Transcript: Sex and Relationships | Feb 14, 2001

The opening sequence shows a wooden table with a small lit candle as several words fly by: Nutrition, medicine, prevention, treatment, health.
Fast clips show different sets of hands performing activities on a table such as pulling petals from a daisy, drawing a big red heart, tuning a violin, flipping through the pages of a book, cooking, and pouring a glass of red wine.
In animation, the title appears inside the shape of a house: “More to life.”

Maureen Taylor sits in the studio. She is in her late thirties, with wavy brown hair in a bob. She’s wearing a blue blazer and a black turtleneck.

Maureen says COMMUNICATION BREAKDOWN AND
CHANGES IN SEX DRIVE CAN PUT
A DAMPER ON EVEN THE
PAPPIEST OF UNIONS.
TODAY WE'RE GOING TO TAKE
YOUR CALLS ON SEX AND
RELATIONSHIPS.
WENDY TRAYNOR IS A SEX
THERAPIST AND JOAN SINCLAIR
DOES COUPLES AND FAMILY
THERAPY.
SO GIVE US A CALL WITH YOUR
QUESTIONS.

A caption appears on screen showing two phone numbers.

Maureen continues IN TORONTO 416-484-2727
LONG DISTANCE IS A FREE CALL
DIAL 1-888-411-1234
OR YOU CAN PUT IT ALL IN AN
E-MAIL AND SEND IT
TO MORETOLIFE AT TVO.COM
JOAN, FIRST OF
ALL, MILLIONS OF MEN ARE OUT
THERE ORDERING FLOWERS, THE
DOZEN ROSES TO SEND OVER TO
THE HONEY.
IS THAT GOING TO MAKE UP FOR
A YEAR OF NEGLECT OF A
RELATIONSHIP?

Joan is in her late forties, has short gray hair, and is wearing a brown shirt and beige trousers.
A caption reads “Joan Sinclair. Family Therapist.”

Joan says I THINK
MORE THAN THAT IT WILL
PERHAPS GIVE HOPE FOR A
FUTURE RELATIONSHIP, RATHER
THAN MAKE UP FOR THE NEGLECT
OF THE PAST.
I THINK THAT -- AND WITH THE
ROSE, PERHAPS WHAT WOULD
COMPENSATE IS SOME INTENTION,
SOME VERBAL COMMUNICATION,
EITHER IN WRITING OR THE
SPOKEN WORD TO ASSURE THAT
PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THE REAL
MESSAGE WITH THE ROSE, AS
WELL.

Maureen says YOU KNOW WHAT?
THIS TIME OF YEAR ALL THE
CARD COMPANIES AND FLORISTS
ARE TRYING TO SAY “HERE'S
WHAT SAYS LOVE.”
YOU KNOW, WHAT SAYS LOVE?
WELL CHOCOLATE AND FLOWERS.
WHAT DOES SAY LOVE TO YOU,
WENDY?
WHAT SAYS LOVE IN A
RELATIONSHIP?

Wendy is in her forties, has short brown hair, and is wearing a beige button up blouse, and glasses.
A caption reads “Wendy Trainor. Sex Therapist.”

Wendy says I THINK
WHAT SAYS LOVE IS FEELING
HEARD AND LISTENED TO, TO A
WOMAN.
FEELING LIKE SHE'S
UNDERSTOOD.
FEELING LIKE SOMEONE CARES
ABOUT HER.
SO IT'S THE LITTLE THINGS.
I THINK OFTEN MEN THINK THEY
HAVE TO DO BIG THINGS, YOU
KNOW, THE DOZEN ROSES?
WHERE I THINK A ROSE, ONE
ROSE IS OFTEN WONDERFUL.
AND MAYBE THE WOMAN DOESN'T
LIKE ROSES.
SHE PREFERS SOMETHING ELSE.
SO ASK.
LIKE THE COMMUNICATION IS
IMPORTANT TO THE WOMAN, SO
THAT IT FEELS LIKE SHE'S
SPECIAL.

Joan says AND THAT
SHE'S IDENTIFIED AS UNIQUE.
YOU KNOW, THAT HE'S NOT JUST
BUYING INTO SOME CONSUMER
APPROACH TO WHAT VALENTINE'S
IS, BUT THAT SHE'S REALLY
SOMEBODY HE KNOWS AND
UNDERSTANDS WHAT HER
SPECIFIC NEEDS ARE.
YEAH.

Maureen asks WHEN COUPLES
COME TO YOU FOR THERAPY,
WHAT ARE THE REASONS,
USUALLY?
WHY ARE THEY THERE?

Joan says UM, IT
VERY MUCH DEPENDS ON -- I'VE
NEVER SEEN TWO COUPLES THE
SAME, ACTUALLY DOM IN WITH
THE SAME SET OF NEEDS.
BUT CERTAINLY THERE ARE SOME
IDENTIFIABLE TRANSITIONS
THAT LIFE BRINGS THAT MAKE
STRESSES THAT MUCH MORE
DIFFICULT.
AND SO OFTEN IT WILL BE, YOU
KNOW, AN ADJUSTMENT TO BEING
A COUPLE FROM BEING TWO
INDIVIDUALS MOVING OUT OF
THE FAMILY HOME, FURTHER
ALONG IN THEIR FAMILY'S
DEVELOPMENT IF MIGHT BE
ADJUSTMENT TO HAVING A CHILD
IN THE FAMILY.
IT MAY BE, YOU KNOW,
ANTICIPATING A DIFFERENT
TYPE OF SEXUAL RELATIONSHIP
OR A ROMANTIC RELATIONSHIP
AND EXPECTATIONS ARE UNMET.
THAT KIND OF THING.

Maureen says WHICH IS I GUESS
WHAT YOU HEAR A LOT OF,
WENDY IN YOUR PRACTICE.
UNMET EXPECTATIONS SEXUALLY?

Wendy says THAT'S
RIGHT.
AND THAT'S WHY IT'S SO
IMPORTANT TO HAVE GOOD
COMMUNICATION.
AND A GOOD FOUNDATION TO THE
RELATIONSHIP.
A SENSE OF BEING FRIENDS AND
BEING ABLE TO EXPRESS -- A
GOOD SENSE OF SELF AND BEING
ABLE TO EXPRESS WHAT YOU
WANT AND NEED IN THE
RELATIONSHIP.
IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT.
AND THAT HELPS PEOPLE GET
OVER THESE TRANSITIONAL
PERIODS THAT JOAN'S TALKING
ABOUT.

Maureen says THE CONVENTIONAL
WISDOM IS THAT AFTER A FEW
YEARS OF MARRIAGE, A WOMAN'S
LIBIDO GOES DOWN AND THE
MAN'S IS, YOU KNOW, STILL UP
THERE.
SO HE'S OFTEN COMPLAINING
WE'RE NOT HAVING SEX OFTEN
ENOUGH.
IS THAT, IS THAT A MYTH?
YOU KNOW, IS IT OFTEN THE
OTHER WAY AROUND OR WHAT DO
YOU THINK?

Joan says WELL, IT'S
BEEN MY EXPERIENCE THAT
WOMEN HAVE EQUALLY THE SAME
CONCERNS ABOUT THEIR SEXUAL
RELATIONSHIP, BUT IT'S NOT
SO MUCH THE LIBIDO AS MUCH
AS IT IS UNDERSTANDING, I
THINK, THE SPECIFIC NEEDS
AND WANTS OF THE TWO UNIQUE
PEOPLE IN THAT RELATIONSHIP.
BUT YOU PROBABLY HAVE
SOME --

Wendy says I THINK
OVER TIME, OFTEN WHAT
HAPPENS, IF PEOPLE AREN'T
COMMUNICATING WELL IS THAT
RESENTMENTS BUILD UP.
AND I MEAN, LIFE DOES
INTERVENE, OFTEN EARLY ON IN
A RELATIONSHIP.
YOU KNOW, COUPLES ARE FAIRLLY
FOOTLOOSE AND FANCY FREE.
THEN THEY MAY HAVE A CHILD,
BUY A HOUSE, HAVE MORTGAGES
TO MEET, AND SO THERE ARE A
LOT MORE PRESSURES.
AND OFTEN WOMEN FEEL THAT
THEY ARE STUCK WITH MORE OF
THE BURDEN SO, THERE'S THE
SECOND SHIFT THAT WE ALWAYS
HEAR ABOUT.
SO THEY MIGHT BE THE ONES
THAT APPEAR TO WANT SEX LESS
OFTEN, BECAUSE THEY'RE VERY
TIRED, THEY'RE FEELING
RESPONSIBLE FOR THE FAMILY.
AND SO THOSE KINDS OF ISSUES
NEED TO BE WORKED OUT.
HOW DO COUPLES BEGIN TO
SHARE AND HAVE A MORE
EQUITABLE RELATIONSHIP?
AND ALSO, HOW DO THEY LEARN
TO HAVE TOUCHSTONES WHERE
THEY HAVE DATES.
WHERE THEY HAVE TIME
TOGETHER, SO THAT THE WOMAN
FEELS SPECIAL.
BECAUSE THAT TIME THAT THEY
HAD EARLY ON IN THE
RELATIONSHIP IS OFTEN MORE
DIFFICULT TO CAPTURE.

Maureen says AND CAPTURE THE
INTIMACY AND NOT JUST THE
SEX, RIGHT?

Wendy says RIGHT.

Maureen says SO THERE'S A
DIFFERENCE.
ALL RIGHT, WE'RE TALKING
ABOUT SEX IN RELATIONSHIPS
THIS AFTERNOON WITH WENDY
TRAINOR AND JOAN SINCLAIR
AND IT'S VALENTINE'S DAY.
A GOOD DAY TO TALK ABOUT
THIS STUFF.
IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION, NEED
SOME ADVICE, CALL US

A caption appears on screen showing two phone numbers.

Maureen continues IN TORONTO 416-484-2727
LONG DISTANCE
1-888-411-1234 OR
E-MAIL IT TO
MORETOLIFE AT TVO.COM
AND WE'LL GO TO
HEATHER FIRST IN
COLLINGWOOD.
HI HEATHER.

Heather says HI.
I HAVE A QUESTION, AND
ACTUALLY I'VE BEEN LISTENING
TO THE SHOW AND A LOT OF
WHAT YOU'RE SAYING RELATES
TO A LOT OF HOW MY MARRIAGE
IS.
WE HAVE BEEN MARRIED FOR TWO
YEARS.
WE HAVE TWO SMALL CHILDREN,
AND WE DON'T HAVE MUCH MORE
COMMUNICATION, BUT I DON'T
REALLY HAVE THE TIME TO HAVE
INTIMACY OR A SEXUAL LIFE
WITH MY HUSBAND ANYMORE.
I'M JUST --
AND HE STILL WANTS ONE, BUT
I DON'T HAVE TIME.

Maureen says YEAH.
SO YOU'RE EXHAUSTED AT THE
END OF THE DAY.

Heather says OH, YEAH.

Maureen asks HOW OLD YOUR
KIDS?
THEY SOUND SMALL?

Heather says I HAVE TWO AND A
HALF-YEAR-OLD AND A SEVEN
MONTH.

Maureen says AH!
OKAY.
IS THIS COMMON IN YOUR
PRACTICE, JOAN?

Joan says ABSOLUTELY,
AND I THINK -- CERTAINLY
TIME IS A MAJOR FACTOR, BUT
I THINK, TOO, THAT
EXHAUSTION, AS YOU SUGGEST,
HER DAY DOESN'T END, BEGIN
AT NINE AND END AT FIVE.
CLEARLY WHEN YOU'VE GOT A
SEVEN MONTH OLD WHO PERHAPS
MAY BE NURSING AND WILL --
SHE'LL HAVE A LOT OF
PHYSICAL TOUCHING ALREADY,
NOT IMPOSED ON HER, BUT
CERTAINLY TO SATISFY SOME OF
HER PHYSICAL NEEDS AS WELL,
EVEN THOUGH THEY MAY NOT BE
SEXUAL, I THINK THAT A LOT
OF TIMES THAT WOMEN ARE
SATIATED BY THE TIME THEIR
DAY IS OVER WITH.
AND PERHAPS MORE THAN
ANYTHING NEED SOME SPACE.
NEED SOME REST.
AND NEED SOME
ACKNOWLEDGEMENT ABOUT BEING
MORE THAN A DOMESTIC
CREATURE.

Maureen says ON THE OTHER
HAND, IS IT FAIR TO YOUR
HUSBAND TO SORT OF SAY “I'M
NOT INTERESTED ENTIRELY”?
YOU KNOW, UNTIL WHEN?
WHEN THEY'RE FIVE, SIX?
WHAT DO YOU THINK?

Wendy says I THINK WHAT'S IMPORTANT
FOR THE HUSBANDS AND
PARTNERS TO UNDERSTAND IS
THAT WHEN WOMEN HAVE BEEN
GIVING ALL DAY TO THE
DEMANDS OF KIDS, THAT THEY
SOMETIMES -- SOMETIMES SEX
FEELS LIKE THEY'RE GIVING
MORE.
EVEN THOUGH, YOU KNOW, AT
ONE POINT THEY ENJOYED SEX
JUST AS MUCH AS THEIR
PARTNER.

Joan says AND WILL
AGAIN.

Wendy says YES, AND
WILL AGAIN.
SO I THINK
WHAT'S IMPORTANT IS TO
CREATE SOME SPACE WHERE
THERE'S SOME TIME FOR
NURTURING, WITHOUT THE
DEMAND FOR SEX.
SO YOU KNOW, YOU CAN ARRANGE
TO MASSAGE YOUR PARTNER, TO
SPEND TIME TOGETHER, TO
LISTEN.
SO WHETHER IT'S HAVING A
DATE OR MAYBE EVEN CREATIVELY
USING BABYSITTERS SO THAT
SOMEBODY COMES OVER THE
DINNER HOUR TO GIVE THE WIFE
A CHANCE TO RELAX A BIT.
AND SO THAT SHE FEELS GIVEN
TO, AND NURT TAURED.
AND THEN SHE CAN BEGIN TO
GIVE AGAIN IN THAT ADULT
RELATIONSHIP.
BECAUSE I'M SURE SHE MISSES
IT JUST AS MUCH AS HER
PARTNER.

Maureen says WOMEN TALK ABOUT
THESE THINGS, AND I KNOW
WOMEN WHO ARE AFRAID TO BUY
TOO SEXY A NIGHTGOWN OR EVEN
TO HUG THEIR HUSBAND AND
KISS HIM BEFORE BED BECAUSE
IMMEDIATELY THAT MAKES HIM
THINK ABOUT SEX.
AND THAT MAY NOT BE WHAT SHE
WANTED THAT NIGHT.
SHE JUST MIGHT HAVE WANTED
SORT OF THE CLOSENESS.
HOW DO YOU SAY TO YOUR
HUSBAND “IT DOESN'T ALWAYS
HAVE TO LEAD TO SEX?”

Joan says WELL, I
THINK THIS IS SOMETHING
CERTAINLY THAT WE PROBABLY
DO HEAR QUITE REGULARLY.
THAT WOMEN OFTEN ARE VERY
SATISFIED, PARTICULARLY
DURING THE STAGES OF LIFE
WHERE THEY ARE GIVING AS
MUCH AS THEY WILL TO THEIR
CHILDREN AND TO THEIR HOMES,
AS WELL AS TO THEIR OUTSIDE
WORK.
SO I THINK THAT PARTLY WHAT
WE NEED TO DO IS RECOGNIZE
THAT OUR NEEDS ARE BEING,
ARE BEING MET THROUGH THE
COMFORT OF CLOSENESS, OF
RECEIVING, AS WE UNDERSTANDY
WAS SUGGESTING, AS WELL AS
GIVING.
BUT RECEIVING FOR A WOMEN
MIGHT BE, MIGHT BE JUST
TENDERNESS.
MIGHT BE A SHOWEDDER TO LIE
ON AT NIGHT AND TO SNUGGLE
UP WITH RATHER THAN HAVING
SEXUAL INTERCOURSE.

Maureen says SOUNDS LIKE THEY
NEED TO TALK ABOUT THIS A
LITTLE MORE AND UNDERSTAND
IT'S TRANSITIONAL.

Wendy says YES, AND I
THINK ONE OF THE DIFFERENCES
BETWEEN MEN AND WOMEN IS
THAT OFTEN FOR MEN SEX IS A
WAY OF CONNECTING.
I THINK FOR WOMEN SEX IS A
WAY OF CELEBRATING THE
CONNECTION THEY FEEL.
AND SO WHAT HAPPENS IS HER
HUSBAND MAY BE JUST WANTING
TO FEEL CLOSE TO HER, AND,
YOU KNOW, SHE'S NOT READY
FOR SEX.
AND SO I THINK SOMETIMES
IT'S REALLY SITTING DOWN AND
TALKING WITH YOUR HUSBAND
ABOUT YOUR OWN NEEDS AND
WHAT IT IS YOU NEED AND
TRYING TO HELP HIM
UNDERSTAND THIS ISN'T GOING
TO BE FOREVER, BUT THAT YOU
HAVE DIFFERENT NEEDS.
WOMEN TAKE MUCH
LONGER TO GET AROUSED.
THEY NEED TO FEEL RELAXED
BEFORE THEY WANT TO BE
SEXUAL, AND THAT'S ANOTHER
DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MEN AND
WOMEN.
AND SO THAT MEN NEED TO
UNDERSTAND THAT THAT TIME IS
IMPORTANT.

Maureen says ALL RIGHT,
HEATHER, HANG IN THERE.
THANKS FOR YOUR CALL.
ANNE IS IN HAMILTON.
HI ANNE.

Anne says YES?

Maureen says HI ANNE GO,
AHEAD.

Anne says MY PROBLEM IS A
LITTLE BIT THE OPPOSITE OF
WHAT YOU'VE JUST BEEN
TALKING ABOUT.
I FIND IT'S MY HUSBAND
THAT'S NOT INTERESTED IN
HAVING SEX, AND.
MAYBE IT'S MORE RARE THAN
OTHER COUPLES, AND IT'S NOT
JUST THE ACTUAL INTERCOURSE
BUT EVEN THE INTIMACY
THINGS.
AND I WAS JUST WONDERING --
YOU KNOW, HE'S NOT THAT OLD,
HE'S ONLY 40.
I DON'T THINK I'M
UNATTRACTIVE, AND SO I'M
JUST WONDERING WHAT ISSUES
MIGHT BE UNDERNEATH THAT.

Maureen says MMM.
OKAY, JOAN FIRST AND THEN
WE'LL GO TO WENDY.

Joan says OKAY.
I WONDER IF -- HAVE THEY
TALKED ABOUT THIS?
HAS THERE BEEN ANY
COMMUNICATION BETWEEN THEM
ABOUT WHAT IS GOING ON?
WHAT KINDS OF STRESSES ARE
THEY EXPERIENCING?

Maureen says ANNE?

Anne says YES, I CAN HARDLY
HEAR YOU.

Maureen says HAVE YOU GUYS
TALKED ABOUT THIS?
IS THERE ANY EXTRA STRESS IN
THE RELATIONSHIP?

Anne says WELL, HE TALKS A
LOT ABOUT BEING TIRED FROM
WORK.
HE DOES HAVE A BIT OF A HIGH
STRESS JOB.
BUT HE ALSO TENDS TO PUT
MORE THAN 100 percent INTO IT.
SO I DON'T KNOW IF THAT
MIGHT BE THE FACTER OR --

Maureen says AND DOES HE EVER
TALK ABOUT WHY -- I MEAN,
WHEN YOU TRY TO INITIATE SEX,
WHAT'S HIS RESPONSE?

Anne says I USUALLY GET REJECTED.
LIKE HE'S JUST NOT IN THE
MOOD OR HE'S NOT -- HE
ALWAYS HAS TO BE THE ONE TO
START IT I GUESS.

Joan says SO HE'S
MORE RECEPTIVE WHEN HE
INITIATES.
IS THAT WHAT WE'RE HEARING?

Anne says I'M SORRY?

Joan repeats HE'S MORE
RECEPTIVE WHEN HE INITIATES.

Anne says RIGHT.

Joan says YEAH, SO
IS THERE -- IS THERE AN
OPPORTUNITY FOR, FOR HIM TO
DO SO?
DO YOU PERHAPS -- I THINK
MEN ALSO NEED CERTAIN
ENVIRONMENTAL THINGS TO BE
IN PLACE.
IS THE HOUSE CALM AND QUIET
FOR A PERIOD OF TIME IN THE
EVENING BEFORE YOU ACTUALLY
DO GO TO BED TOGETHER?
DOES HE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY
TO SEE YOU AS HIS LOVER, AS
WELL AS THE MOTHER OF HIS
CHILDREN?

Anne says UM, WELL, WE DO
HAVE TWO YOUNG CHILDREN, AND
BY THE TIME WE GET THEM BOTH
TO BED, HE'S READY TO CRASH.

Joan says HE'S
PRETTY POOPED.

Maureen says YEAH.
WENDY WHAT ARE YOUR
THOUGHTS?

Wendy says WELL, I
THINK IT'S GOOD TO HEAR FROM
THIS CALLER, BECAUSE I THINK
BOTH MEN AND WOMEN
EXPERIENCE SIMILAR
DIFFICULTIES IN A
RELATIONSHIP.
AND I THINK OFTEN MEN AREN'T
AS AWARE AS WOMEN OF THEIR
CONDITIONS FOR SEX.
WHAT THEY NEED.
AND IT SOUNDS LIKE, YOU KNOW
IT WOULD BE IMPORTANT TO
TALK MORE WITH YOUR HUSBAND
ABOUT THIS, AND I ALSO THINK
IF THAT DOESN'T WORK, THAT
YOU MIGHT HAVE TO GO TO
SOMEONE, TO A COUNSELLOR AND
TALK ABOUT THIS AS A COUPLE.
IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU'RE REALLY
MISSING HIM.
AND YOU'RE MISSING THE
CLOSENESS THAT SEX USED TO
BRING IN YOUR RELATIONSHIP.
AND I THINK OFTEN WHAT
HAPPENS WHEN WE HAVE THESE
KINDS OF PROBLEMS, IF WE
HAVE A BROKEN ARM, WE GO
RIGHT TO THE DOCTOR.
BUT IF WE HAVE A PROBLEM IN
OUR RELATIONSHIP, THERE'S
STILL A STIGMA ATTACHED TO
GOING TO A THERAPIST.
SO I WOULD REALLY ENCOURAGE
YOU TO GO TO YOUR DOCTOR AND
ASK FOR A REFERRAL OR TALK
TO YOUR FRIENDS, PROBABLY
SOMEONE WOULD KNOW OF
SOMEONE WHO'S GOOD IN YOUR
AREA.

Maureen says I WONDER, TOO,
IF THERE COULD BE ANOTHER
PROBLEM GOING ON THAT ISN'T
AS EVIDENT.
LIKE A DEPRESSION, EVEN,
OR --

Wendy says WELL
THAT'S WHAT I'M HEARING.
I THINK THAT'S WHY I'M
SUGGESTING A THERAPIST.
THAT MAYBE THERE'S SOMETHING
ELSE THAT NEEDS TO BE TALKED
ABOUT THAT SOMEHOW ISN'T
BEING TALKED ABOUT HERE.

Maureen says A LOT OF TIMES
THOUGH, ONE PARTNER IN THE
RELATIONSHIP IS READY TO GO
FOR COUNSELLING BECAUSE THEY
WANT TO DO ANYTHING TO SAVE,
AND THE OTHER ONE RESISTS.
JOAN, DO YOU RECOMMEND THAT
ONE THEN GO ALONE?
THE ONE WHO'S READY, JUST GO
YOURSELF?

Joan says I THINK IF
IN FACT THE OTHER PERSON IS
SO UNPREPARED TO PARTICIPATE,
THEN CLEARLY -- AND YOU'RE
NOT, YOU'RE NOT FEELING THE
COMMUNICATION IS GETTING ANY
BETTER BY ATTEMPTING ON YOUR
OWN, THEN CERTAINLY GO
ALONE.
BUT I THINK THE BEST TIME
OF -- TYPE OF THERAPY WHEN
THERE IS A COUPLE INVOLVED
IS COUPLES THERAPY.
I THINK THAT WE ARE ONE
ANOTHER'S BEST THERAPISTS,
AND THE THERAPIST THEN IS
THERE TO JUST TO FACILITATE
THE COMMUNICATION.

Maureen says I SEE.

Joan continues
ABSOLUTELY.
I THINK IT IS THE WISEST WAY
TO GO.

Maureen says ALL RIGHT.
ANNE, GOOD LUCK.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR
CALLING.
ROY IS IN BRAMPTON.
WELCOME, ROY.

Roy says HELLO, HI.

Maureen says HI.

Roy says YEAH, I JUST
TUNED INTO YOUR SHOW.
THE TONE OF THE CONVERSATION
SEEMS EXTREMELY
WOMAN-CENTRIC OR FEMALE
ORIENTED.
EVERYTHING IS ABOUT THE MAN
CHASING THE WOMAN, THE MAN
SENDING THE FLOWERS.
IS THERE -- JUST A COMMENT,
MAYBE YOUR GUESTS CAN
COMMENT ON WHAT THE WOMAN
SHOULD BE DOING FOR THE MAN.
BECAUSE OFTEN PORTRAYED AS
LECHEROUS PIG, YOU KNOW,
JUST CHASING AFTER, THAT'S
ALL THEY WANT, AND SPEAKING
AS A MAN, IT ISN'T ALL I
WANT.

Maureen asks WHAT ELSE DO YOU
WANT IN A RELATIONSHIP?

Roy says WELL, WHAT I WANT
IS SOMEBODY TO HAVE A
RELATIONSHIP WITH ME, TOO.
YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT
THIS “WHEN WOMEN WANT SEX.”
OR “IF WOMEN DON'T WANT SEX.”
IT'S NOT QUITE THAT SIMPLE.
BECAUSE ALL MEN DON'T JUST
WANT SEX.
MAYBE YOUR GUESTS CAN
COMMENT ON THAT.

Maureen says OKAY.
WENDY?

Wendy says WELL I'M
GLAD YOU CALLED, ROY,
BECAUSE I THINK MEN ARE
INTERESTED IN RELATIONSHIPS,
TOO.
BUT I THINK THE FRIENDSHIP
BECOMES A REALLY GOOD BASIS
TO A LONG-TERM RELATIONSHIP.
AND WHAT I HEAR YOU SAYING
IS THAT THAT'S IMPORTANT TO
YOU, TOO.
I THINK WE TRAIN WOMEN MORE
IN OUR CULTURE TO BE
RELATIONAL, AND THAT
WOMEN -- THAT MEN, THERE ARE
MANY MEN WHO ARE VERY
RELATIONAL, AND I THINK AS
MEN AGE, THE RELATIONSHIPS
BECOME MORE IMPORTANT TO
THEM AND I THINK
RELATIONSHIPS ARE IMPORTANT
FOR BOTH.

Maureen says SO IT'S
VALENTINE'S DAY, AND I MEAN,
I DID START OFF BY SAYING,
YOU KNOW, MEN ARE RUNNING
OUT TO GET FLOWERS.
WHAT ARE THE THINGS THAT
WOMEN OUGHT TO BE DOING TO
LET THEM KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW,
HEY, YOU'RE VERY SPECIAL TO
ME.
YOU'RE UNIQUE TO ME.

Joan says WELL, I
THINK THAT -- AND AGAIN, I
SUPPORT WHAT YOUR CALLER IS
SAYING, AND THAT IS THAT MEN
AND WOMEN BOTH HAVE HOLISTIC
NEEDS FOR A RELATIONSHIP,
THAT THEY AREN'T LECHES,
CERTAINLY IN OUR MINDS.
AND THAT WE RECOGNIZE THAT
THEY HAVE NEEDS FOR
RELATIONSHIP BEFORE THEY CAN
THOROUGHLY ENJOY A MATURE
SEXUAL RELATIONSHIP AS WELL.
I THINK IN TERMS OF THE
VALENTINE, AGAIN, I CAN ONLY
SUGGEST THAT WE RECOGNIZE
EACH INDIVIDUAL, NOT ONLY AS
A MAN OR A WOMAN, BUT AS
INDIVIDUALS.
AND EACH PERSONALITY TYPE
AND FROM MY PERSPECTIVE,
PERSONALITIES ARE INNATE,
AND YOU KNOW, EACH OF US HAS
VERY SPECIFIC WAYS THAT WE
LIKE TO RECEIVE THAT WE LIKE
TO GIVE, THAT WE LIKE
ACKNOWLEDGEMENT, AND WE NEED
TO BE REALLY VERY AWARE OF
THE UNIQUE LIKES AND
DISLIKES OF OUR PARTNER.

Maureen says SURE.
YEAH.

Wendy says SO WE ALL
WANT TO FEEL SPECIAL
SCOMPIRNGS WE ALL NEED TO
TELL OUR PARTNERS WHAT THEY
CAN DO TO HELP US FEEL
SPECIAL, WHETHER THEY'RE MEN
OR WOMEN.
AND I THINK WE GET THE BEST
IDEAS WHEN WE LISTEN TO WHAT
OUR PARTNER WANTS AND FEEL
GOOD.

Joan says ELEGANT LISTENING IS THE
BEST VALENTINE.

Maureen says NICELY PUT.
ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU, ROY,
FOR YOUR CALL.
VICKI IS IN FLORENCE.
HI VICKI.

Vicki says HI, HOW ARE YOU?

Maureen says GOOD, THANKS.

Vicki says THAT'S GOOD.
MY PROBLEM'S KIND OF A
LITTLE BIT OF BOTH.
MY HUSBAND AND I, WE HAVE
FOUR CHILDREN, AND THEY
RANGE FROM THE AGE OF 16
DOWN TO THREE MONTHS.
AND WE GO THROUGH A POINT
WHERE WE HAVE REALLY GREAT
SEX AND WE WANT IT ALL THE
TIME TO WHERE NEITHER ONE OF
US WANT IT ALL, AND WHY IS
THAT?
LIKE WE ALWAYS WANT TO BE
WITH EACH OTHER FOR SEX FOR
LIKE SOMETIMES TWO TIMES A
DAY, EVERYDAY A WEEK, TO
WHERE WE GO A MONTH WITHOUT
EVEN WANTING TO BE BOTHERED
WITH EACH OTHER.

Maureen says AS LONG AS
YOU'RE BOTH IN SYNCH AT THE
SAME TIME IT'S PROBABLY NOT
A PROBLEM.
ARE YOU ALWAYS IN THE SAME
PATTERN?

Vicki says NO, NOT ALWAYS.
LIKE THAT'S THE PROBLEM.
THERE'S TIMES WHEN I REALLY
WANT IT -- SOMETIMES WE ARE
IN SYNCH, BUT THERE ARE
TIMES WHEN HE WANTS IT ALL
THE TIME AND I DON'T, AND
THERE'S TIMES WHERE I WANT
IT ALL THE TIME AND HE
DOESN'T.
BUT THEN THERE'S A TIME WHEN
WE DON'T BOTHER WITH EACH
OTHER AT ALL FOR A LONG
PERIOD OF TIME.

Maureen says OKAY, MAYBE WE
CAN THROW THIS AT WENDY.

Wendy says WELL IT
SOUNDS LIKE THERE ARE LOTS
OF POSITIVES IN YOUR
RELATIONSHIP IN THAT YOU'RE
BOTH ATTRACTED TO EACH OTHER,
THAT OFTEN YOU ARE IN SYNCH,
AND SO IT SOUNDS LIKE WHAT
WOULD BE IMPORTANT WOULD BE
TO TALK ABOUT WHAT'S GOING
ON WHEN YOU'RE NOT IN SYNCH.
IS IT JUST SOMETHING -- YOU
KNOW, A STRESS ONE OF YOU IS
FEELING SO YOU DON'T HAVE
THE TIME AND ENERGY TO
COMMIT TO THE RELATIONSHIP
RIGHT NOW?
OR ARE THERE THINGS,
UNSPOKEN THINGS, RESENTMENTS,
CONCERNS YOU HAVE THAT ARE
HOLDING YOU BACK?
THAT'S, THAT'S MY INITIAL
TAKE ON WHAT YOU'RE SAYING,
BUT IT SOUNDS LIKE THERE IS
SOME STRENGTHS AND THAT YOU
ARE IN SYNCH A LOT AND THAT
YOU ENJOY EACH OTHER
SEXUALLY.

Maureen says I GUESS THE ONE
THING THAT CONCERNED ME IS
WHEN SHE SAID SOMETIMES WE
JUST DON'T WANT TO HAVE
ANYTHING TO DO WITH ONE
ANOTHER.
AND I WAS JUST READING IN
ONE OF THE BOOKS I THINK YOU
BROUGHT, WENDY, THAT ONE O
THE PRINCIPLES OF A GREAT
MARRIAGE IS THAT YOU TURN
TOWARD EACH OTHER, IN THE
AWAY FROM EACH OTHER IN
TIMES OF STRESS.
WHAT DO YOU WANT TO SAY
ABOUT THAT, JOAN?

Joan says WELL, I
GUESS WHAT I WOULD SAY ABOUT
THAT IS THAT ALL
RELATIONSHIPS -- ALL GOOD
RELATIONSHIPS REALLY REQUIRE
THE DANCE OF TWO
PERSONALITIES.
THAT WE NEED TO ALWAYS MAKE
ROOM FOR THE OTHER.
AND, YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES,
DEPENDING ON THE STRESSES
AND THE STAGE OF THE
RELATIONSHIP, WE FEEL
SWALLOWED BY THE OTHER
PERSONALITY, AND BY THE
OTHER PERSON'S NEEDS.
OR BY THE CHILDREN'S NEEDS.
AND SO FORTH.
AND I THINK AS LONG AS, AS
LONG AS WE PROVIDE SPACE FOR
EACH OTHER, AS WELL AS FOR
OURSELVES.
YOU KNOW, WE'RE OFTEN QUITE
ALERTED TO THE OTHER
PERSON'S NEEDS, BUT WE
SOMETIMES FORGET THAT WE
ALSO HAVE VERY DISTINCT
NEEDS.
AND SOMETIMES WE LACK
ASSERTIVENESS IN BEING ABLE
TO STATE EXACTLY WHAT IT IS
THAT WE SEEK.
AND RESENTMENTS CAN BUILD
AND SO FORTH, AND SO I THINK
AS LONG AS WE'VE PUT FORWARD
THAT WE ARE, WE ARE HERE AND
THAT WE --

A caption on screen reads “Today’s topic: Sex and Relationships,” and then it shows two phone numbers “416-484-2727. 1-888-411-1234 .”

Maureen says ARE THERE THING,
WENDY, THAT CAN EFFECT
DESIRE, ASIDE FROM SOME THE
THINGS WE'VE BEEN TALKING
ABOUT?
YOU KNOW, TOO MANY KIDS TO
LOOK AFTER, YOU'RE TIRED.
BUT I GUESS HORMONES, WE
KNOW CAN.
I'VE HEARD A LOT OF WOMEN
SAY THAT ONCE THEY GO OFF
THE BIRTH CONTROL PILL AFTER
YEARS OF BEING ON IT THAT
THEIR DISIR FOR SEX GOES UP.
ANYTHING ELSE THAT YOU'VE
NOTICED IN YOUR OBSERVATIONS?

Wendy says WELL, I
THINK, YOU KNOW, THE KINDS
OF THINGS WE'RE TALKING
ABOUT, HORMONES, CHANGES IN
LIFESTYLE, TRANSITIONS,
STRESS, WHETHER THAT'S -- IT
COULD BE JOB STRESS, IT
COULD HAVE NOTHING TO DO
WITH THE RELATIONSHIP.
IT COULD BE AN ILLNESS OF A
PARENT OR SOMEONE OUTSIDE
THE RELATIONSHIP.
IT COULD BE ILLNESS WITHIN
THE RELATIONSHIP.
THAT HAS A HUGE IMPACT.
IF SOMEONE HAS A CHRONIC
ILLNESS OR A CHRONIC PAIN.
YOU KNOW, IT'S HARD TO FEEL
SEXUAL WHEN YOU'RE DEALING
WITH SOME OF THOSE THINGS.
OR SOMETIMES YOU NEED TO
FIND DIFFERENT WAYS OF BEING
SEXUAL WITH EACH OTHER.

Maureen says OKAY.
ALL RIGHT, WE'LL GO NEXT
TO -- DID I GET TO -- YEAH,
JULIAN IN OTTAWA IS NEXT.
HI JULIAN.

Julian says HI, HOW ARE YOU TODAY?

Maureen says I'M FINE,
THANKS.
WHAT'S YOUR QUESTION.

Julian says FIRST ONE, THANK YOU FOR
YOUR SHOW.
I REALLY APPRECIATE THE
TOPICS THAT YOU HAVE ON.
HOW YOU TRY TO HELP PEOPLE.

Maureen says OH, THANK YOU SO
MUCH.

Julian continues I THINK THIS ISSUE HAS A
LOT TO DO WITH IT'S A WHOLE
BUNCH OF ISSUES.
I'D LAKE TO JUST MENTION A
FEW THINGS THAT COME IT
MIND.
EMOTIONAL CONNECTION FOR ME
IS A VERY SERIOUS ISSUE.
I THINK SEX IS A BAND AID TO
DEEPER ISSUES.
I THINK WHEN THERE'S -- FOR
A LOT OF MEN, THERE'S A FEAR
OF INTIMACY, AT LEAST THERE
WAS IN MY PAST.
I HAD A LOT OF MOTHER ISSUE
WOUNDS.
ABSENT MOTHER, ET CETERA,
AND I HAD A LOT OF WALLS TO
DO WITH FEELING DEEPLY, OR
ALLOWING MYSELF TO FEEL
DEEPLY TOWARDS THE ONE THAT
I WAS WITH IN A RELATIONSHIP
SIMPLY BECAUSE OF A LOT OF
CHILDHOOD PATTERNS OF WOUNDS
THAT I RECEIVED IN MY MIND,
MY EMOTIONS AND IN MY
SPIRIT.
LITERALLY MY SOUL ISSUES.
WHICH BECAME VERY DEEP.
I ALSO FELT THAT I HAD TO
FIND HEALING IN A LOT OF
EMOTIONAL AREAS OVER THE
YEARS AND READ A LOT OF
BOOKS AND A LOT OF STUDY
TAPES TO HELP MYSELF.
AND ALSO THERE'S MANY TIMES
IN THE PAST WHERE I DIDN'T
FEEL I WAS EQUIPPED TO DEAL
WITH MANY OF THESE ISSUES.
I DIDN'T FEEL THAT I KNEW
HOW TO LOVE A WOMAN IN THE
WAY THAT A WOMAN NEEDED TO
BE LOVED.
AND MANY OF THE WOMEN THAT I
WAS TRYING TO BUILD
FRIENDSHIPS WITH IN THE PAST
HAD A LOT OF WOUNDS
THEMSELVES.
AND I THINK IF YOU'RE
UNBALANCED IN YOUR MIND
EMOTIONS AND SPIRIT, THAT
YOU'RE GOING TO BE
UNBALANCED IN MANY ISSUES.
I KNOW I HAD A FIANCEE YEARS
AGO THAT I ALMOST MARRIED.
AND SHE NEVER HAD A FATHER
TO LOVE HER AS A CHILD.

Maureen says RIGHT.

Julian continues AND SHE HAD A LOT
OF WOUNDS.
AND I HAD A LOT OF BAGGAGE
AS WELL.

Maureen asks SO IT DIDN'T
HAPPEN THOUGH.
YOU RECOGNIZED THIS?

Julian says WELL, WE BELIEVED
IN -- WE WERE HONOURING EACH
OTHER, AND WE BELIEVED IN
BUILDING A FRIENDSHIP, A
SOLID FOUNDATION TO OUR
RELATIONSHIP BEFORE SEX WAS
EVEN AN ISSUE.
AND I FIND THROUGH MANY
PEOPLE THAT I'VE KNOWN OVER
THE YEARS, THAT THAT
FOUNDATION OF LOVE AND
RESPECT, THROUGH BUILDING A
RELATIONSHIP AS A FRIEND
WITH SOMEONE WAS NOT THERE,
AND SEX IN MY OPINION IS AN
ISSUE TO DO WITH WHOLENESS
AND A BALANCE IN YOUR
EXPERIENCE WITH THE ONE
YOU'RE WITH.

Maureen says YOU RAISE A LOT
OF GOOD POINTS HERE.
I WANT TO GO BACK TO WHAT
YOU SAID SORT OF ABOUT
CHILDHOOD ISSUES.
AND HE SAID HE DIDN'T REALLY
KNOW HOW TO LOVE A WOMAN THE
WAY SHE NEEDED TO BE LOVED.
AND I WONDER, WENDY, IF YOU
SEE A LOT OF -- IF HE
DOESN'T HAVE A MOTHER/FATHER
RELATIONSHIP TO SORT OF
PATTERN HIS OWN
RELATIONSHIPS ON, ONE THAT'S
HEALTHY, ANYWAY, DO WE TEND
TO MAKE THE SAME MISTAKES?
OR, YOU KNOW, REALLY
FLOUNDER AROUND AT FIRST
BEFORE WE GET IT RIGHT?

Wendy says YES.
I THINK THE CALLER HAS MADE
SOME WONDERFUL POINTS, AND I
THINK OFTEN IF WE'RE GETTING
STUCK IN RELATIONSHIPS,
THERE ARE ISSUES THAT HARKEN
BACK TO OUR CHILDHOOD, THAT
WE NEED TO BEGIN TO EXPLORE.
THAT THAT ABILITY TO BE
INTIMATE, YOU KNOW, AND TO
FEEL SAFE A PARTNER AND TO
DISCLOSE YOUR INNERMOST
THOUGHTS AND FEELINGS, WHICH
IF WE HAVEN'T LEARNED THAT,
IF WE HAVEN'T FELT SAFE AND
DEVELOPED TRUST GROWING UP,
THAT'S MUCH MORE DIFFICULT.
AND SO SOME OF THE WORK THAT
WE AS ADULTS HAVE TO DO IS
TO GO BACK AND LOOK AT THOSE
ISSUES, AND LEARN TO CHANGE
AND LEARN TO TRUST.

Maureen says THE OTHER THING
HE TALKED ABOUT WAS SORT OF
RELATIONSHIPS THAT ARE
FOUNDED FIRST ON SEX AND
DON'T HAVE THE FRIENDSHIP
COMPONENT TO THEM.
A RECIPE FOR DISASTER
NECESSARILY, JOAN?
WHAT DO YOU THINK?

Joan says I THINK
THAT IF THERE IS SOMETHING
CHEMICALLY BETWEEN THEM,
THAT'S SPARKING AND THAT'S
ENJOYED AND THAT'S WHAT
THEY'RE BOTH SEEKING,
DEPENDING ON WHAT THE TWO
INDIVIDUALS IN THE
RELATIONSHIP ARE LOOKING FOR,
HOPEFULLY THAT WILL SUSTAIN
THEM THROUGH -- I THINK MOST
RELATIONSHIPS DO HAVE
ENDORPHINS FLYING IN THE
FIRST LITTLE WHILE.
AND I THINK THAT ONCE THAT'S
SATIATED, AND TAKEN CARE OF,
THEY CAN THEN MOVE ONTO A
DEEPER LEVEL OF
UNDERSTANDING.
HOPEFULLY, THOUGH THERE IS
THAT CONNECTION AS WELL AS
THE SEXUAL ONE.
THERE WILL BE MORE TO IT.

Maureen says SO ARE WE SAYING
HERE THEN THAT -- I MEAN, I
THINK WHAT JULIAN WAS TRYING
TO SAY WAS THAT COUPLES FALL
INTO BED TOO QUICKLY THESE
DAYS WITH ONE ANOTHER.
WHAT ARE -- I DON'T KNOW.
I GUESS IT'S NOT REALLY OUR
PLACE TO SAY WHETHER THAT'S
BAD OR GOOD, I JUST WONDERED
IF IN YOUR PRACTICES YOU'VE
FOUND ANY SORT OF PATTERN
THERE.
WHETHER THESE ONES LAST
LONGER THAN ONES WHERE THEY
FIRST TRY TO BUILD A SOLID
FRIENDSHIP AND THEN THE SEX
COMES LATER.
NOT NECESSARILY AFTER
MARRIAGE, BUT YOU KNOW WHAT
I MEAN.
WENDY?

Wendy says YES.
I THINK MY EXPERIENCE IS
THAT IF A COUPLE HAS TAKEN
THE TIME TO CREATE A
RELATIONSHIP AND THEN HAVE
SEX, OFTEN THE RELATIONSHIP
DEVELOPS IN A MUCH MORE -- A
MUCH MORE -- MUCH MORE
EASILY.
BECAUSE THERE IS A
FOUNDATION TO FALL BACK ON.
YOU KNOW, AND SEX MEANS
DIFFERENT THINGS TO
DIFFERENT PEOPLE.
YOU KNOW, IF YOU CAN BE VERY
SEXUAL, STARTING OUT, AND
THE WOMAN MAY THINK, YOU
KNOW, THIS MAN REALLY LOVES
ME, AND REALLY CARES ABOUT
ME, BUT IT MIGHT BE MORE
CASUAL SEX FOR HIM.
AND THEN OVERTIME IT BECOMES
CLEAR THEY DON'T HAVE THAT
MUCH IN COMMON, AND SHE MAY
FEEL LIKE SHE HAS SOME
COMMITMENT IN THIS
RELATIONSHIP, AND HE DOESN'T,
OR VICE VERSE IS A.
IT CAN WORK EITHER WAY.

Maureen says ROY'S LISTENING.

Wendy says AND IT CAN
WORK EITHER WAY AND IT'S SO
WHAT DOES SEX MEAN?
AND I THINK THESE DAYS WITH
BIRTH CONTROL THERE'S MORE
RECREATIONAL SEX GOING ON
THAN WHEN I WAS GROWING UP.
AND SO THAT'S NOT ALWAYS
BENEFICIAL FOR A LONG TERM
RELATIONSHIP, BUT THAT
DOESN'T MEAN PEOPLE CAN'T
ENJOY BEING SEXUAL TOGETHER
IN THE SHORT TERM.

Maureen says RIGHT.
ALL RIGHT, GOOD.
THANK YOU FOR YOUR CALL,
JULIAN.
MERCEDES IS IN TORONTO.
HI MERCEDES.

Mercedes says HI.

Maureen says HI.

Mercedes says MY QUESTION
ACTUALLY TOUCHES UPON WHAT
YOU WERE JUST TALKING, KIND
OF ABOUT CASUAL SEX.
THAT BASICALLY I SEPARATED
FROM MY EX-HUSBAND OVER A
YEAR AGO, AND THAT WAS KIND
OF AN ABUSIVE RELATIONSHIP,
AND I HAVEN'T REALLY WANTED
TO BE IN A RELATIONSHIP, A
SERIOUS RELATIONSHIP SINCE
THEN.
I'VE MOSTLY WANTED TO JUST
KIND OF HAVE CASUAL SEX WITH
CLOSE FRIENDS THAT I'VE
KNOWN FOR LIKE SIX OR SEVEN
YEARS, FOR A WHILE, PEOPLE
THAT I FEEL COMFORTABLE
WITH.
AND I THINK NOW, ONCE I,
ONCE I SEPARATE FROM MY
HUSBAND, I KIND OF FELT A
BIT LIBERATED AND I TRIED
NEW THINGS.
I EXPERIMENTED WITH MY
SEXUALITY AND STUFF LIKE
THAT.
BUT LATELY IT'S KIND OF BEEN
LIKE -- I MEAN, I HAVE THESE
PARTNERS I FEEL VERY
COMFORTABLE WITH I HAVE A
CLOSE RELATIONSHIP WITH, AND
IT'S NOT GOOD SEX ANYMORE.
AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S
GOING ON.
I'M NOT ENJOYING MYSELF
ANYMORE.
AND ESPECIALLY AROUND
VALENTINE'S DAY I'M KIND OF
FEELING LIKE, YOU KNOW, I
WANT TO CUDDLE WITH SOMEONE,
AND DO OTHER STUFF.
AND IT'S NOT THERE.
SO I'M JUST KIND OF
WONDERING, WHAT'S HAPPENING
NOW WITH ME THAT, WHERE I
WAS COMFORTABLE WITH IT
BEFORE, IT'S NOT REALLY
PLEASING TO ME ANYMORE.

Maureen says ALL RIGHT.
JOAN FIRST?

Joan says WELL, IT
SOUNDS AS THOUGH THE
CALLER -- MERCEDES, THAT
YOU'VE GONE THROUGH A
SEPARATION AND WHEN PEOPLE
SEPARATE IT'S A VERY, A VERY
DIFFICULT TIME IN PEOPLE'S
LIVES.
IT'S A TIME OF MOURNING.
AND I THINK THAT WHAT
HAPPENS DURING THAT TIME,
IT'S CRAZY.
TIMES FOR PEOPLE.
EMOTIONALLY THEY'RE UP AND
DOWN, THEY'RE IN DENIAL.
THEY'RE GOING THROUGH
BARGAINING AND ANGER AND ALL
KINDS OF EMOTIONS TAKE OVER,
AND CERTAINLY IT SOUNDS AS
THOUGH THIS -- THAT MERCEDES,
YOU'VE BEEN EXPERIENCING
SOME OF THAT TURMOIL.
AND TRYING TO SATISFY YOUR
NEEDS CASUALLY.
BUT THROUGH FRIENDS WOMEN.
IS AT LEAST -- YOU'VE GOT
SOME COMFORT IN THE
KNOWLEDGE THAT THESE PEOPLE
HAVE A CARING RELATIONSHIP
WITH YOU AS WELL.
BUT I THINK AFTER A YEAR,
YOU'VE COME TO REALIZE THAT
THERE IS ALSO SOMETHING
MISSING.
THAT'S SUSTAINING A MORE
INTIMATE AND PERMANENT
RELATIONSHIP HAS, HAS SOME
WONDERFUL COMPONENTS OF IT
THAT PERHAPS THIS LAST YEAR
HASN'T OFFERED.

Maureen says IT'S THE
INTIMACY THAT'S MISSING,
WOULD YOU SAY, WENDY?

Wendy says THAT'S
WHAT IT SOUNDS LIKE TO ME.
AND I ALSO HEARD HER SAY
THAT SHE WAS IN AN ABUSIVE
RELATIONSHIP BEFORE.
AND SO I THINK IT'S NATURAL
THAT SHE NEEDS A YEAR OR TWO
TO KIND OF HEAL FROM THAT
BUT ALSO I WOULD RECOMMEND
THAT SHE SEE AN INDIVIDUAL
THERAPIST, IF SHE HASN'T
ALREADY DONE THAT.
BECAUSE I THINK THAT WHEN
YOU'RE IN AN ABUSIVE
RELATIONSHIP FOR A LONG TIME,
THAT IT'S VERY DAMAGING TO
YOUR SELF-ESTEEM.
THAT THERE ARE SOME ISSUES
YOU HAVE TO WORK THROUGH,
TOO.
AND THAT THIS WOULD BE A
GOOD TIME TO DO IT BEFORE
YOU GET INVOLVED IN ANOTHER
RELATIONSHIP.

Maureen asks COULD MANY
PEOPLE PULL OFF WHAT
MERCEDES WAS SUCCESSFULLY
PULLING OFF, FOR AT LEAST A
LITTLE WHILE, CASUAL SEX
WITH A LOT OF DIFFERENT
PEOPLE?
CAN MANY PEOPLE DO THAT FOR
VERY LONG BEFORE THEY START
TO KIND OF LOSE SELF-ESTEEM,
WENDY?

Wendy says WELL, I'M
NOT SURE THAT THAT'S MAKING
HER LOSE SELF-ESTEEM.
I WASN'T TRYING TO CONNECT
THAT, BUT I THINK
SOMETHING'S HAPPENED THAT
MAYBE THIS CASUAL SEX ISN'T
REALLY WHAT SHE WANTS.
AND MAYBE WHAT'S HAPPENING
NOW IS SHE'S LISTENING MORE
TO HERSELF AND SAYING “THIS
ISN'T FOR ME,” BUT SHE
HASN'T QUITE FIGURED OUT
WHAT THAT'S ALL ABOUT.
AND I THINK SHE'S PROBABLY
GOING TO NEED SOME HELP
DOING THAT AFTER COMING OUT
OF AN ABUSIVE RELATIONSHIP.

Maureen says ALL RIGHT.
THANKS VERY MUCH FOR YOUR
CALL.
IF YOU'RE JUST JOINING US,
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SEX AND
RELATIONSHIPS THIS AFTERNOON
WITH WENDY TRAINOR AND JOAN
SINCLAIR.
IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION, NEED
SOME ADVISE ON A PARTICULAR
PROBLEM IN YOUR RELATIONSHIP,
WE'D BE HAPPY TO TAKE THE
CALL.

A caption appears on screen showing two phone numbers.

Maureen continues IN TORONTO 416-484-2727
LONG DISTANCE OUR TOLL FREE
NUMBER IS 1-888-411-1234
AND YOU CAN E-MAIL US
AT MORETOLIFE AT TVO.COM
NOW ON THE
SUBJECT OF WHAT WOMEN ARE
DOING FOR THEIR HUSBANDS ON
VALENTINE'S DAY, THIS
E-MAILER SAYS THE THOUGHTFUL
THING I DID FOR MY HUSBAND
FOR VALENTINE'S DAY WAS I
SHAVED MY LEGS.
LIKE A LOT OF CALLER, I HAVE
TWO SMALL CHILDREN, ONE WITH
SPECIAL NEEDS, AND I'M VERY
TIRED.
ALSO, I HAVE LESS INTEREST
IN SEX SINCE I'VE BEEN ON
PROZAK.
MY HUSBAND HAS BEEN VERY
UNDERSTANDING, BUT I WISH I
COULD BE MORE INTERESTED IN
SEX FOR HIS BENEFIT AS MUCH
AS MINE.

Wendy says WELL,
ACTUALLY IT'S A KNOWN FACT
THAT SOME OF THE S.S.R.I.
ANTIDEPRESSANTS DO DEPRESS
SEXUAL DESIRE, AND I WOULD
HIGHLY RECOMMEND THAT YOU GO
BACK TO YOUR DOCTOR AND TALK
TO HIM ABOUT THIS.
BECAUSE THERE ARE SOME THAT
DO NOT HAVE THE SIDE EFFECT.
AND SO I THINK IT'S VERY
WORTH EXPLORING AND POSSIBLY
GETTING ON A DIFFERENT
ANTIDEPRESSANT.
SHE WILL NOTICE HER SEXUAL
RESPONSE COME BACK.

Maureen says OKAY.

Joan says AND THE
OTHER THING JUST ABOUT --
WHAT THIS E-MAIL PERSON HAS
SUGGESTED, THAT WHEN YOU
HAVE A SPECIAL NEEDS CHILD
AS WELL, THAT IT'S VERY
CONSUMING.
AND HAVING TWO HEALTHY,
NORMAL CHILDREN IS A BIG
BURDEN IN ITSELF, BUT HAVING
A SPECIAL NEEDS CHILD IS
ALSO -- IT'S AN ESPECIALLY
DRAINING RESPONSIBILITY.

Maureen says AND I BET IT CAN
ALSO BE A FOCAL POINT TO
PULL THE TWO OF YOU TOGETHER
IN THE RELATIONSHIP.

Joan says IT CAN BE.
IT'S ALSO VERY, VERY HARD ON
A RELATIONSHIP.
I THINK IF YOU ARE A COUPLE
AND A TEAM OF PARENTS WHO
SEE YOURSELVES AS
CO-PARENTING AND SEE
YOURSELVES AS SHARING THAT
RESPONSIBILITY, THEN IT CAN
VERY MUCH ENHANCE THE
RELATIONSHIP.
BUT IF IT ISOLATES YOU
FURTHER FROM ONE ANOTHER AND
HAS YOU WALKING IN EVEN, IN
EVEN MORE DISPARAGING PATHS,
THEN IT'S --

Maureen says YEAH, THAT'D BE
HARD.
OKAY.
JAYDEN IS IN TIMMINS.
HI JAYDEN.

Jayden says HI.

Maureen says HI.

Jayden says MY QUESTION IS
I'M JUST WONDERING WHY IT IS
THAT BEFORE I WAS MARRIED MY
HUSBAND WOULD OFTEN BRING ME
FLOWERS OR TAKE ME OUT FOR
DINNER, BUT SINCE WE'VE BEEN
MARRIED ALL THOSE ROMANTIC
GESTURES HAVE STOPPED.
FOR EXAMPLE I HAVEN'T
RECEIVED A VALENTINE'S GIFT
IN THE LAST TWO YEARS WE'VE
BEEN MARRIED AND TODAY HE'S
DECIDED HE HAD TO GO TO WORK
OUT OF TOWN AND SO I'M
SPENDING VALENTINE'S DAY
ALONE.
AND I HAVE TALKED TO HIM
ABOUT THIS, AND I TOLD HIM
THAT I DO FEEL HURT, AND IT
IS VERY HURTFUL WHEN HE
FORGETS.
AND HIS RESPONSE IS THAT “I
DON'T THINK OF THOSE THINGS
ANYMORE.”

Maureen says HMM.
BUT HE USED TO.
AND YOU DO
RESENT IT?
I MEAN, SOME WOMEN KIND
OF -- LIKE ME -- I KIND OF
STOPPED ALL THE THAT STUFF,
TOO, WITH MY HUSBAND, BUT WE
DID IT TOGETHER.
AND I DON'T -- YOU KNOW,
IT'S NOT THAT IMPORTANT TO
US ANYMORE.
BUT OBVIOUSLY THIS IS STILL
IMPORTANT TO YOU.

Jayden says MM-HMM.
IT IS.

Maureen continues AND HE KNOWS
THIS BECAUSE YOU'VE TOLD
HIM.
JOAN, WHAT DO YOU THINK?
SHE'S ASKING WHY DO MEN DO
THAT?

Joan says I GUESS I
WOULD ASK, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S
REALLY GOING ON IN THEIR
RELATIONSHIP.
AND ESPECIALLY SINCE SHE'S
HAD THE COURAGE AND THE
ASSERTIVENESS TO SAY, “YOU
KNOW, THIS IS WHAT I WANT,
THIS IS WHAT I NEED, THIS IS
WHAT I NEED TO HEAR FROM YOU,
THIS IS MY WAY OF RECEIVING
LOVE.”
AND SO IF SHE'S CLEAR ABOUT
THAT AND HE'S NOT RESPONDING,
I THINK IT'S, IT'S TIME TO
HAVE ANOTHER CONVERSATION
AND PERHAPS TO BRING IN A
COUNSELLOR.

Maureen says THERE'S NO
QUESTION, THOUGH, THAT SHE'S
TOUCHED ON SOMETHING AND ONE
OF MY QUESTIONS WAS THAT,
YOU KNOW, MEN WHEN THEY'RE
TALKING ABOUT WIVES WHO
AREN'T INTERESTED IN SEX
ANYMORE, SOMETIMES BLAME
WOMEN FOR ALL -- YOU WERE
INTERESTED LIKE CRAZY UNTIL
I -- YOU KNOW, UP UNTIL I
PROPOSED TO YOU.
AND ONCE WE GOT MARRIED AND
YOU HAD ME IN YOUR, YOU KNOW,
CLUTCHES, IS PRACTICALLY HOW
THEY PUT IT, THEN YOU LOST
ALL INTEREST.
SO THEY'RE KIND OF SAYING
THAT IT'S SOMETHING WOMEN DO
TO CATCH A MAN.
AND THEY'RE REALLY JUST
ACTING.
SHE'S SAYING “THIS IS WHAT
MY HUSBAND DID TO GET ME,
AND NOW THAT HE'S GOT ME, HE
DOESN'T NEED TO DO THESE
THINGS.”
DOES MARRIAGE SORT OF PUT A
WALL UP AND MAKE US STOP
TRYING HARD?
WENDY?

Wendy says I THINK A
LOT OF TIMES COUPLES COME
AND THEY TALK ABOUT HOW THEY
DON'T FEEL APPRECIATED IN
THE RELATIONSHIP.
AND IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT
THAT WE ALL NEED TO FEEL
APPRECIATED SO IT'S
IMPORTANT TO CREATE A TIME
TO DO THAT.
I SUGGEST TO COUPLES THAT
THEY MAKE SURE THAT THEY
HAVE MAYBE 20 MINUTES TO
HALF AN HOUR A DAY WHERE
THEY JUST KIND OF CONNECT
WITH EACH OTHER, TELL ME
ABOUT YOUR DAY.
THE KINDS OF THINGS YOU DID,
AND HAVE DATES, YOU KNOW?
THAT WE, THAT THEY SERVED TO
FUNCTION.
THAT'S HOW WE HAD OUR OWN
SPECIAL TIME WHEN WE WERE
DATING AND GETTING TO KNOW
EACH OTHER.
AND WE NEED TO CONTINUE THAT
THROUGH OUT OUR MARITAL
RELATIONSHIP.
THAT A COUPLE NEEDS TO
CREATE KIND OF A CIRCLE
AROUND THEM.
AND SAYING “WE'RE SPECIAL.”
THE RELATIONSHIP NEEDS TO BE
NURT TURNED AND FED, JUST AS
THE KIDS DO.
AND SO IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT
TO FIND WAYS TO DO THAT.
AND YOU KNOW, IF -- I MEAN,
I AGREE WITH JOAN.
IT SOUNDS LIKE IT COUPLE IS
HAVING SOME DIFFICULTIES,
AND IT WOULD BE WORTH GOING
TO A THERAPIST.
THE OTHER THING, IS THOUGH,
YOU CAN ALWAYS SAY, “WELL
LET'S CELEBRATE VALENTINE'S
DAY ANOTHER DAY.”
YOU KNOW, IF -- I DON'T KNOW
WHETHER THIS WILL WORK IN
THIS CASE, BUT YOU KNOW,
THERE ARE OTHER OPTIONS TO
KIND OF GET THAT KIND OF
FEELING.

Maureen says ALSO THOUGH, YOU
KNOW VALENTINE'S DAY IS
COMING UP.
YOU KNOW THAT FOR THE LAST
TWO YEARS HE HASN'T GOT YOU
ANYTHING.
YOU KNOW IF HE DOESN'T DO IT
AGAIN THIS YEAR YOU'RE GOING
TO BE REALLY TICKED.
IS IT FAIR TO SORT OF TEST
HIM TO SEE IF HE'LL DO
ANYTHING THIS-YEAR?
OR SHOULD YOU LET HIM KNOW
AHEAD OF TIME AND BE HONEST
WITH HIM.
AND THEN YOU HAVE TO WONDER,
WELL, IT WASN'T HIS IDEA, IT
WAS MINE.
BUT WHAT'S WORSE?
JOAN?

Joan says WELL, I
THINK THAT THIS CALLER IS
MAKING EVERY EFFORT TO LET
HER HUSBAND KNOW WHAT HER
NEEDS ARE.
AND HE'S NOT RESPONDING.
BY RECOGNIZING THAT SHE'S
BEING QUITE CLEAR ABOUT HOW
HE CAN, HE CAN MEET THOSE
NEEDS.
SO I THINK AS WENDY WAS
SAYING, THAT PARTLY
RELATIONSHIPS ARE LIKE A
ROSE, A SYMBOL OF
VALENTINE'S DAY.
THEY ARE -- THEY'RE THORNY
AND THEY NEED TO BE
NURTURED.
THEY NEED TO BE CARED FOR.
YOU KNOW, THEY GO THROUGH
DROUGHT AND THEY GO THROUGH
ALL KINDS OF DIFFICULT PHASE
WHERE THEY NEED TO HAVE
SPECIAL FEEDING AND SO
FORTH.
AND IF WE DON'T ATTEND TO
THOSE RELATIONSHIPS, THEY
WILL DIE.
AND THEY ARE -- THEY'RE HARD
WORK BUT THEY PRODUCE
WONDERFUL --

Wendy says AND I JUST
WOULD LIKE TO RESPOND TO
YOUR QUESTION, TOO, THAT I
THINK IT IS IMPORTANT TO PUT
YOUR EXPECTATIONS OUT.
I THINK -- NO ONE CAN READ
OUR MINDS.
I THINK WE ALL GREW UP
THINKING THE MAN OF OUR
DREAMS WOULD COME IN AND
WAIT -- IN ON A WHITE ANDORS
JUST KNOW WHAT TO DO.
AND THAT'S NOT FAIR TO THE
MAN.
HE CAN'T DO THAT.
SO I THINK, YOU KNOW, I GIVE
THIS CALLER POINTS FOR
STATING UP FRONT WHAT SHE
WANTS, AND THEN NOW SHE'S
DONE THAT CONSISTENTLY, AND
IT SOUNDS LIKE SHE'S DONE
WHAT SHE CAN.
AND IT SOUNDS LIKE THEY NEED
SOME HELP.
THEY NEED SOME HELP IF HE'S
NOT WILLING TO COME FORWARD.

Maureen says OKAY.
ALL RIGHT, JAYDEN, THANKS
FOR YOUR CALL, GOOD LUCK.
MICHELE IS IN COE BURG.
HI MICHELE.

Michele says I HAVE A VERY
WEIRD SITUATION.
I'M IN A RELATIONSHIP AND
HAVE BEEN IN THIS
RELATIONSHIP FOR I GUESS
ANYWHERE FROM SIX, SEVEN
MONTHS NOW.
IT'S A LONG DISTANCE
RELATIONSHIP, AND THE MAN
I'M SEEING, ONE DAY HE'LL
TELL ME HE LOVES ME AND THEN
THREE OR FOUR DAYS LATER HE
TELLS ME HE'S NOT SURE IF
HE'S IN LOVE OR NOT.
I'M IN LOVE WITH HIM, AND HE
HAS ALL THE SIGNS.
LIKE HE'S VERY JEALOUS IF I
TALK ABOUT ANOTHER GUY OR
SOMETHING.
HE TELLS ME HE MISSES ME ALL
THE TIME.
AND HE THINKS ABOUT ME ALL
THE DAY LONG.
AND I JUST WANTED TO KNOW,
IS THERE ANYWAY I CAN BE
SURE OF HOW HE'S FEELING?

Maureen says MMM.
OKAY, WENDY?

Wendy says WELL THAT
SOUNDS LIKE A TOUGH ONE.
HE'S TELLING YOU TWO
DIFFERENT THINGS AND IT
SOUND LIKE IT'S VERY
CONDITION FUSING FOR YOU.
SO I DON'T THINK THERE'S
ANYWAY OTHER THAN, YOU KNOW
THAT HE MIGHT NOT BE READY
TO MAKE THAT COMMITMENT, BUT,
YOU KNOW, IT WILL UNFOLD.
IT SOUND LIKE HE'S
AMBIVALENT, AND MAYBE TO
TALK TO HIM ABOUT WHAT THAT
AMBIVALENCE IS ABOUT.
I DON'T KNOW IF HE'S BEEN
HURT IN A PAST RELATIONSHIP
AND IS AFRAID TO COMMIT
OR -- THERE'S POSSIBLY
SOMETHING BEHIND IT.
WHAT DOES LOVE MEAN TO HIM?
YOU KNOW?
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'VE
TALKED TO HIM ABOUT SAYING
“WELL YOU SAID YOU LOVED ME
THE OTHER DAY AND NOW YOU
DON'T,” WHAT'S THAT ABOUT?
BECAUSE IT SOUNDS VERY
DIFFICULT TO BE IN THIS
POSITION OF GETTING THESE
MIXED MESSAGES.

Maureen asks WELL, DOES THIS
SOUND LIKE A GUY WHO'S READY
TO COMMIT?

Joan says NOT AT
THIS STAGE, BUT I'M WONDER,
TOO, SHE TALKS ABOUT IT
BEING A LONG DISTANCE
RELATIONSHIP.
HAVE THEY ACTUALLY
CONNECTED?
HAVE THEY MET?
IS THIS A COUPLE WHO MET
OVER THE INTERNET?

Maureen asks MICHELE, HAVE
YOU MET, DO YOU GET
TOGETHER?

Michele says IT'S LONG DISTANCE, WE
WERE PLANNING ON MEETING IN
AUGUST.
AND HE'S IN TOTALLY ANOTHER
DIFFERENT COUNTRY, AND RIGHT
NOW FINANCES AREN'T
AVAILABLE FOR EITHER OF US
TO GO BEFORE AUGUST.

Maureen says OKAY, BUT
MICHELE, YOU'RE SAYING YOU
LOVE THIS GUY YOU'VE NEVER
LAID EYES ON HIM?

Michele says WELL I'VE SEEN PICTURES
OF HIM, I'VE TALKED TO HIM
ON THE PHONE, I'VE TALKED TO
HIM EVERY NIGHT FOR LIKE SIX,
SEVEN HOURS A NIGHT FOR THE
LAST SIX, SEVEN MONTHS NOW.

Maureen asks OKAY IS THAT
ENOUGH, JOAN?

Joan says I WOULD
SUGGEST THAT THEY CONTINUE
TO COMMUNICATE, IF THAT'S
WHAT PLEASES THEM BOTH, AND
CERTAINLY IF THEY HAVE AN
OPPORTUNITY TO MEET, AND TO
SPEND SOMETIME WITH ONE
ANOTHER AND TO UNDERSTAND
HOW THEY FUNCTION IN THEIR
DAILY LIFE AND SO FORTH.

Maureen says BUT THIS -- A
GOOD THING YOU ASKED THAT.
SO NOW I THINK I KIND OF
UNDERSTAND MAYBE HIS
RELUCTANCE TO COME RIGHT OUT
AND SAY “I WANT TO SPEND THE
REST OF MY LIFE.”
LIKE LET'S BE --

Joan says I WOULD
HOPE THAT SHE WOULD ALSO
PERHAPS CREATE A FEW
BOUNDARIES FOR HERSELF UNTIL
THEY'VE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY
TO ACTUALLY GET TOGETHER AND
SPEND SOMETIME.

Maureen says FURTHER TO THE
INTERNET STUFF, WE HAVE AN
E-MAIL HERE FROM A WOMAN,
“MARRIED TO MY HUSBAND TEN
YEARS.
OH, BEEN WITH HIM FOR TEN
YEARS, MARRIED SEVEN YEARS.
WHEN IT COMES TO SEX AND
WHAT WE WANT IN THE BEDROOM,
NO PROBLEM THERE.”
BUT OUTSIDE OF THE BEDROOM
OUR COMMUNICATION SEEMS TO
LAG, AND FOR A WHILE WE WERE
NOT GETTING ALONG AND I FELT
HE WAS KEEPING SOMETHING
FROM ME SO I LOOKED AT
SOMETHING OF HIS AND WHAT I
SAW VERIFIED TO ME THERE WAS
SOMETHING GOING ON WITH HIM
AND ANOTHER WOMAN.
AND WHEN I CONFRONTED HIM
WITH WHAT I READ HE SAID
THAT WAS PRIVATE AND I
SHOULDN'T HAVE READ IT AT
ALL.”
MY QUESTION IS ARE THERE
PLACES I SHOULDN'T BE ABLE
TO LOOK OR READ IF THERE WAS
SOMETHING UP?
IT WASN'T A DIARY OR
SOMETHING, IT WAS A CHAT
LINE.
AND HE WAS SAYING THINGS TO
SOMEONE HE SHOULDN'T SAY AND
IT DIDN'T HELP THAT HE LIVES
CLOSE BY AND HE WAS SPENDING
A LOT OF TIME WITH HER
ONLINE.
WAS I WRONG TO SNOOP?
IS THERE A LINE OF WHAT'S
HIS AND I SHOULDN'T BE ABLE
TO LOOK AT IT OR NO?
WE ARE LOOKING AT THINGS BUT
HE SAYS HE'S LOST THE TRUST
IN ME BECAUSE I READ WHO
WHAT HE SAYS WAS ONLY FOR
HIM.
NEVER MIND THE TRUST YOU
LOST IN HIM BECAUSE OF WHAT
HE SAID IN THE FIRST PLACE.
JOAN, SHOULD SHE HAVE READ
IT?

Joan says SHOULD SHE
HAVE READ IT?
IT SOUNDS AS THOUGH SHE WAS
LOOKING TO UNDERSTAND WHAT
WAS GOING WRONG.
SHE WAS TRYING TO UNDERSTAND
WHAT WASN'T GOING ON IN
THEIR RELATIONSHIP, AND
TRYING TO MAKE SENSE OF IT.
I MEAN CLEARLY, WE -- YOU
KNOW, WE PROBABLY -- EACH OF
US HAVE OUR OWN ETHICS ABOUT,
AND INTEGRITY ABOUT LOOKING
AT OTHER PEOPLE'S DIARIES
AND JOURNALS AND THINGS.
IT SOUNDS AS THOUGH SHE
WASN'T INTENDING TO SNOOP SO
MUCH AS SHE WAS TRYING TO
UNDERSTAND WHAT WAS GOING
ON.
BUT I THINK AS LONG AS THEY,
AS HE'S CREATED AN EXIT
FROM THEIR RELATIONSHIP AND
IS IT SEEKING COMFORT AND
SEXUALITY AND WHATEVER ELSE
THAT SHE HOPED WOULD REMAIN
WITHIN THEIR RELATIONSHIP,
THERE'S A BIG DRAIN IN THAT
RELATIONSHIP AND SHE NEEDS
TO SEE IF HE'S PREPARED TO
CLOSE THAT EXIT IN ORDER TO
PUT THE ENERGY GHOOKT
RELATIONSHIP.

Maureen asks WHAT DO YOU
THINK, WENDY?
HAVE YOU SEEN CASE WHERE
COUPLES ARE SPLITTING UP
BECAUSE OF SORT OF CHAT
ROOMS LIKE THIS ONE?

Wendy says YES, AND I
THINK IT FEELS LIKE A REAL
BETRAYAL TO THE PARTNER WHO
IS LEFT OUTS.
YOU KNOW?
THAT THEY, THEY KNOW.
THIS WOMAN WAS SUSPICIOUS,
SHE WONDERED WHAT WAS GOING
ON, THAT'S WHY SHE LOOKED.
THAT THEY FEEL LIKE THEIR
PARTNER ISN'T ALL THERE FOR
THEM.
AND IT FEELS AWFUL.
AND I THINK HER PARTNER, YOU
KNOW, IT'S ONE OF THOSE
THINGS.
THE BEST DEFENCE IS A GOOD
OFFENCE.
HE'S FOCUSING ON THE FACT
THAT SHE SNOOPED AND NOT
TAKING RESPONSIBILITY FOR
HIS BEHAVIOUR.

Maureen says YES, YES.
RIGHT, OKAY.
DANNY IS IN LONDON.
HI DANNY.

Danny says HI.

Maureen continues AND DANNY'S A
GIRL.
HIGH DANNY.
GO AHEAD.

Danny says I HAVE QUESTION
ABOUT PORNOGRAPHY, ACTUALLY,
ABOUT MY BOYFRIEND LOOKING
AT IT.
AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT I
FEEL TO FIND PERSONALLY
THREATENING AND I'M
WONDERING IS THAT A PROBLEM
WITHIN ME?

Maureen says OKAY.
WENDY?
WHAT DO YOU THINK?

Wendy says I'M
WONDERING HOW IT MAKES HER
FEEL.

Maureen says DANNY?

Danny says I GUESS I JUST
WOULD LIKE TO THINK THAT I'M
THE ONE THAT YOU KNOW,
REALLY DOES IT FOR HIM, AND
WHY DOES HE NEED TO TURN TO
PORNOGRAPHY TO --

Maureen asks TO WHAT?
WHAT DOES HE DO WITH IT?

Danny says WHY DOES HE NEED
IT?
YOU KNOW, WHY IS THAT A --

Maureen says DOES HE JUST --

Danny says IS HE FILL A VOID
OR AM I TOO UP TIGHT OR --.

Maureen says HE BUYS A LOT OF
IT AND HE LOOKS AT IT.

Danny says WELL, YEAH.

Wendy asks ARE THEY
MOVIES?

Danny says NOT A LOT.
I WOULDN'T SAY A LOT.

Maureen says WENDY WANTS TO
KNOW ARE THEY MOVIES OR
MAGAZINES OR WHAT?

Danny says MAGAZINES.

Wendy says OKAY, I
THINK A LOT OF MEN FIND
MAGAZINES SEXUALLY
STIMULATING.
MEN ARE STIMULATED VISUALLY.
I THINK OFTEN WOMEN FEEL
LIKE, “AREN'T I ENOUGH FOR
HIM?
I CAN'T MEASURE UP.
WE GET ALL KINDS OF THOSE
MESSAGES AS WOMEN GROWING UP
THAT THERE'S A CERTAIN WAY
WE SHOULD LOOK OR BE TO
PLEASE MEN.”
AND SO IT FEELS VERY
DEMEANING TO US WHEN OUR
PARTNERS ARE INVOLVED WITH
PORNOGRAPHY.
AND I THINK IT'S REALLY
IMPORTANT TO CONTINUE THE
DIALOGUE WITH HIM, TO REALLY
FIND OUT WHAT THAT MEANS TO
HIM.
IS HE WILLING TO GIVE IT UP?
IS THERE SOMETHING HE NEEDS
FROM YOU THAT MIGHT BE
DIFFERENT AND STIMULATING?
BUT TO ACKNOWLEDGE THOSE
FEELINGS.
BECAUSE I THINK, YOU KNOW,
AS A FEMINIST IT DOESN'T
FEEL GOOD TO HAVE WOMEN
PORTRAYED IN THOSE WAYS.
AND, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF MEN
BUY THESE MAGAZINES, THAT'S
WHY THEY'RE OUT THERE.
BUT IT DOESN'T OFTEN FEEL
GOOD FOR THE WOMEN.

Maureen says AND THIS GETS
INTO THE AREA OF PEOPLE WHO
NEED TO FANTASIZE WHILE
THEY'RE HAVING INTERCOURSE
TO SORT OF, YOU KNOW,
ACHIEVE ORGASM OR WHATEVER.
JOAN, IS THAT NECESSARILY A
BETRAYAL OF THE PERSON THAT
YOU'RE WITH?

Joan says I WAS JUST
GOING TO ASK WENDY, ACTUALLY,
DO WOMEN ALSO -- EVEN THOUGH
THEY DON'T HAVE AN EXTERNAL
SOURCE OF STIMULATION, I
THINK THAT WOMEN ARE AS
LIKELY TO FANTASIZE AS MEN
ARE TO LOOK AT MAGAZINES.

Wendy says YES.
YOU KNOW, I THINK FANTASY IS
QUITE HARMLESS, BUT I THINK
OFTEN FANTASY CAN ENHANCE
THE AROUSAL.
WE OFTEN SUGGEST TO WOMEN
WHO HAVE LOW DESIRE OR MEN
WHO ARE HAVING PERFORMANCE
ANXIETY, YOU CAN'T SAY TO
SOMEONE WHO HAS PERFORMANCE
ANXIETY “DON'T THINK ABOUT
WHETHER OR NOT YOU'RE GOING
TO GET AN ERECTION.”
BUT WHAT YOU CAN DO IS
ENHANCE THE SEXUAL THOUGHTS
AND FEELINGS.
OUR BRAIN IS OUR BIGGEST SEX
ORGAN.
SO IF PEOPLE CAN BE TAUGHT
TO FOCUS ON THEIR PARTNERS'
BODY AND THE PLEASURE THEY
FEEL IN TOUCHING THEIR
PARTNER TO FOCUS ON HOW GOOD
THEY'RE FEELING, HAVING
THEIR BODY TOUCHED, AND ALSO
TO INCLUDE A FANTASY.
NOW FOR SOME PEOPLE -- SO
THE DANGER IS THOUGH, THAT
SOME PARTNERS FEEL BAD ABOUT
THAT.
YOU KNOW, WELL WHY DO YOU
NEED THAT FANTASY WHEN YOU
HAVE ME?
SO I THINK YOU HAVE TO BE
SENSITIVE TO YOUR PARTNER IN
TERMS OF HOW YOU USE
FANTASY.
YOU CAN ALSO HAVE A FANTASY
THAT YOU PLANT YOUR PARTNER
INTO, YOU KNOW?
IT DOESN'T ALWAYS HAVE TO BE
THE CURRENT HEARTFLOB.
IT CAN BE A FANTASY OF YOUR
PARTNER DOING THINGS WITH
YOU.
BECAUSE BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE
HAVE RELIGIOUS BELIEFS THAT
REALLY CONSTRAIN THEM FROM
HAVING FANTASIES IN GENERAL.
NOW SO THERE'S A WIDE RANGE
OF WHAT'S NORMAL.
SOME PEOPLE LIKE TO ACT OUT
THEIR FANTASIES.
YOU KNOW, SOME COUPLES
REALLY GET INTO IT AND THEY
ENJOY THAT.

Maureen asks WHAT IF ONE DOES
AND THE OTHER DOESN'T WANT
TO.

Wendy says THEN I
THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT
NOT TO DO ANYTHING THAT YOU
DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE WITH
SEXUALLY.
I THINK OFTEN ONE PARTNER
WILL BE LEADING, WILL BE
MORE ADVENTURESOME, AND YOU
KNOW, THAT KEEPS YOUR SEX
LIFE EXCITING.
TO DO DIFFERENT THINGS
OVERTYPE.
AND ALSO IN A LONG-TERM
RELATIONSHIP, SOMETHING YOUR
PARTNER MAY HAVE SAID NO TO
EARLY ON IN THE RELATIONSHIP,
THEY MAY BE WILLING TO TRY
LATER.
BUT IT'S SOMETIMES A MATTER
OF COMFORT, FEELING COMFORT
AND FEELING SAFE.
AND SO FANTASIES IN AND OF
THEMSELVES AREN'T BAD.
BUT I THINK WHEN MEN ARE
LOOKING TO A LOT OF KIND OF
MOVIES AND MAGAZINES, THAT
WOMEN DO TEND TO FEEL
UNCOMFORTABLE.

Maureen says OKAY.

Joan says AND I THINK ESPECIALLY IF
THE FANTASY ITSELF DOESN'T
TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION THE
INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE
INVOLVED.
SO THAT -- I MEAN, I THINK A
FANTASY CANNOT ONLY TAKE
INTO CONSIDERATION THE
INTERNAL MIND OF THE PERSON
HAVING THE FANTASY, BUT IT
ALSO HAS TO TAKE INTO
CONSIDERATION HOW THAT
FANTASY IS PLAYED OUT IN THE
RELATIONSHIP.
AND TAKING INTO
CONSIDERATION WHETHER OR NOT
THE EXPECTATION THAT THAT
IMPOSES IS SOMETHING THAT
YOUR PARTNER IS COMFORTABLE,
WITH EXCITED BY, FINDS
STIMULATING THEMSELVES.
BECAUSE IT'S VERY LIKELY IF
YOU'RE CREATIVE WITH IT,
THAT IT CAN BE RECIPROCATED
AND CAN ACTUALLY CREATE
QUITE AN EXCITING VENTURE.

Wendy says AND
SOMETIMES, YOU KNOW, THEY'LL
HAVE FANTASIES THAT THEY
DON'T WANT TO ACT OUT THAT
ARE JUST STIMULATING FOR
THEY WANT.
SO WHETHER A WOMAN MAY HAVE
A FANTASY OF BEING HELD
DOWN.
BUT YOU KNOW, IN REALITY,
SHE MIGHT NOT WANT THAT.

Maureen says AND SHE MAY NOT
EVEN HAVE TO SHARE THAT WITH
ANYBODY.

Wendy says THAT'S
CORRECT.

Maureen continues AND SHE MAY NOT
EVEN HAVE TO SHARE THAT WITH
ANYBODY.

Wendy says THAT'S
RIGHT IN YOUR FANTASY YOU'RE
IN CONTROL AND IF SOMEBODY'S
HOLDING YOU DOWN IN REAL
LIFE, IT CAN BE QUITE
FRIGHTENING SO FANTASIES CAN
BE STIMULATING WITHOUT ANY
NEED TO TALK OUT ON THEM.

Joan says OR WITHOUT
ACTING OUT ON THEM.

Maureen says THANKS FOR THE
CALL.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
BRIAN IS IN MISSISSAUGA.
HI BRIAN.

Brian says I'M GOING TO TRY
TO MAKE THIS REAL QUICK.
I'VE HAD A REAL GREAT
HISTORY WITH GETTING INTO
RELATIONSHIPS WHERE GIRLS
HAVE BEEN INVOLVED WITH
OTHER GUYS OR SHE STILL HAS
OLD BAGGAGE FROM PAST
RELATIONSHIPS AND I'VE
ALWAYS BEEN ABLE TO KEEP
LEVEL-HEADED AND THEN DECIDE
“OKAY, I'M OUT OF THIS.”
RIGHT?
JUST RECENTLY I GOT INTO A
RELATIONSHIP WITH THIS GIRL,
MAYBE ABOUT TWO OR THREE
WEEKS AGO, AND WE'RE BOTH IN
A SITUATION WHERE WE'RE NOT
TOO SURE IF WE WANT TO GET
INTO A COMMITTED
RELATIONSHIP, WHICH IS KIND
OF PERFECT FOR US, WE ENJOY
EACH OTHER'S COMPANY,
EVERYTHING'S GREAT, HOWEVER
BECAUSE OF VALENTINE'S DAY
COMING ALONG, SHE'S GOT THIS
WHOLE, I GUESS NOSTALGIC
THING WITH HER EX-BOYFRIEND
NOW.
NOW SHE BROKE UP WITH HIM
ABOUT A YEAR AND A HALF AGO
AND LAST NIGHT HER AND I
WERE ON THE PHONE AND SHE
JUST STARTED TO BREAK DOWN
AND CRY.
AND IT KIND OF FREAKED ME
OUT AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S
GOING ON.
SO I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE YOU
LADIES CAN SHED SOME LIGHT
ON THE SUBJECT.

Maureen asks HAS SHE ACTUALLY
SAID SHE MISSES HIM OR
SOMETHING LIKE THAT?

Brian says NOT MISSES HIM AS
IN LIKE THE BOYFRIEND, BUT I
GUESS THE BEST I CAN -- SHE
WAS WITH HIM FOR ABOUT
ELEVEN YEARS, SINCE SHE WAS
16.

Maureen says MISSES A
COMMITTED RELATIONSHIP,
MAYBE.
COULD THAT BE IT?

Brian says WAY BACK WHEN, YEAH.

Maureen says BUT MAYBE -- I'M
NOT A THERAPIST.
GO AHEAD.
JOAN?

Joan says I SUPPORT
WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO SAY, I
THINK, AND THAT IS THAT
CLEARLY YOU BOTH HAVE GONE
INTO THIS VERBALIZING TO ONE
ANOTHER THAT WHAT YOU'RE
LOOKING FOR IS SOMETHING
THAT'S PERHAPS PLAYFUL AND
LIGHT AND WITHOUT HEAVY
COMMITMENT, BUT IT SOUNDS AS
THOUGH THIS WOMAN WHO WAS
INVOLVED IN A FAIRLY
LONG-TERM RELATIONSHIP IS
REMEMBERING SOME OF THE
QUALITIES OF THAT, SO
COMPONENTS THAT SHE REALLY
APPRECIATED AND ENJOYED AND
IS PERHAPS MISSING THAT
COMMITMENT AND THAT
CONNECTION AND EVEN
THOUGH -- YOU KNOW, THE TWO
OF YOU HAVE AGREED THAT IT'S
MEANT TO BE SOMEWHAT MORE OF
A CASUAL RELATIONSHIP, THAT
SHE'S AWARE OF SOME
YEARNINGS.

Maureen says I WONDER, MIGHT
SHE BE SENDING OUT A HINT
THAT SHE'D BE READY FOR
SOMETHING MORE COMMITTED?
BUT YOU'RE AFRAID TO SAY IT
OF COURSE BECAUSE YOU DON'T
WANT TO BE THE ONE TO SAY IT
AND BE REJECTED.

Joan says ESPECIALLY
IF YOU'RE CONTRADICTING WHAT
THE TERMS OF THE
RELATIONSHIP ARE.

Maureen says YEAH AND I GUESS
HE'S GOT TO DISID HOW HE
MIGHT FEEL ABOUT THAT.

Wendy says IT SOUNDED
TO ME LIKE THEY WENT INTO
THIS RELATIONSHIP BOTH
SAYING WE'RE THOUGHT READY
TO COMMIT AND I'M WONDER
ONE OF THE REASONS
SHE'S NOT READY IS IF SHE
REALLY ISN'T FINISHED WITH
THE LAST RELATIONSHIP,
HASN'T FINISHED WITH THIS
KIND OF MOURNING, GETTING
OVER PERIOD.
SHE MAY HAVE CLEARLY ENDED
IT AND NOT WANT TO BE BACK
WITH THIS PERSON BUT I THINK
OFTEN THERE'S A PERIOD
BEFORE -- WHERE WE HAVE SAID
GOOD-BYE, WHERE WE'VE SAID
GOOD-BYE, FEEL COMPLETE AND
ARE READY TO MOVE AHEAD.

Maureen asks SHOULD HE BE
WORRIED ABOUT TALKING THIS
WITH HER?

Joan says SOUNDS
LIKE HE'S REALLY WANTING TO
BE COMPASSIONATE.
HE'S FEELING COMPASSION AND
CERTAINLY EXPRESSING IT IS A
WONDERFUL GIFT.
AND WOULD ENHANCE THE
RELATIONSHIP.
AND IF IT NATURALLY EVOLVES
INTO SOMETHING MORE INTIMATE
AND MEANINGFUL FOR BOTH OF
THEM --

Maureen says THEN FINE.

JOAN says
ABSOLUTELY.

Maureen says ALL RIGHT, GOOD
LUCK, BRIAN.
THANK YOU.
HERE IS AN E-MAIL NO, NAME.
I HAD GREAT SEX BUT IT'S
DEAD NOW.
I FEEL I KNOW EVERYTHING
ABOUT MY WIFE'S BODY.
IT'S REALLY LIKE A BOOK.
I READ MILLIONS OF TIMES.
SO IT'S GETTING BORING.
DON'T GET ME WRONG.
SHE'S A NICE LADY.
ALSO THE FACT THAT I SEE
EVERYDAY SO MANY YOUNG WOMEN
MAKES ME FEEL SOMETHING'S
MISSING IN SEX.
TO BE FRANK, I WANT A
YOUNGER FEMALE BODY.
WHAT CAN I DO?
OF COURSE I DON'T WANT TO
LEAVE.
OTHER THAN THE SEX, SHE'S
GREAT.
WENDY?

Wendy says WELL,
THAT'S A HARD ONE.
I GUESS, YOU KNOW, I THINK
AS WE GROW OLDER, OUR BODIES
DO CHANGE, AND, YOU KNOW,
I'M SURE HIS BODY'S CHANGED
JUST AS HER BODY'S
CHANGED.
AND IT'S LEARNING TO
APPRECIATE EACH OTHER WITH
THAT.
AND I'M WONDERING IF THERE'S
REALLY SOMETHING ELSE GOING
ON.
HE'S SAYING EVERYTHING'S
GREAT, BUT I WONDER WHAT
THIS --

Maureen asks IS THIS A
MID-LIFE CRISIS?
IS THIS WHERE THEY BUY THE
SPORTS CAR AND THE NEXT
THING YOU KNOW..?

Wendy says YEAH, THAT
HE'S LOOKING FOR SOMETHING
OR MAYBE THINKING HE'S
MISSED SOMETHING.
AND IT MIGHT BE SOMETHING HE
NEEDS TO LOOK AT.
FOR HIMSELF.
LIKE WHAT IS THE MEANING OF
THIS?

Maureen says IMAGINE HER
DEVASTATION THOUGH, IF HE
EVER ACTUALLY TELLS HER THAT
THIS IS WHAT HE'S THINKING.
YOU KNOW?
THAT WOULD BE -- WOULDN'T
THAT JUST BE CRUEL, JOAN?
I MEAN --

Joan says FOR HIM TO
SHARE THAT HE'S NOT
APPRECIATING HER PHYSICAL
BEING?
YEAH.
AND I'M WONDERING AS WENDY
HAS SAID, IF HE ISN'T IN
FACT AS SATISFIED WITH
EITHER HIMSELF AND THE STAGE
OF HIS OWN LIFE, AND THE
STAGE OF THE RELATIONSHIP.
IT SOUNDS AS THOUGH HE'S
BECOME ALMOST EXCLUSIVELY,
VISUALLY ORIENTED IN LOOKING
AT THE WHOLE RELATIONSHIP
AND PERHAPS, YOU KNOW, HE
NEEDS TO -- THEY NEED TO
CONSIDER COUNSELLING OR THEY
NEED TO ENJOY LIFE IN A MORE
WHOLE WAY.

Maureen says RIGHT.
ALL RIGHT, WE'RE ABOUT THE
LAST MINUTE OF THE PROGRAMME,
AND I WANT TO THANK YOU
BOTH.
BUT ACTUALLY, SOMETHING HAS
ARRIVED DURING THE SHOW FOR
VALENTINE'S DAY FOR JOAN, I
BELIEVE.

An assistant hands Maureen a box with flowers. Maureen, then, hands them to Joan.

Maureen continues AND JOAN, THESE ARE -- THESE
ARE FOR YOU.
SO WHO ARE THEY FROM?
OH, YOUR HUSBAND.
WOULDN'T THAT BE
EMBARRASSING IF THEY WEREN'T
FROM HER HUSBAND AFTER ALL
THE TALKING.
SO THAT'S NICE, HUH?

Joan says THAT'S
VERY NICE.

Maureen continues SO YOU CAN GET
IT ON TV.
I HOPE SOMEBODY'S GETTING
THIS ON TAPE.
I WENT TO SWISS CAL LAY LAST
NIGHT.
WHAT ABOUT YOU, WENDY?
ANYTHING?

Wendy says WELL I
JUST GOT BACK FROM A TRIP
AND MY HUSBAND ACTUALLY
BOUGHT PE A WATCH FOR
VALENTINE'S DAY.

Maureen says OH, THAT'S
LOVELY.

Wendy says AND WE
PICKED IT OUT TOGETHER,
WHICH WAS REALLY IMPORTANT
TO ME --

Maureen says YOU DON'T TRUST
HIM TO PICK IT OUT.
JUST ADMIT IT.
ALL RIGHT, THAT WAS GREAT.
BOTH OF YOU, THANKS FOR
DOING THIS.
HAPPY VALENTINE'S DAY.

Joan says THANK YOU,
DOUG.

Maureen says AND THANK YOU TO
ALL OF YOU FOR YOUR CALLS.
JOAN SINCLAIR IS A COUPLES
AND FAMILY THERAPIST AND A
HAPPY WIFE AND WENDY TRAINOR
A FAMILY THERAPIST.

A slate appears on screen. It reads “Institute of Family Living. 416-487-3613. wwwIFL.on.ca.”

Maureen continues JOAN CAN BE REACHED AT THE
INSTITUTE OF FAMILY LIVING,
416-487-3613, WWW.IFL.ON.CA.

The slate changes to “Wendy Trainor. 416-690-6158.”

Maureen continues WENDY TRAINOR IS A SEX
THERAPIST AND SHE CAN BE
REACHED AT AREA CODE
416-690-6158.

The slate changes to “More To Life. www.tvo.org/moretolife.”

Maureen continues NOW WENDY BROUGHT ALONG A
LOT OF GREAT BOOKS THAT SHE
RECOMMENDS TO COUPLES ABOUT
SEX AND RELATIONSHIPS.
YOU'LL FIND A LIST OF THOSE
ON OUR WEBSITE.
WWW.TVO.ORG/MORETOLIFE
AND THAT’S OUR SHOW FOR TODAY
I HOPE YOU’LL TUNE IN AGAIN
MONDAY THROUGH FRIDAY
AT ONE O’ CLOCK.

Watch: Sex and Relationships