING THE KIDS UP TO THE PILOT.

Chris says YOU DON'T SEE THAT TOO MUCH ANYMORE, BUT AT ONE TIME IT WAS QUITE COMMON, BUT I THINK THAT WILL PROBABLY BE ONE MEASURE THAT WILL BE LEGISLATED BEFORE TOO LONG, THE POINT BEING THAT THEY SHOULD HAVE LEGISLATED THAT BEFORE BUT IT COSTS MONEY TO DO THAT. YOU HAVE TO REFIT ALL THE PLANES AND, YOU KNOW, THERE'S SOME DESIGN AND STRUCTURE ISSUES THAT HAVE TO BE DEALT WITH AND IT COSTS MONEY.

Mary says ABSOLUTELY. I'VE BEEN GIVEN SOME NEWS. APPARENTLY THERE ARE 200 FIRE FIGHTERS WHO ARE MISSING FROM THE WORLD TRADE CENTRE. HERE IN TORONTO, THE CN TOWER HAS BEEN CLOSED. EARLIER ON, THE FINANCIAL DISTRICT AROUND THE U.S. EMBASSY WAS ALSO EVACUATED FOR SAFETY REASONS. PREMIER HARRIS HAS MADE A STATEMENT, HE'S OFFERING AID AND ASSISTANCE TO NEW YORK AND ESSEN COURAGING PEOPLE HERE TO GIVE BLOOD, AND LET'S GO TO ANOTHER CALLER ON THE LOAN. WE'VE GOT JULIE FROM OWEN SOUND. HELLO, JULIE. DO YOU HAVE A COMMENT OR A QUESTION?

The Caller says I HAVE A COMMENT AND IT MAY SEEM SUCH A SELFISH THING TO SAY BUT TO ALL THE PEOPLE IN CANADA WHO HAVE LOST FAITH IN CANADA, AND SAY WE SHOULD JUST GIVE IN AND JOIN THE STATES, IT'S NO LONGER A COUNTRY WORTH LIVING IN OUR DOLLAR HAS GONE DOWN, WE WOULD THEN BECOME A PART OF THESE HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE ACTS, WHERE NOW WE CAN REMAIN A NEUTRAL AND HELPFUL COUNTRY. WE CAN OFFER ASSISTANCE TO THESE PEOPLE, WE CAN STAY OUT OF THE LINE OF FIRE, AS IT WERE, BUT TO JOIN THE STATES, WE WOULD THEN BECOME JUST ANOTHER MAJOR CENTRE. AND I HOPE THAT ANYONE WHO EVER THOUGHT WE SHOULD JUST JOIN THE STATES WOULD THEN THINK AGAIN AND BE HAPPY TO BE IN A WONDERFUL AND PEACEFUL, FREE CANADA.

Mary says THANKS, JULIE. JOSEPH, IS THAT REALITY OR IDEAL WHAT JULIE IS SAYING?

Joseph says WELL, NO, I THINK SHE HAS A VALID POINT. WELL, FIRST OF ALL, I DON'T THINK THAT MOST CANADIANS WANT TO BECOME AMERICANS, I THINK THERE WAS A RECENT SURVEY THAT WAS PUBLISHED THAT SHOWS SOMETHING LIKE 77 percent OF CANADA YNS DON'T WANT TO BE AMERICANS. I THINK WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN CANADA IN TERMS OF THIS PUSH TO AMERICANIZE US IS VERY MUCH KIND OF A... PAR SHALLLY CREATED BY THE RIGHT WING PRESS IN THIS COUNTRY THAT'S PUSHING FOR UNIFIED DOLLAR AND ECONOMIC INTEGRATION AND SORT OF A BLENDING OF US AND THE AMERICANS BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY FOR THEM, IT SERVES THEIR ECONOMIC INTERESTS. BUT MOST CANADIANS I DON'T THINK REALLY WANT TO GO THAT WAY, AND I THINK SHE'S RIGHT TO THE EXTENT THAT THE FACT THAT WE ARE A SEPARATE COUNTRY AND THE FACT THAT WE DO TAKE A DIFFERENT POSITION FROM THE AMERICANS ON A LOT OF ISSUES, GOING ALL THE WAY BACK TO THE, YOU KNOW, RECOGNITION OF COMMUNIST CHINA AND MUCH MORE POSITIVE RELATIONSHIP WITH CUBA THAN THE AMERICANS MUCH. THAT GIVES US A CERTAIN CREDIBILITY IN MAN PARTS OF THE DEVELOPING WORLD THAT WE WOULDN'T OTHERWISE HAVE. SO WE ARE SEEN AS... YOU KNOW, WE ARE SEEN AS WHITE NORTH AMERICANS, WHITE CAPITALISTS NORTH AMERICANS, BUT OF A DIFFERENT SORT, WITH A DIFFERENT SET OF VALUES. YES, I THINK IF YOU JOIN THE UNITED STATES, YOU WOULD JUST BE ANOTHER AMERICAN AND QUITE CONCEIVABLY IN THE FUTURE, ANOTHER TARGET.

Mary says BUT ISN'T IT A VERY DIFFICULT BALANCE? HOW NEUTRAL, REALLY, CAN WE STAY?

Joseph says NOT VERY, BUT WE CERTAINLY CAN CARVE OUT A POSITION FOR OURSELVES AND AS I SAID, WE HAVE. WE'VE TAKEN INITIATIVES THAT HAVE BEEN DIFFERENT FROM THAT OF THE UNITED STATES, AS I SAID, WITH CHINA, WITH CUBA, WITH GLOBAL ENVIRONMENTAL PROBLEMS, YOU KNOW, WE HAVEN'T DROPPED OUT OF THE KEY VOTE TO AGREEMENT. WE PRESENT OURSELVES DIFFERENTLY THAN THEY DO TO THE GLOBAL COMMUNITY. WE ENGAGE IN PEACEKEEPING RATHER THAN PLAYING A MUCH MORE AGGRESSIVE, GLOBAL ROLE. OBVIOUSLY WE COULDN'T PLAY THE ROLE ANYWAY BECAUSE WE DON'T FIND SAME KINDS OF NEFRTSZ, BUT NEVERTHELESS, THE PERCEPTION OUTS THERE IS WE ARE... ALMOST A CLICH A, A KINDER, GENTLER VERSION OF THEM.

Mary says WHAT DO YOU THINK, CHRIS?

Chris says WELL, I AGREE TO MOST OF THE POINTS. HOWEVER, ALL I HAVE TO SAY IS WE'RE NORTH AMERICAN CITIZENS NOW, AS FAR AS THE WORLD IS CONCERNED AND WE HAVE TO BE PREPARED TO DEAL WITH THE IMPACTS OF THESE KINDS OF ACTIVITIES, AND CANADA HAS TOO LONG BEEN THE PLAYGROUND OF CLIMB á CRIMINALS AND TERRORISTS ET CETERA, USING THIS AS A BASE OF OPERATIONS FOR DEALING WITH OTHER COUNTRIES AND I THINK WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH THAT ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO TAKE A STAND ON SOME ISSUES THAT WE HAVEN'T TAKEN A STAND ON IN THE PAST. AT THIS POINT, I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, SPECIFIC TO THE CALLER, ALL DUE RESPECT TO THE CALLER, I THINK THIS IS... YOU DON'T WANT TO POLITICIZE THIS STUFF, MAKE ANY HAY OFF THIS STUFF RIGHT NOW. THIS IS A BAD, TERRIBLE THING THAT'S HAPPENED AND MAYBE AT A LATER TIME WE MIGHT WANT TO DISCUSS WHETHER WE BECOME PART OF THE UNITED STATES OR NOT, BUT NOT RIGHT NOW.

Mary says LET'S GO TO ANOTHER CALL FROM GORDON. HELLO, GORDON.

The Caller says HELLO.

Mary says HI, GOOD AHEAD.

The Caller says MY COMMENT IS, I THINK ITS AI A GROUP WITHIN THE UNITED STATES ITSELF THAT DONE THIS. I DON'T THINK IT'S A FOREIGN ORGANIZATION THAT PLANNED THIS, I THINK IT'S A GROUP WITHIN THE UNITED STATES, LIKE A MILITIA STYLE GROUP THAT SET THIS UP, THAT IS REALLY ANGRY WITH THE GOVERNMENT OF THE UNITED STATES. IT REMINDS ME OF TIMOTHY McVEIGH STYLE EXECUTION OF PEOPLE.

Mary says AT THIS POINT, NO ORGANIZATION HAS BEEN NAMED BUT JOSEPH, CAN YOU COMMENT ON THIS? IS IT LIKELY, COULD IT POSSIBLY BE A DOMESTIC SITUATION?

Joseph says WELL, IT'S POSSIBLE, BECAUSE CLEARLY, I MEAN, DOMESTIC GROUPS HAVE SHOWN THAT THEY COULD HAVE A BIG IMPACT WITH THE OKLAHOMA BOMBING. THAT WAS A MAJOR TERRORIST ACT. I DON'T KNOW IF THEY HAVE THE RESOURCES OR THE CAPABILITY TO PULL SOMETHING OFF ON THIS SCALE. THIS IS MUCH MORE SOPHISTICATED THAN PLANNING A... PLANTING A CAR IN FRONT OF THE OKLAHOMA BUILDING. SO I WOULD TEND TO THINK THAT IT'S NOT A DOMESTIC GROUP, BUT, I MEAN, YOU KNOW, I COULD BE WRONG BUT, I MEAN, MY SENSE IS THAT IT'S PROBABLY SOMEBODY WITH AN AWFUL LOT MORE CLOUT THAN THE SMALL MILITIA GROUPS RUNNING AROUND THE UNITED STATES.

Mary says GIVEN HOW MUCH WE KNOW AT THIS POINT, WHAT WOULD BE YOUR GREATEST WORRY RIGHT NOW?

Joseph says WELL, WHEN I WAS ASKED TO DO THIS TODAY, I THOUGHT WHAT COULD I SAY THAT COULD BE INTERESTING AND ONE OF THE THOUGHTS THAT CAME ACROSS MY MIND IS THIS. MY FEAR IS THAT THIS MAY BE THE BEGINNING RATHER THAN THE END, IN THE SENSE THAT GROUPS AROUND THE WORLD WILL NOW LOOK AT THIS AND SAY, WELL, THE AMERICANS CAN BE HIT RIGHT IN THE CENTRE OF THINGS AND IN A SENSE, THERE IS A PSYCHOLOGICAL THRESHOLD THAT IS CROSSED, I THINK, ONCE A GROUP OR AN ORGANIZATION REALIZES THEY CAN DO SOMETHING THEY NEVER THOUGHT THEY COULD DO BEFORE. DON'T FORGET, THE WEAPONRY AND COMMUNICATION SYSTEMS, THE TECHNOLOGY IS GETTING SO MUCH MORE SOPHISTICATED EVERY YEAR THAT IT CREATES AN INTERESTING PARADOX IN TERMS OF POWER. THE UNITED STATES IS BY FAR THE MOST POWERFUL COUNTRY IN THE WORLD, HAS BY FAR THE MOST SOPHISTICATED AND MOST POWERFUL WEAPONS AND THE MORE WEAPONS THAN ANYBODY ELSE, BUT THAT SAME TECHNOLOGY HAS ALLOWED A KIND OF EMPOWERMENT OF SMALL GROUPS BECAUSE THE SMALL GROUPS THEMSELVES HAVE ACCESS TO MINIATURIZED WEAPONS AND ALL KINDS OF... YOU COULD DROP CHEMICAL WEAPONS, BIOLOGICAL WEAPONS VERY EASILY IN THE MIDDLE OF A LARGE POPULATED AREA. THE TECHNOLOGY THAT EMPOWERS THE UNITED STATES, ALSO EMPOWERS ITS ENEMIES, AND AS I SAID, THIS MAY NOT BE THE END OF THINGS. THIS COULD EASILY BE THE BEGINNING OF THINGS.

Mary says SO YOU'RE SAYING, THEN, THIS IS A PRECEDENT IN A SENSE AND COULD GIVE A KIND OF A PSYCHOLOGICAL EDGE TO OTHER GROUPS.

Joseph says WELL, IT WILL CERTAINLY GIVE A PSYCHOLOGICAL GROUP TO, OBVIOUSLY, WHOEVER DID THIS, WHOEVER IS SYMPATHETIC TO THIS. WE'LL SEE... YOU KNOW, WE'LL SEE THAT THE GREATEST POWER IN THE WORLD CAN BE LITERALLY BROUGHT TO ITS KNEES ALMOST.

Mary says WHAT DO YOU THINK, CHRIS, COULD THIS BE INCENTIVE TO OTHER GROUPS?

Chris says WELL, I DON'T KNOW ABOUT INCENTIVE. THE FIRST CAMPER SAID A DOMESTIC TERRORIST GROUP AND I STRONGLY DOUBT IT IS, AND THE REASON I SAY THAT, MOST OF THOSE GROUPS HAVE PRETTY WELL BEEN DISMANTLED BY THE FBI AND THAT APPLIES TO THE MIDDLE EAST AND PALESTINIAN GROUPS BECAUSE THEY'RE ALL SPLINTERED AND BEEN PEN STRAIGHTED BY THE ISRAELIS, SO IF SOMETHING LIKE THIS WAS GOING TO HAPPEN, I DON'T KNOW. IS THIS GOING TO OPEN THE DOOR? I THINK THERE IS A PSYCHOLOGICAL THRESHOLD THAT'S BEEN PASSED. I AGREE. I THINK PEOPLE WILL NOW SAY, MAYBE WE CAN DO THIS. THIS IS A HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE TRAGEDY BUT IT WOULD PALE IN COMPARISON TO A BIOLOGICAL OR CHEMICAL ATTACK ON THE UNITED STATES WHICH WOULD KILL TENS OF MILLIONS OF PEOPLE.

Mary says BECAUSE YOU MENTION THAT, LET ME MENTION AND BRING UP THE FACTS THAT THE CENTRES FOR DISEASE CONTROL IN ATLANTA WAS SENDING OUT BIO TERRORISM EXPERTS, JUST AS A SAFETY PRECAUTION.

Chris says THAT WOULD BE PART OF THE FEMA, EMERGENCY MEASURES AGENCY, IN ANY LARGE DISASTER, THEY SENDS OUT PEOPLE, PLUS THEY DO RANSOM DOM SAMPLING ALL THE TIME. THE PROTECTION OF THE COUNTRY LIKE THE UNITED STATES IS VERY COMPLEX AND ONE OF THE THINGS WOULD BE THAT MONITORING CONSTANTLY FOR BIOHAZARDS, BOTH REGULAR, NATURAL BIOHAZARDS AND ONES THAT ARE MANMADE, SO THAT WOULD BE A NORMAL PART OF IT. BUT THIS COULD... DEPENDING ON THE U.S. RESPONSE TO THIS, AND IT WILL HAVE TO BE DONE WITH A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF FINESSE, IT COULD VERY WELL OPEN THE DOOR TO OTHER ACTIVITIES, YOU KNOW, OTHER KINDS OF BAD THINGS HAPPENING.

Mary says WELL, THERE IS A SENSE, I MEAN, FROM WHAT THE EXPERTS ARE SAYING THAT THERE WILL BE MORE ATTACKS.

Chris says I DON'T THINK IT'S OVER YET.

Mary says IS THAT YOUR FEELING, AS WELL, JOSEPH?

Joseph says I DON'T THINK IT'S OVER. I'M NOT SURE IF THERE WILL BE MORE ATTACK IN THE SHORT TERM BUT I THINK IN THE FUTURE THERE INEFFORTABLELY WILL BE FOR THE SIMPLE REASON, LIKE I SAID EARLIER, THE UNITED STATES IS THE PREEMINENT POWER IN THE WORLD. THE UNITED STATES HAS A LOT OF ENEMIES. THE ENEMIES OF THE UNITED STATES MANTSZ HAVE THE RESOURCES OF THE UNITED STATES BUT THEY HAVE ENOUGH á ENOUGH RESOURCES TO MAKE THE UNITED STATES... HURT THE UNITED STATES IN CERTAIN POINTS IN HISTORY.

Mary says LET'S TRY TO GET IN ONE MORE CALL. WE'VE GOT NICK LA WHO'S CALLING FROM TORONTO. HELLO, NICOLA. DO YOU HAVE A QUESTION?

The Caller says YES, I DO. THE QUESTION IS FOR THE PROFESSOR. I'M WONDERING WHETHER OR NOT THE... BUSH'S ADMINISTRATION LACK OF RESPONSE TO THE CRISIS IN THE MIDDLE EAST IS ACTUALLY A CONTRIBUTING FACTOR TO THE CURRENT EVENTS OF TODAY?

Joseph says WELL, I'M SURE IT'S A FACTOR, YOU'LL NOT SURE IF IT'S A DECISIVE FACTOR. AN EVENT OF THIS SORT IS THE RESULT OF A CUMULATIVE PROCESS BUT THE AMERICAN POSITION ON THE MIDDLE EAST AND THE AMERICAN... MAYBE THE EXCEEDINGLY UNCRITICAL SUPPORT FOR ISRAEL ON MANY MIDDLE EASTERN ISSUES NO DOUBT AIL NATURES MANY PLAYERS IN THE MIDDLE EAST AND IT CERTAINLY IS A FACTOR. I'M NOT SURE WHETHER IT'S A DESIZE IRV FACTOR. THE MIDDLE EAST PEACE PROCESS AND THE CONFLICT HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR AN AWFULLY LONG TIME AND ODDLY ENOUGH, IN RECENT YEARS, IT SEEMS TO HAVE BEEN CLOSER TO A SOLUTION THAN IN THE PAST.

Mary says A COMPLICATED ISSUE AND ANSWER. THANK YOU SO MUCH TO BOTH OF YOU FOR COMING and THANKS TO OUR VIEWERS FOR CALLING IN. WE'RE RUNNING OUT OF TIME. JOSEPH IS A RYERSON UNIVERSITY PROFESSOR AND CHRIS IS WITH THE RCMP.
Thank you so much for watching. We'll see you tomorrow at More to Life at 1.

Watch: World Trade Centre - Pentagon - Terrorism