Transcript: Mental Health | Nov 06, 2000

(music plays)
In animation, the title appears inside the shape of a house: “More to health.”

The opening sequence shows a wooden table with a small lit candle as several words fly by: Nutrition, medicine, prevention, treatment, health.
Fast clips show different sets of hands performing activities on the table such as pulling petals from a daisy, drawing a big red heart, tuning a violin, flipping through the pages of a book, cooking, and pouring a glass of red wine.
In animation, the title appears inside the shape of a house: “More to life.”

Then, Maureen Taylor appears in a studio with yellow walls and a small TV set in the background, which reads “More to life.”

Maureen is in her late thirties, with wavy blond hair in a bob. She's wearing a blue blazer over a blue blouse.

She says IF YOU'RE A HOCKEY FAN, YOU
KNOW RON ELLIS.
HE PLAYED FOR THE TORONTO
MAPLE LEAFS IN THE '60s AND
FOR TEAM CANADA IN '72.
BUT AFTER RETIRING FROM
HOCKEY, RON ELLIS STRUGGLED
FOR YEARS WITH DEPRESSION.
HE'S NOT ALONE BUT MEN ARE
LESS LIKELY THAN WOMEN TO
SEEK HELP, PUTTING THEM AT
GREATER RISK

(music plays)

A clip plays on screen that shows slow-motion sequences of hockey players on the field. They wear red jerseys.

A male voice says BEING A PRO HOCKEY PLAYER,
THAT BECAME A BIG PART OF
WHO I WAS, AND I HAD TO LIVE,
BREATHE IT DAY IN AND DAY
OUT.
EVERYTHING I TOOK ON, I
BECAME VERY SERIOUS ABOUT IT.

The man speaking appears on screen with a caption that reads “Ron Ellis. Former NHL Player.”
Ron is in his fifties, clean-shaven, with receding gray hair. He’s wearing a gray polo shirt.

He continues I THINK I'M A BIT OF A
PERFECTIONIST, THAT COULD BE
ONE OF MY PROBLEMS THAT LED
UP TO THE END RESULT OF
DEPRESSION.
EVERYTHING I TOOK ON, I TOOK
ON TO DO WELL.
NOW WHETHER IT WAS SCHOOL,
OTHER SPORTS, SO WHEN I
PLAYED THE GAME OF HOCKEY, I
WANTED TO DO WELL.
I WANTED TO BE THE BEST.
AFTER MY TENTH YEAR OR SO AT
THE END OF THE SEASON I
WOULD BE THOROUGHLY
EXHAUSTED, EXHAUSTED
EMOTIONALLY BS MENTALLY,
PHYSICALLY, AND I KNEW I HAD
TO GET AWAY.
I DIDN'T IDENTIFY IT AS
DEPRESSION AT THAT TIME.
BUT WHEN I LOOK BACK, I
THINK THAT HAD TO BE A MAJOR
PART.
THE FIRST THING I DID WHEN I
LEFT THE GAME I TAUGHT
SCHOOL FOR A YEAR.
AND ACCORDINGLY I WAS DOING
A GOOD JOB BUT BY THE END OF
THAT SCHOOL YEAR, I WAS
REALLY GOING THROUGH SOME
EMOTIONAL BAD TIMES AND
STARTING TO WITHDRAW.
THAT'S HARD TO DO WHEN YOU
GROW UP IN FRONT OF A CLASS
EACH MORNING, BUT THE SIGNS
WERE THERE.

A woman sits next to Ron on a floral couch. She’s in her fifties, with long wavy blond hair, and wears a black shirt.

She says AND SEE, HE WASN'T
HIMSELF AT ALL.
HE DIDN'T WANT TO SEE
FRIENDS AT ALL OR FAMILY,
AND I THOUGHT, “WHAT IS
GOING ON HERE?”
I COULD START TO SEE
SOMETHING HAPPENING, BUT HE
TOOK THAT SUMMER OFF BEFORE
HE STARTED HIS NEXT CAREER.
WE HAVE GONE THROUGH SEVERAL
CAREERS SINCE HOCKEY.

(LAUGHING)

Fast clips show a sporting store and hockey players gearing up.

Ron narrates WE BUILT THIS BEAUTIFUL
STAR, IT WAS A HIGH END
SPORTING GOODS STORE IN
DOWNTOWN BRAMPTON, AND BOY,
IF THIS WAS SUCCESSFUL WE
WERE GOING TO HELP OTHERS,
WE WERE GOING TO HELP KIDS
AND WE GOT PRETTY EXCITED
ABOUT IT BUT UNFORTUNATELY
OUR TIMING WASN'T THE BEST.
1986 WAS A DOWN TIME IN THE
ECONOMY AND WITHIN A FEW
MONTHS, I REALIZED THAT
EVERYTHING WE OWNED WAS ON
THE LINE.

As the woman reappears, a caption reads “Jan Ellis.”

Jan says HE WAS GETTING THINNER
AND THINNER AND THINNER, AND
HE WAS ALWAYS SWEATING.
JUST CONSTANTLY SWEATING.
AND I KNEW HE WASN'T
SLEEPING BECAUSE HE WOULDN'T
COME HOME FROM THE STORE
UNTIL TWO OR THREE IN THE
MORNING AND HE'D BE UP AT
SIX AND HE'D BE BACK, AND
JUST A DREADFUL GREY COLOUR.

Ron says AS A MATTER OF FACT, I
FORCED MYSELF TO GO TO THE
STORE THIS ONE PARTICULAR
MORNING, AND SHE DIDN'T WANT
ME TO GO, BUT AGAIN MY PRIDE
GOT IN THE WAY, I GOTTA KEEP
TREKKING, I GOTTA KEEP DOING
THIS.
I GOT MYSELF IN THIS
POSITION, I'M GOING TO GET
OUT OF IT SOMEHOW.
AND I WENT TO THAT STORE
THAT MORNING, WENT UP TO MY
OFFICE AND I'LL NEVER FORGET IT.
THAT WAS, THAT WAS THE DAY I CRASHED.

A black and white sequence shows Ron walking up to a desk.

He narrates
I GOT UP TO MY OWN OFFICE,
IT WAS A PRIVATE OFFICE,
SORT OF OVERLOOKED THE STORE.
AND I SAW SOME THINGS ON THE
DESK, I SAW SOME PHONE
MESSAGES I HAD TO RETURN AND,
AND... AND I THINK BASICALLY
WHAT HAPPENED, I JUST SAID
“I CAN'T DO THIS ANYMORE.”
I TAKE MY RESPONSIBILITIES
SERIOUSLY, AND WHEN I ASKED
THIS YOUNG LADY TO MARRY ME
I WAS GOING TO TAKE CARE OF
HER AND NOW I'VE RISKED
EVERYTHING WE HAD.

A black and white clip shows Ron walking down a street.

Then, a man appears on screen with a caption that reads “Doctor Edgardo Perez. Psychiatrist.”
Edgardo is in his late forties, clean-shaven, with short salt and pepper hair. He’s wearing glasses, a red shirt, and an iridescent tie.

He says HAVING HIGH EXPECTATIONS
OF YOURSELF, IF YOU HAVE
DONE REALLY WELL IN WHATEVER
YOU DO, YOUR JOB, YOUR
PERFORMANCE, ANY OTHER
ACTIVITIES AND YOU BEGIN TO
SEE YOU CANNOT CONTINUE WITH
THE SAME LEVEL OF
ACHIEVEMENT, IF YOU HAVE
INVESTED A LOT OF YOURSELF
AND ENERGY AND YOU SEE
YOURSELF THROUGH THAT JOB OR
YOU SEE YOURSELF THROUGH
THAT POSITION, AND YOU LOSE
THAT, OR YOU SEE THE
POTENTIAL OF LOSING THAT
THAT MAY LEAD TO A
DEPRESSION.

Ron says SEE, ALL THROUGH MY
CAREER AS A PROFESSIONAL
ATHLETE, ONE OF THE THINGS
YOU DO NOT SHOW OR TRY NOT
TO SHOW TOO TO YOUR
TEAMMATES OR THE OPPOSITION
IS ANY WEAKNESS AT ALL.

A black and white point-of-view clip shows Ron walking into an office and talking to a receptionist.

He narrates
With Dr. KELLY'S HELP,
AND JANUARY'S PERSUASION,
BECAUSE THIS WAS NOT
SOMETHING I WANTED, RON
ELLIS WANTED TO DO, BUT AT
THAT POINT MY ONLY HOPE WAS
TO CONSIDER THE CENTRE.
IT'S EVEN HARD TO SAY, IT
WAS SO TOUGH ME ME, MY PRIDE
TO SAY I HAVE TO RESORT TO
THIS.
THIS IS A WONDERFUL,
WONDERFUL HOSPITAL, AND I
TRY TO SUPPORT THEM AS MUCH
AS I CAN.
BECAUSE I KNOW WITHOUT THEM
I MIGHT NOT BE HERE TODAY,
YOU KNOW?

Doctor Perez says SUICIDE IS A MAJOR CONCERN.
SUICIDE IS HIGHER IN males.
BY SUICIDE I MEAN COMPLETED
SUICIDES.
SOMEBODY WHO REALLY KILLED
THEIR THEMSELVES, NOT AN
ATTEMPT.
THE PERCENTAGE OF MALES WHO
TRY TO KILL THEMSELVES AND
SUCCEED IS MUCH HIGHER.

Ron says I THINK THE WHOLE PERIOD
OF MY FIRST VISIT TO
HOMEWOOD HAD TO DO WITH
SHAME.
THAT I GOT TO THIS POINT IN
MY LIFE.
THAT I HAD TO GO TO THIS
FACILITY FOR HELP, BECAUSE I
ALWAYS FELT I WAS A
SELF-MADE GUY.

Doctor Perez says SO WHEN A MALE BEGIN TO
MANIFEST THE SIGNS OF
DEPRESSION, WHICH
INDIVIDUALS MAY SEE THAT AS
WEAKNESS, MAY LEAD TO A
SENSE OF FEELING ASHAMED
THAT THIS IS HAPPENING TO
THEM, THAT WE SHOULD HAVE
THE ABILITY TO COPE.
AND BECAUSE OF THAT, THEN
THEY BECOME MORE WITHDRAWN
AND THEY RETURN FURTHER
MECHANISMS TO COPE WITH
THAT.
FOR EXAMPLE THEY MAY BEGIN
TO DRINK MORE AND THEY MAY
FIND WAYS TO CALM DOWN THE
SENSE OF STHAIM THEY MAY
HAVE.

A clip shows a support group meeting in which about ten men sit in a circle and talk.

One man says WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT
YOUR THINKING, WELL I HAVE
TO ACCEPT THAT SOME OF THE
THINKING I HAVE IS DISTORTED,
MAYBE.

Another man, with a moustache, says I'VE NEVER TALKED TO
ANYBODY ABOUT THIS, SO TO
HEAR OTHER PEOPLE TALKING
ABOUT IT CERTAINLY IS A
HELP.
BUT HOW DO YOU GO ABOUT
TRYING TO CHANGE THE
PATTERNS THAT YOU'VE ALREADY
SET UP?
I DON'T KNOW HOW TO DO THAT.

A third man says YOU CHOSE TO BE PART OF
THIS GROUP, AND YOU'VE
STARTED TO SHARE SO THINGS.
IT'S GOING TO TAKE SOMETIME.

Ron says ONE OF THE PROBLEMS WITH
DEPRESSION, YOU THINK YOU'RE
THE ONLY ONE.
NO ONE ELSE HAS THIS
PROBLEM.
THERE MUST BE SOMETHING
REALLY WRONG WITH YOU.
BUT ALL OF A SUDDEN I'M ON A
FLOOR WITH MANY OTHER MEN
AND WOMEN FROM ALL
PROFESSIONS.
SOME VERY WEALTHY, SCHOOL
TEACHER, POLICEMEN, CEOs.

Doctor Perez says GROUP THERAPY IS ONE OF
THE BEST POSSIBLE TECHNIQUES
TO HELP PATIENTS.
AND REMEMBER THAT WE ALL
HAVE A SENSE OF WE NEED TO
BELONG.
AND ALSO THEY WANT TO FEEL
LIKE WE'RE NOT THE ONLY ONE.
WE CALL THAT IN GROUP
THERAPY THE SENSE OF
UNIVERSALITY.
WE'RE NOT ALONE.

Ron says I LOOKED AROUND WITH THE
GROUP OF PEOPLE ON THE FLOOR
WITH ME, THAT WE ARE ALL IN
THE 45 TO 55 AGE BRACKET.
AND A LOT OF THINGS ARE
STARTING TO HAPPEN, KIDS ARE
LIVING HOME, PARENTS ARE
PASSING AWAY, YOU REALIZE
YOUR CAREER IS AT A PLATEAU.
MANY, MANY THINGS ARE ALL
COMING TOGETHER, AND IT
BECOMES SO HEAVY YOU JUST
CAN'T BRING UP THE RESERVES,
PROBABLY PARTLY BECAUSE OF
AGE --

Doctor Perez says TREATMENT AND DEPRESSION
IS AN AREA THAT IS OPEN.
THERE'S TREMENDOUS
OPPORTUNITY FOR TREATMENT
THESE DAYS.
WE HAVE THE BEST POSSIBLE
MEDICATIONS THAT WE HAVE
EVER HAD.
SOME OF THE MEDICATIONS THAT
WE HAVE TO TREAT DEPRESSION
NOW ARE BETTER THAN MANY THE
MEDICATIONS WE HAVE TO TREAT
OTHER PHYSICAL DISORDERS.
THE EFFECTIVENESS OF
TREATMENT FOR DEPRESSION IS
CLOSE TO 75 TO 80 percent.

Clips show Ron and Jan walking a dog in the woods. They look happy.

Ron says IT'S TAKEN TIME, IT'S
TAKEN FOUR YEARS FOR ME TO
GET TO THE POINT WHERE I CAN
SAY OK, I'VE FOUGHT THIS
THING TOOTH AND NAIL, AND NO,
I'M NOT SUPERMAN.
I HAVE TO BE ON THIS
MEDICATION IN MY LIFE SO I
CAN PERFORM IN MY JOB AND
LOOK AFTER MY FAMILY AND BE
A RESPONSIBLE CITIZEN, THEN
THAT'S WHAT I'LL DO.

Jan says I AM JUST SO THANKFUL TO
SEE RONNIE THE WAY HE IS,
THE MAN I MARRIED, THE MAN
THAT I GREW UP WITH FROM
CHILDHOOD.

Ron says I THINK THIS WHOLE TIME
OF OUR LIFE, THIS TEN-YEAR
PERIOD WHEN WE'VE FOUGHT
THIS DEPRESSION, HAS TAUGHT
ME MANY GOOD LESSONS.
AND I THINK THROUGH THIS
PROCESS, AND BECAUSE OF MY
FAITH, OUR FAITH THAT WE
HAVE, I THINK WE REALLY
UNDERSTAND WHAT IT MEANS TO
TAKE ONE DAY AT A TIME.

The clip ends.

Back in the studio, Maureen says
MY GUEST THIS
AFTERNOON HELPS MEN AND
WOMEN DEAL WITH DEPRESSION
AND OTHER MENTAL HEALTH
CONDITIONS.
Dr. TY TURNER IS A
PSYCHIATRIST AT St. JOSEPH'S
HEALTH CENTRE IN TORONTO.

Doctor Turner is in his late forties, clean-shaven, with short wavy brown hair. He’s wearing a black suit, blue shirt, and striped red tie.

Maureen continues IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT
DEPRESSION, SCHIZOPHRENIA,
DRUGS AND TREATMENT, PLEASE
GIVE US A CALL.

A caption reads "416-484-2727. 1-888-411-1234."
Then, it changes to "moretolife@tvo.org"

Maureen says AND WELCOME BACK.
IT'S NICE TO SEE YOU AGAIN.

Doctor Turner says GOOD TO BE
HERE, THANK YOU.

Maureen says HOW TYPICAL IS RON
ELLIS' STORY OF HIS BATTLE
WITH DEPRESSION?

The caption changes to "Doctor Ty Turner. Psychiatrist."

Doctor Turner says I THINK
IT'S VERY TYPICAL.
WHEN DEPRESSION IS
EXPERIENCED BY A MAN IS
SOMEWHAT DIFFERENT FROM THE
WAY IT'S EXPERIENCED BY A
WOMAN.
THERE'S A LOT IN THIS ABOUT
NOT SHOWING WEAKNESS.
IT GOES AGAINST THE MALE
ROLE TO SHOW WEAKNESS, AND
PARTICULARLY IF YOU'RE A
HOCKEY PLAYER.
BUT IN A WAY, A LOT OF MEN
PLAY A FORM OF HOCKEY.

Maureen says RIGHT.

Doctor Turner says AND IT'S
ABOUT HAVING TO USE YOUR
ELBOWS, BE Aggressive, GET
AHEAD, TAKE CARE OF YOUR
TEAMMATES, LOOK AFTER YOUR
FAMILY, YOUR FRIENDS.
THERE'S DUTY, OBLIGATION AND
RESPONSIBILITY.
AND WHEN A PERSON BEGINS TO
GET DEPRESSED AND CAN'T
FULFILL THAT DUTY IN THE
SAME WAY THEY BEGIN TO FEEL
WEAK AND THEN SHAME SETS IN.
Dr. PARIS REALLY MADE THE
POINT ABOUT SHAME.
WITH SHAME THERE'S A SENSE
YOU NO LONGER BELONG.
YOU'RE NOT A MEMBER OF THE
PLATOON ANYMORE, AND THAT'S
WHY COMING INTO A GROUP AND
TALKING ABOUT WHAT IT'S LIKE
BEING DEPRESSED WITH OTHER
MEN CAN BE PARTICULARLY
HELPFUL.
GIVE YOU A SENSE OF
BELONGING ONCE AGAIN.

Maureen says SO WHAT IS YOUR
FIRST LINE OF TREATMENT WHEN
SOMEBODY, A MAN OR WOMAN
WALKS INTO YOUR OFFICE AND
IS TALKING ABOUT PERHAPS
BEING DEPRESSED.

Doctor Turner says IT'S ABOUT
ASKING THE RIGHT QUESTIONS,
IT'S ABOUT SHAKING THE
PERSON'S HAND, LOOKING THEM
IN THE EYE AND TREATING THEM
AS IF THEY ARE A PART OF THE
HUMAN RACE.
IT'S ABOUT CONVEYING RESPECT
AND DIGNITY DURING THE
INTERVIEW.
AND A LOT OF THE QUESTIONS
HAVE TO DO WITH EXPLORING
HOW IT FEELS TO BE
DEPRESSED.
WHAT IT FEELS LIKE MENTALLY,
ABOUT THE HOPELESSNESS,
ABOUT THE GUILT, THE SHAME.
AND ALSO WHAT IT CAN FEEL
LIKE PHYSICALLY IN TERMS OF
LOW ENERGY, LOW APPETITE,
POOR SLEEP, ACHES AND PAINS,
HEADACHES HAPPENING,
SHAKINESS, HEART POUNDING,
FUNNY HOT AND COLD FEELINGS,
AND A BIG ONE THAT DOESN'T
GET SPOKEN ABOUT OFTEN
ENOUGH AND THAT IS ABOUT
SHAKES IN SEXUAL FUNCTION.
IT'S VERY COMMON.
IN FACT WHEN I WAS GOING
THROUGH MEDICAL SCHOOL IT
WAS OFTEN SAID THE MOST
SENSITIVE INDICATOR OF
DEPRESSION IN A MALE IS
LIBIDO.
THE APPETITE FOR SEXUAL
ACTIVITY.
IT'S IMPORTANT TO AND THAT
QUESTION.
THAT'S ONE OF THE FIRST
THINGS TO GO AND ONE OF THE
LAST THINGS TO COME BACK.
AND THERE TENDS TO BE QUITE
A LOT OF RHETT SENS AND
SHAME ABOUT THAT PART OF THE
EXPERIENCE OF BEING
DEPRESSED.

Maureen says SOME OF THE
MEDICATIONS AND THIS MAY BE
MORE FOR SCHIZOPHRENIA THAN
DEPRESSION BUT I'VE READ
THEY CAN HAVE AN EFFECT ON
LIBID SCOMPOMD SEX DRIVE AND
THE INABILITY TO HAVE AN
ORGASM, WHICH MAKES THEM NOT
WANT TO TAKE IT.

Doctor Turner says VERY MUCH SO.
THEY VERY MUCH AFFECT ORGASM,
DELAY IT OR MAKE IT
IMPOSSIBLE TO ACHIEVE.
THERE'S ALSO A TENDENCY TO
REDUCE SEXUAL APPETITE BUT
THAT'S LESS THAN A PROBLEM
OF INHIBITING OR GAMPL.
THAT WAS MORE WITH THE
MEDICATIONS WE USED TO USE.
NOWADAYS WE CAN REASSURE A
MAN WHO'S DEPRESSED, WHO HAS
CHOSEN TO TAKE THESE
MEDICATIONS THAT IT'S NOT
NECESSARY TO EXPERIENCE
SEXUAL DYSFUNCTION.
THERE IS A NEW GROUP OF
MEDICATIONS THAT ARE OUT
THAT ARE MUCH LESS LIKELY TO
DO THAT.
AND EVEN IF THE PERSON'S ON
AN OLDER MEDICATION, THE
PERSON'S FEELING BETTER,
THEIR RELATIONSHIP'S BACK IN
LINE AGAIN, BUT THEY'RE
STILL HAVING SEXUAL
DYSFUNCTION THERE ARE ALL
SORTS OF STRATEGIES THAT BE
UNDER TAKEN.
OFTEN IT'S ABOUT ADDING A
LITTLE DOSE OF ANOTHER
MEDICATION AND THAT CAN HELP
PERSON REGAIN THE SEXUAL
FUNCTION.
IT'S NECESSARY TO FEEL ALIVE
TO FEEL LIKE A MAN.

Maureen says ONCE YOU'RE TREATED
WITH MEDICATION FOR A MENTAL
ILLNESS, IS THAT PRETTY MUCH
THE TREATMENT FOR THE REST
OF YOUR LIFE?

Doctor Turner says NO IT
DEPENDS ON THE OVERALL PICTURE.
A PERSON THAT'S HAD
DEPRESSION ON AND OFF FOR
YEARS AND YEARS WILL OFTEN
CHOOSE TO TAKE
ANTIDEPRESSANT MEDICATION
INDEFINITELY.
BUT FOR SOMEBODY WHO'S HAD
ONE EPISODE, SAY IT'S THE
FIRST EPISODE IN THEIR LIFE,
IT'S LIKE RON ELLIS, IT'S
WITH ALL THE CHANGES THAT
CAN TAKE PLACE IN YOUR LIFE,
SAY WHEN YOU'RE BECOMING
MIDDLE AGED, THIS SINGLE
EPISODE DEPRESSION, OFTEN
NINE TO TWELVE MONTHS IS
GOOD ENOUGH.
NOW SOMETIMES THE DEPRESSION
CAN COME BACK, AND IT'S
IMPORTANT FOR THE PERSON TO
BE ALERT TO THAT
POSSIBILITY.
BUT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A
TEMPORARY PERIOD OF
TREATMENT FOR THE MOST PART.

Maureen says OKAY.
CAN WE TALK MORE ABOUT
ANOTHER MENTAL HEALTH ISSUE
IN YOUTH IN ONTARIO AND
THAT'S AT PROPOSED BRIAN'S LAW.
CAN YOU TELL US WHAT THAT IS?

Doctor Turner says BRIAN'S
LAW, BILL 68 WAS NAMED AFTER
A MAN WHOSE FIRST NAME WAS
BRIAN, WHO WAS KILLED BY A
VERY SEVERELY MENTALLY ILL
PERSON WHO WASN'T RECEIVING
TREATMENT IN REACTION TO
THAT, VARIOUS GROUPS,
INCLUDING THE SCHIZOPHRENIA
SOCIETY AND ORGANIZED
MEDICAL GROUPS PUSHED TO
DEVELOP CHANGES TO THE
MENTAL HEALTH ACT.
THAT IS THE LAW THAT
REGULATES THE MENTAL HEALTH
SYSTEM IN THIS PROVINCE.
CHANGES TO HOPEFULLY PREVENT
FUTURE SITUATIONS LIKE WHAT
HAPPENED WITH BRIAN AND HIS
FAMILY.
AND THERE ARE VARIOUS
ASPECTS TO THIS NEW
LEGISLATION THAT WILL GO
THROUGH, INCIDENTALLY,
DECEMBER THE 1st.

Maureen says SO ABOUT A MONTH.

Doctor Turner says YEAH, IT'S
ON ITS WAY.
AND IT'S GOING TO BE VERY
QUICK, IN FACT WE'RE QUITE
CONCERNED ABOUT OUR ABILITY
TO ADJUST TO THIS REALLY
WHAT WOULD BE A VERY
SIGNIFICANT CHANGE BUT THE
PRINCIPAL COMPONENTS HAVE TO
DO WITH OPENING UP THE
SITUATION WHEREBY POLICE CAN
BE CALLED INTO THE COMMUNITY
AND TAKE SOMEBODY AGAINST
THEIR WILL, IF NECESSARY, TO
A PSYCHIATRIC FACILITY FOR
EXAMINATION.
IN THE PAST THE POLICE HAD
TO ACTUALLY OBSERVE
DISTURBED BEHAVIOUR.
NOW THEY DON'T NEED TO DO
THAT THEY CAN GO ON A
REPORT.

Maureen says THIS IS PART OF THE
COMMUNITY TREATMENT ORDER
PORTION OF THE LAW.

Doctor Turner says THAT'S
ABOUT ANOTHER PART OF THE LAW.

Maureen says OH, OKAY.

Doctor Turner says I CALL
THIS THE SLEEPER PART.
THIS IS THE PART THAT WILL
ULTIMATELY IN MY OPINION
HAVE A GREATER AFFECT ON THE
WAY MENTAL HEALTH IS
DELIVERED AND THERE'S
ANOTHER PART OF THAT SLOOP
ARE PART AND THAT HAS TO DO
WITH OPENING UP THE CRITERIA
WHERE UNDER SOMEBODY CAN BE
HELD AGAINST THEIR WILL IF
NECESSARY FOR ASSESSMENT AND
TREATMENT.
THE TREATMENT ORDER PART,
WHICH IS VERY NEW, INVOLVES
A MEANS WHEREBY PEOPLE CAN
BE REQUIRED TO TAKE
TREATMENT AGAINST THEIR WILL,
IF NECESSARY, IN THE
COMMUNITY.
UP TO NOW, WE'VE ONLY HAD
MEANS OF CAUSING THAT TO
HAPPEN IN A HOSPITAL
SETTING.

Maureen says HOW DO YOU FEEL
ABOUT THAT IDEA?
NEVER MIND THE INTRICACIES
OF THIS PARTICULAR LAW, BUT
FORCING SOMEONE WITH A
MENTAL ILLNESS TO TAKE
TREATMENT AGAINST THEIR
WILL?
GOOD IDEA?
BAD IDEA?

Doctor Turner says WELL I'M
NEVER HAPPY WITH EVER HAVING
TO USE COERCION OR FORCE.
I THINK OCCASIONALLY TEASE
REQUIRED.
AND THAT WOULD BE IN A
SITUATION WHEREBY SOMEBODY
HAS A MENTAL ILLNESS THAT'S
DEMONSTRABLE, THAT'S
EVIDENT, AND WHEN THEY GO
OFF MEDICATION, OR UNLESS
THEY BECOME INVOLVED WITH
ALCOHOL OR DRUGS THEY BECOME
SICK AND THEN POSE A VERY
SIGNIFICANT RISK TO
THEMSELVES AND TO OTHER
PEOPLE.
AND THERE ARE SOME PEOPLE
WHO HAVE GONE ON AND OFF
THEIR MEDICATION AND END UP
IN THESE RISKY SITUATIONS
MULTIPLE TIMES IN THEIR LIVES.
THERE WOULD BE A CASE FOR
SUCH A PERSON TO BE INVOLVED
IN A COMMUNITY TREATMENT
ORDER.
I THINK WE HAVE TO WATCH
THOUGH THAT WE APPLY THIS
LEGISLATION ONLY WHERE IT'S
NEEDED.
AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT
REALLY THE PROTECTION OF THE
PERSON AND OF THEIR FAMILY
AND THEIR FRIENDS AND THEIR
NEIGHBOURS.

Maureen says WE'RE TALKING ABOUT
Dr. TIE TURNER, THE
PSYCHIATRIST AT St. JOSEPH'S
HEALTH CENTRE IN TORONTO.
IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT
MENTAL HEALTH, HERE ARE THE
NUMBERS.
IN TORONTO 416-484-2727.
LONG DISTANCE,
1-888-411-1234, OR E-MAIL
YOUR QUESTION TO moretolife@tvo.org
DONNA IS IN OAKVILLE.
WELCOME, DONNA.

The Caller says HELLO.

Maureen says HI AND YOUR
QUESTION, DONNA?

The Caller says MY QUESTION IS
THIS says MY HUSBAND WAS
DIAGNOSED WITH A MENTAL
ILLNESS THREE YEARS AGO AND
HE HAS BEEN ON MEDICATION
AND UNDER THE CARE OF
PSYCHIATRISTS NOW FOR THAT
WHOLE TIME.
THE PROBLEM IS HE DOESN'T
SEEM TO BE RESPONDING AS I
WOULD HAVE THOUGHT HE WOULD
HAVE.
AND WHAT I'VE NOTICED IN THE
LAST SIX MONTHS IS THAT
THERE ARE NOW PERIODS OF
INTENSE ANGER AND I'M JUST
WONDERING HOW MUCH THIS IS
RELATED TO THE DEPRESSION OR
HOW MUCH OF THIS IS HIM?
I'M FINDING HIM NOW VERY
CONTROLLING AND VERY ABUSIVE
MENTALLY AND I JUST DON'T
KNOW WHAT GOES ALONG WITH
THE DEPRESSION OR WHAT
DOESN'T.
I JUST DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS
NORMAL BEHAVIOUR OR
DEPRESSION OR IF HE'S JUST
NOT RESPONDING TO HIS
MEDICATION.

Maureen says DOES IT --.

Maureen says DOES IT HELP YOU
DOCTOR TO KNOW WITHOUT
KNOWING THE MEDICATION?

Doctor Turner says NOT MELS.
THE EASIEST ANSWER IS, IS IT
HIM OR THE MEDICATION, LOOK
BACK TO WHAT HE WAS LIKE
BEFORE HE WAS DEPRESSED.
WAS HE ANGRY?
DID HE HAVE A LOT OF ANGRY
IMPULSES AND THOUGHTS
BEFORE THEN OR IS THIS A NEW
THING THAT'S JUST EMERGED
SINCE HE'S BECOME DEPRESSED.
IF IT'S A NEW THING, IT CAN
BE ABOUT DEPRESSION.
SOME PEOPLE EXPERIENCE
DEPRESSION WHERE IT'S MAINLY
ABOUT SADNESS, ABOUT A SENSE
OF LOSS, OF GRIEF THAT GOES
ON AND ON AND ON.
OTHER TIMES IT CAN BE ABOUT
ANGER.
ANGER OVER WHAT I'VE LOST.
ANGER OVER HOW MY LIFE IS
NOT THE WAY IT USED TO BE.
AND SOMETIMES IT CAN BE
ANXIETY.
WORRY.
WORRY ABOUT ALL SORTS OF
THINGS.
WORRY THAT'S UNREMITTING AND
TORTURED AND KEEPS THE
PERSON UP LATE AT NIGHT.
SOME PEOPLE CAN HAVE ALL
THREE OF THOSE EMOTIONAL
TONES TO THEIR DEPRESSION IN
RESPECT OF WHAT COULD DONE
IN THATTUATION, I THINK IT
WOULD BE VERY IMPORTANT TO
HAVE A REASSESS AM.
HAVE A LOOK AT WHERE THIS
MIGHT BE COMING FROM, WHAT
COULD BE FEEDING IT.
WHAT ELSE COULD BE DONE WITH
THE MEDICATION.
AND I KNOW WE'VE SPOKEN A
LOT ABOUT MEDICATION SO FAR,
BUT I THINK IT'S REALLY
IMPORTANT TO LOOK AT OTHER
METHODS BESIDES MEDICATION
TO ADD TO THE MEDICATION.
ONE SUCH METHOD IS TALK
THAIMPLT OFTEN IT'S HELPFUL
IN TALK THERAPY WITH A
TRUSTED PERSON IN A
CONFIDENTIAL SITUATION.
FOR THE PERSON TO TALK ABOUT
WHAT'S LIKE BEING THEM.
WHAT SORT OF THOUGHTS,
FEELINGS KLATTER ABOUT IN
THEIR MINDS AND WHAT MIGHT
BE GENERATING ANGLE BER AND
HOW MIGHT THERE BE SOME
APPROACHES TO RESOLVING
THESE ANGRY THOUGHTS THAT
COULD REDUCE THE TENDENCY TO
FLY OFF THE HANDLE, BOOZE,
TEMPER --

Maureen says IS IT
APPROPRIATE FOR DONNA TO
TELL HER HUSBAND'S DOCTOR
ABOUT THESE FLAIR-UPS OF
ANGER?
BECAUSE HE MAY NOT BE
TELLING THE DOCTOR HIMSELF.
HE MAY NOT REALIZE HE'S
LASHING OUT AND BECOMING
ABUSIVE.

Doctor Turner says THAT'S A
DIFFICULT ONE.
I THINK IT'S REALLY
IMPORTANT THAT THE PERSON
HIMSELF SPEAK TO THE DOCTOR.
BUT I KNOW IT HAPPEN, WHEN
THE SPOUSE CAN SAY SPEAK TO
THE DOCTOR ABOUT THIS AND
THE SPOUSE CAN COME BACK AND
SAY I DID BUT OVERALL YOU
HAVE A SENSE THAT NOTHING
HAPPENED AND YOU BEGIN TO
DOUBT WHETHER OR NOT HE DID
SPEAK TO THE DOCTOR.
I THINK IN A SITUATION LIKE
THAT YOU DO WHAT YOU HAVE TO
DO AS A LOVING SPOUSE.
AND SOMETIMES WHAT YOU MIGHT
DO IS THEN CALL THE DOCTOR.
I THINK IT'S VERY HELPFUL TO
INFORM THE SPOUSE THAT YOU
DID THAT, SO THEY CAN BE
PREPARED.
I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT WHEN
YOU CALL THE DOCTOR TO BE
PREPARED FOR THE DOCTOR NOT
BEING ABLE TO GIVE YOU
INFORMATION, BECAUSE THE
DOCTOR'S BOUND BY RULES OF
CONFIDENTIALITY, BUT IT'S
IMPORTANT TO KNOW THAT
THERE'S NOTHING TO STOP YOU
GIVING THE DOCTOR
INFORMATION.
CONFIDENTIALITY IS ABOUT A
ONE-WAY SITUATION, ABOUT THE
DOCTOR GIVING YOU
INFORMATION AND NOT ABOUT
YOU GIVING THE DOCTOR
INFORMATION.
AND OFTEN AS A PSYCHIATRIST
I CAN SAY THAT INFORMATION
I'VE BEEN PROVIDED BY
FRIENDS AND FAMILY HAS BEEN
VITAL TO A RENEWED
UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT CAN BE
DONE TO HELP MY PATIENT.

Maureen says GOOD LUCK,
DONNA.
THANKS FOR YOUR CALL.
LARRY IS IN OTTAWA.
HELLO, LARRY.

The Caller says HELLO,
Dr. TURNER? I'VE HAD SEVERAL
DIFFERENT MEDICATIONS FOR
DEPRESSION OVER THE PAST
SEVERAL YEARS, NONE OF WHICH
REALLY WORKED, HOWEVER OVER
THE LAST TEN MONTHS OR SO
I'VE BEEN TALKING EPHIXER
AND NOW I FIND ALTHOUGH I'M
FEELING WELL AND COULD
FUNCTION, DURING A HECTIC
SITUATION I TEND TO GET
HYPERFOR TWO, THREE WEEKS
AND THEN AFTER THAT I GET
DOWN.
I'M WONDERING IF THERE'S ANY
HELP FOR THAT.

Doctor Turner says WELL, IF
THIS IS A NEW SITUATION
SINCE YOU'VE BEEN ON THE
EPHEXER I THINK IT WOULD BE
HELPFUL TO HAVE A REVIEW OF
THE MEDICATION.
I THINK WHENEVER THINGS
AREN'T GOING RIGHT IT'S
IMPORTANT TO IS CAN FOR A
REVIEW FROM THE FAMILY
DOCTOR OR PSYCHIATRIST, WHO
EVER IS PRESCRIBING THE
MEDICATION, AND SOMETIMES
IT'S HELPFUL TO ASK FOR
ANOTHER OPINION.
IN TERMS OF BEING HYPERFOR A
FEW WEEKS, EPHEXER IS A
MEDICATION THAT CAN HAVE A
STIMULATING EFFECT AND
SOMETIMES THERE ARE PERIODS
WHEN A PERSON ON THAT
MEDICATION CAN HAVE MORE
ENERGY AND BECOME A BIT MORE
IMPULSIVE AND CHARGE AROUND
AND HAVE DIFFICULTY
SLEEPING.
AND OCCASIONALLY LOSE THEIR
TEMPER.
I'M NOT SAYING IT'S COMMON
WITH THAT MEDICATION, BUT IT
CAN HAPPEN.
SO IT WOULD BE IMPORTANT TO
SEE IF THAT'S A POSSIBLE.
THE OTHER POS SINT IS THAT
IT COULD BE AN INTERACTION
WITH SOMETHING ELSE THAT THE
PERSON'S TAKING, ANOTHER
MEDICATION.
SOMETIMES ALCOHOL CAN BE A
FACTOR.
SOMETIMES IT CAN BE ABOUT A
MORE COMPLICATED MOOD
DISORDER THAT'S INVOLVED,
IT'S NOT JUST DEPRESSION BUT
MAYBE THERE'S A LITTLE BIT
OF A TENDENCY TO HAVE A BI
POLARITY OF THE MOOD, UPS
AND DOWNS.
I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT FRANK
MANIC DEPRESSIVE ILLNESS,
WHICH I DON'T GATHER IS THE
SITUATION HERE, BUT HAVING A
MINOR DEGREE OF THIS WHICH
CAN SOMETIMES MAN NEST AS --
MANIFEST AS UPS AND DOWNS
WHEN A PERSON'S ON
ANTIDEPRESSANT MEDICATION.
THE OTHER THING TO LOOK AT
IS MIGHT THERE BE SOMETHING
ELSE HAPPENING IN YOUR LIFE
THAT IS TRIGGERING THIS OR
MIGHT IT HAVE TO DO WITH
YOUR DAILY PATTERN, YOUR
EATING, SLEEPING, GETTING
RELAXATION, RECREATION,
EXERCISE, THOSE SORTS OF
THINGS SO I THINK IT'S
IMPORTANT TO UNDERGO AN
ANIMAL SIS.
TRY TO UNDERSTAND WHAT MIGHT
BE CAUSING THIS.

Maureen says OKAY THANKS VERY
MUCH, LARRY.
I'VE KNOWN A FEW PEOPLE WHO
HAVE BEEN TAKING ZOLOFT,
PROZAC, WHATEVER FOR
DEPRESSION AND EXPERIENCE A
PRETTY SUBSTANTIAL WEIGHT GAIN.
NOW THE DOCTOR WILL
SOMETIMES TELL THEM IT'S THE
NOT MEDICATION, BUT THESE
PEOPLE ARE CONVINCED THAT IT
IS, THAT THAT'S WHEN IT
STARTED.
I'M TALKING 50 POUNDS OR SO.
IS THAT A SIDE EFFECT?

Doctor Turner says IT CAN BE BUT I HAVE TO
SAY IT'S PRETTY UNCOMMON.
I HAVEN'T OBSERVED THAT AND
I'VE BEEN WORKING FAIRLY
CLOSELY WITH THESE
MEDICATIONS FOR QUITE A
WHILE NOW.
CERTAINLY SOME PEOPLE PUT ON
A LOT OF WEIGHT.
MORE LIKELY IT'S ABOUT A
SMALL AMOUNT OF WEIGHT.
WHAT'S MOST COMMON IS PEOPLE
WHO HAVE LOST WEIGHT POO PUT
IT BACK ON.

Maureen says ALL OF THESE PEOPLE WISH
THEY WERE IN THAT GROUP.
THEIR DOCTORS TELL THEM THEY
DON'T OBSERVE THAT IN PEOPLE
YET IF YOU GO ON THE
INTERNET EVERYBODY IN THE
CHAT ROOM HAS HAD THE SAME
EXPERIENCE.

Doctor Turner says I HAVE TO TREAT THAT
INFORMATION WITH ARE.
I CAN SAY IT'S NOT
INFORMATION THAT IS VERY
COMMONLY OBSERVED, BUT IT'S,
IT'S CERTAINLY POSSIBLE THIS
IS CONNECTED.
PEOPLE REACT DIFFERENTLY TO
THESE MEDICATION.
WHEN A MEDICATION IS BROUGHT
INTO THE MARKET, THERE'S
ALWAYS WIDESPREAD TESTING
THAT WILL LOOK AT DIFFERENT
TYPES OF SIDE EFFECTS AND
THAT CAN GIVE US SOME
INFORMATION ABOUT WHETHER A
PARTICULAR MEDICATION'S
GOING TO CAUSE WEIGHT GAIN
OR NOT.
WHAT REALLY TELLS US ABOUT A
MEDICATION IS ONCE IT'S BEEN
OUT AND HUNDREDS OF
THOUSANDS OF MILLIONS OF
PEOPLE HAVE BEEN USING THIS
MEDICATION.
WITH THESE MEDICATION, WE'RE
INTO THE MILLIONS AND WEIGHT
GAIN, WHILE IT HAS BEEN
OBSERVED IS NOT SEEN AS A
COMMON REACTION.

Maureen says HOW MUCH THIS IS
AN EXACT SCIENCE, TOO, IN
KNOWING WHICH MEDICATION YOU
WANT TO PRESCRIBE FOR A
PARTICULAR TYPE OF
DEPRESSION.
PAXIL IS ONE THE TOP TEN
DRUGS PRESCRIBED IN CANADA.
WE ALL KNOW THESE NAME,
PROZAC AND ZOLOFT, THEY TRIP
OFF THE TONGUE AS IF THEY'RE
OUT THERE IN EVERYBODY'S
MEDICINE CABINET.
HOW DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE
PATIENT NEEDS?

Doctor Turner says WELL IT'S LIKE ALL OF
MEDICINE THESE DAYS.
IT'S SOME SCIENCE AND IT'S
SOME ART.
AND SOMETIMES IT'S MORE ART
AND SOMETIMES MORE SCIENCE.
THERE IS SCIENCE THAT SHOWS
THAT SHE'S MEDICATIONS ARE
EFFECTIVE.
THAT'S UNDENIABLE.
RANDOMIZED CONTROL, DOUBLE
BLIND STUDIES WHERE THEY'VE
TAKEN LARGE GROUPS OF PEOPLE
WHO HAVE BEEN GIVEN THE
MEDICATION AND LARGE GROUPS
THAT ARE NOT GIVEN THE
MEDICATION, GIVEN PLACEBOS
AND THEY'RE ABLE TO SHOW
THAT THE GROUP THAT GETS THE
REAL MEDICATION DOES
SIGNATURELY BETTER SO THAT'S
THE SCIENCE.
BEYOND THAT, TO A CERTAIN
DEGREE, IT'S ABOUT A DOCTOR
CHOOSING A PARTICULAR
MEDICATION FOR A GIVEN
PATIENT, AND IT MIGHT BE
BASED ON THE SIDE EFFECT
PROFILE OF THE MEDICATION.
SOME MEDICATIONS CAUSE
SEDATION.
IF YOU HAVE THE KIND OF
PATIENT WHO'S SLEEPING ALL
THE TIME YOU DON'T WANT
SEDATION.
BUT IF YOU HAVE THE KIND OF
WHERE YOU CAN'T SLEEP, MAYBE
THAT'S THE ANTIDEPRESSANTS
FOR YOU.
OR YOU CAN TAKE WHAT'S
CALLED AN ADVERSE OR SIDE
EFFECT AND USE IT FOR SOME
GOOD.
THAT'S AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT
MIGHT DICTATE A CHOICE.
IF SEXUAL DYSFUNCTION IS AN
ISSUE, AND THAT CAN BE AN
ISSUE INCIDENTALLY WITH
MALES AND FEMALE, I KNOW
WE'VE TALKED PRINCIPALLY
ABOUT THE MALE ASPECT OF
THAT, WELL THEN IT'S
POSSIBLE TO CHANGE TO A
PARTICULAR ANTIDEPRESSANT OR
ADD ANOTHER SMALL AMOUNT OF
MEDICATION TO THE ORIGINAL
ANTIDEPRESSANT TO REDUCE OR
ELIMINATE THAT PROBLEM.

Maureen says OKAY.
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT MENTAL
HEALTH THIS AFTERNOON WITH
Dr. TY TURNER.
IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION CALL US...

The numbers and email reappear briefly.

Maureen says AND CATHERINE IS
IN OTTAWA.
HI CATHERINE.

The Caller says HI, HOW ARE YOU
DOING?

Maureen says GOOD, THANKS.

The Caller says I'M CALLING ABOUT
MY MOTHER WHO'S BEEN IN THE
ROYAL OTTAWA HOSPITAL FOR
QUITE A WHILE.
I'D SAY IT'S BEEN ABOUT TWO
YEARS OFF AND ON AND THE
DOCTORS THERE ARE LOOKING TO
PUT MY MOM INTO A LONG-TERM
FACILITY IN BROCK VILLE, BUT
MY MOTHER IS VERY MUCH NOT
INTERESTED IN GOING THERE
AND SHE HAS TOLD ME HERSELF
THAT SHE WOULD PRETEND THAT
SHE WOULD BE WELL IN ORDER
TO NOT GO THERE BECAUSE SHE
HAD A PAST EXPERIENCE THERE
13 YEARS AGO WHICH WAS VERY
NEGATIVE FOR HER I'M
WONDERING HOW TO DEAL WITH
THAT AND HOW TO HELP HER TO
MAKE THE RIGHT CHOICE.

Doctor Turner says WELL, I
THINK IT'S IMPORTANT IN THAT
SITUATION TO CAUSE YOUR
MOTHER TO HAVE ALL THE
INFORMATION SHE NEEDS IN
ORDER TO MAKE HER OWN BEST
CHOICE I THINK FOR ME IT'S
LOOKING AT CHOICE-MAKING OR
DECISION-MAKING AS A
CONTINUOUS PROCESS IN WHICH
AT SOME POINT THE PERSON MAY
SAY NO AND AT ANOTHER POINT
THE PERSON MAY SAY YES.
COULD GO THE OTHER WAY, THE
PERSON COULD START AUGHT
SAYING YES AND THEN END UP
WITH A NO.
AND I THINK THE BEST
POSSIBLE POSITION TO BE IN
HERE IS WITH THE MAXIMUM
AMOUNT OF INFORMATION.
WHAT IS THE CONDITION?
WHAT IS THE DIAGNOSIS?
WHAT IS THE PROGNOSIS?
WHY THIS PARTICULAR
FACILITY?
ARE THERE ANY POTENTIAL
ALTERNATIVES WHERE YOUR
MOTHER COULD BE SENT?
AND WHAT COULD BE DONE TO
EXPLORE THOSE ALTERNATIVES?
AND SOMETIMES THE FAMILY CAN
HELP.
SOMETIMES THE FAMILY CAN DO
RESEARCH.
THEY CAN ASK QUESTIONS, GO
TRAVELLING, LOOKING AT
DIFFERENT PLACES, GET ON THE
INTERNET AND THEY CAN
SOMETIMES COME OUT WITH
ALTERNATIVES THAT MAY NOT
HAVE BEEN APPARENT AT THE
TIME TO THOSE OF US WHO WORK
IN HOSPITALS.
SO I THINK THERE'S QUITE A
BIT YOU CAN DO.
WOULD BE VERY UNFORTUNATE IF
THIS WERE TO COME DOWN
EVENTUALLY TO YOUR MOTHER
BEING REQUIRED TO GO TO THIS
FACILITY AGAINST HER WILL IF
NECESSARY.
IN MY EXPERIENCE, MOST OF
THE TIME THAT DOESN'T HAVE
TO BE THE WAY IT TURNS OUT.

Maureen says I GUESS I'M A
LITTLE STARTLED THAT
SOMEBODY HAS TO STAY IN A
HOSPITAL FOR TWO YEARS
BECAUSE SHE'S BEING TREATED
FOR DEPRESSION AND THEN
THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT MOVING
HER TO -- I GUESS BROCK
VILLE'S A PSYCHIATRIC
FACILITY, RIGHT?
WE HAVE A -- WE STILL HAVE A
FEW OF THOSE AROUND THE
PROVINCE.
HOW SEVERE MUST THIS WOMAN'S
DEPRESSION BE IF THEY HAVE
TO ACTUALLY KEEP HER A PASS
SNILT.

Doctor Turner says POSSIBLY
CATHERINE CAN TELL US ABOUT
THAT BUT I WOULD SUSPECT
THIS IS A COMPLICATED
DEPRESSION IF THEY'RE
CONSIDERING A LONG-TERM
FACILITY.
COULD YOU TELL US SOME MORE,
CATHERINE?

The Caller says SURE.
SHE'S BEEN GOING THROUGH
DEPRESSION FOR QUITE A LONG
TIME.
THIS HAS BEEN KIND OF A
NUMBER OF YEARS, KIND OF
ISSUE.
THEY HAVE TRIED WHATEVER
THEY COULD.
DIFFERENT MEDICATIONS AND A
LOT OF IT JUST HASN'T WORKED
OR IT'S WORKED FOR A SHORT
PERIOD OF TIME AND THEY'VE
DONE ELECTRO SHOCK
TREATMENTS, TOO, AND IT JUST
SEEMS TO KIND OF GET
NOWHERE.
IT'S OKAY FOR MAYBE A FEW
WEEKS AND THEN SHE JUST
SLIDES.

Maureen says AND WHY DO THEY
HAVE TO -- THEY WANT TO MOVE
HER FROM THE ROYAL OTTAWA TO
BROCK SFLIL.

The Caller says BECAUSE THE ROYAL OTTAWA
IS A HOSPITAL FOR SHORT TERM
CARE AND NOT AS LONG AS IT'S
BEEN FOR MY MOTHER.

Doctor Turner says I THINK IT
WOULD BE IMPORTANT TO SAY
THAT THIS IS A VERY UNCOMMON
SITUATION BUT OF COURSE IT
CAN HAPPEN AND I'M JUST
WONDERING IS THERE ANY OTHER
ILLNESS INVOLVED HERE, CAT
SFLIN IS IT ALL ABOUT
DEPRESSION?

The Caller says YES, IT APPEARS
TO BE ALL ABOUT DEPRESSION.
THERE'S NOTHING MORE ABOUT
IT, I DON'T THINK.

Doctor Turner says SOMETIMES,
IF A PERSON HAS BEEN VERY
DEPRESSED FOR A LONG PERIOD
OF TIME, FINDS IT NOT ONLY
HARD TO FUNCTION BUT CAN
LOSE THEIR FUNCTION, CAN
ALMOST FORGET HOW TO BE
SOCIAL, HOW TO TALK TO
PEOPLE, CAN ALMOST FORGET
HOW TO MAKE TELEPHONE CALLS,
MANAGE THEIR MONEY, ORGANIZE
A DAY'S ACTIVITY, AND BECOME
VERY, VERY DEPENDENT AND
SOMETIMES SUCH A PERSON WILL
REQUIRE ONGOING CARE AND
SUPPORT IN A LONG-TERM CARE
FACILITY.
I'M JUST WONDERING IF THAT
HAS BEEN A COMPLICATION OF
THE LONG STANDING DEPRESSION
THAT THE -- THAT CATHERINE'S
MOTHER'S BEEN EXPERIENCING.

Maureen says THEY'RE WORRIED
THAT SHE JUST COULDN'T LIVE
ON HER OWN BECAUSE SHE
WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO FUNCTION
DAY TO DAY.
I GUESS IT'S SAD THAT IN THE
COMMUNITY WE DON'T HAVE THE
RESOURCES TO HELP SOMEONE
LIKE HER LIVE IN HER OWN
HOME AND GET THIS HELP IN
HER HOME.
IT'S EITHER THE LONG-TERM
CARE FACILITY OR SHE'S KIND
OF LEFT ON HER OWN.

Doctor Turner says ONCE AGAIN,
THIS IS AN UNCOMMON SITUATION.
USUALLY THERE ARE RESOURCES
ENOUGH IN THE COMMUNITY TO
HELP SUCH A PERSON.
BUT SOMETIMES IF A PERSON
NEEDS DAILY -- AND LET'S SAY
MORE THAN EIGHT HOURS A DAY
OF CARE IN THE HOME, YOU'RE
OFTEN TALKING ABOUT INCOME A
FACILITY.
UNLESS A FAMILY HAS
SUFFICIENT RESOURCES TO DO
THAT BUT NOWADAYS IT'S VERY
HARD FOR FAMILIES TO PRODUCE
THAT KIND OF EFFORT.
PEOPLE HAVE JOBS, FAMILIES
TO RAISE, AND SO
INCREASINGLY THIS MEANS
LONG-TERM CARE.

Maureen says OBVIOUSLY THEY
NEED TO TALK TO THE DOCTORS
MORE ABOUT THIS.
CATHERINE, I'M SORRY, IT'S A
BIG PROBLEM, NOT GOING TO BE
ABLE TO SOLVE IT RIGHT HERE
TODAY, BUT GOOD LUCK.
THANKS FOR YOUR CALL.
TOM IS IN TORONTO.
HI TOM.

The Caller says HI.

Maureen says HI, AND YOUR
QUESTION FOR Dr. TURNER.

The Caller says YES, I MEAN BASICALLY I'M
INTERESTED IN MAYBE BEING
ABLE TO TELL THE DIFFERENCE
BETWEEN MILD DEPRESSION AND
WHAT I GUESS YOU REFER TO AS
CLINICAL DEPRESSION.
I MEAN, OVER THE YEARS I'VE
HAD LIKE MOST PEOPLE BOUTS
OF MILD DEPRESSION, AND I'VE
SEEN THERAPISTS AND I'VE
ALWAYS COME OUT OF IT, I'VE
ALWAYS BEEN ABLE TO FUNCTION,
AND I GUESS I'VE REACHED THE
STAGE NOW WHERE WHEN I FEEL
I'VE A DOWN PERIOD, I FEEL
DEPRESSED, I BASICALLY JUST
DHARD TO BE A NORMAL
EXPERIENCE IN LIVING AND I
DON'T PANIC ABOUT IT.
YOU KNOW, I'LL LISTEN TO
MUSIC OR SEE FRIENDS OR
EXERCISE AND I'LL BE ABLE TO
COME OUT OF IT.
I MEAN, I EXPERIENCE THE UPS
AND DOWNS, AND ALSO I THINK
THAT, YOU KNOW, THROUGH
THERAPY YOU CAN BECOME MORE
SELF-AWARE.
YOU'RE MORE AWARE OF WHERE
THE DEPRESSION CAN COME
FROM.
I'M JUST WONDERING WHETHER
IN THE CASE OF CLINICAL
DEPRESSION THERE'S OFTEN --
THERE MAY BE MORE OF A
BIOLOGICAL BASIS BECAUSE
I'VE ALWAYS BEEN PRIZED WHEN
I'VE MET PEOPLE WHO DON'T
APPEAR TO HAVE ANY KIND
OF -- DON'T SEEM TO HAVE ANY
KIND OF TERRIBLE TRAUMATIC
EXPERIENCES AND THEIR
HOSPITALIZED AND -- LIKE THE
WOMAN WHAT WAS JUST
DISCUSSED -- WHO WAS JUST
DISCUSSED A MINUTE AGO AND
IT'S ALWAYS AMAZED ME.
THE SECOND IS I GET THE
IMPRESS AND -- IMPRESSION
AND I COULD BE WRONG ABOUT
THIS THAT MAYBE A LOT OF
PEOPLE WHO GET DEPRESSED
PANIC AND FEEL THEY NEED A
DRUG INSTEAD OF DEALING WITH
THEIR DEPRESSION IN A
NON-CHEMICAL WAY, THROUGH
THERAPY OR THROUGH BECOMING
MORE SELF-AWARE THROUGH
GETTING MORE EXERCISE.

Maureen says GOOD POINT.

The Caller says I'VE RAISED A FEW
LITTLE ISSUES THERE.

Maureen says YEAH IS THERE A
DIFFERENCE BETWEEN CLINICAL
DEPRESSION AND SORT OF
PERIODIC DEPRESSION, THE
BLUES, KIND OF THING?

Doctor Turner says WE TEND
NOT TO USE THAT DISTINCT.
CLINICAL DEPRESSION TO ME IS
ABOUT ANY DEPRESSION THAT A
PERSON CHOOSES TO SEE A
DOCTOR ABOUT.
THEN IT BECOMES A CLINICAL
DEPRESSION.
AND SOME PEOPLE WHO WOULD
COME TO SEE A DOCTOR MIGHT
HAVE WHAT WE WOULD CALL MILD
DEPRESSION AND SOME, OF
COURSE, MORE SEVERE.
WHEN WE'RE LOOK AT THE
MILDER DEPRESSIONS, AND WHEN
I SAY MILD I'M LOOKING AT
THE DEPRESSION, DEATH,
SEVERITY, MORE THE SYMPTOMS,
FEELING DOWN AND NOT BEING
ABLE TO GET ANY PLEASURE,
ENJOYMENT OUT OF LIFE,
LOSING INTEREST, FEELING
HOPELESS FROM TIME TO TIME,
IT'S ABOUT SYMPTOMS AND ALSO
IT'S ABOUT FUNCTION.
MILDER DEPRESSION, PEOPLE
FOR THE MOST PART TEND TO BE
ABLE TO FUNCTION.
WHETHER OR NOT THEY CHOOSE
TO TURN IT INTO A CLINICAL
DEPRESSION THAT IS TO SEE A
DOCTOR, I THINK IT'S A
PERSONAL CHOICE.
THERE ARE SOME PEOPLE WHO DO
VERY WELL WITH WHAT WE WOULD
CALL MILD DEPRESSIONS.
UNDER TAKE SOME OF THE
ACTIVITIES THAT THE
GENTLEMEN CALLER IS
MENTIONING.
PSYCHO THERAPY, EXERCISE,
SOCIAL ACTIVITY, PERHAPS
CREATIVITY, MAKING LIFE
CHANGES.
AND IN FACT SOME PEOPLE WILL
SAY THAT THEY FEEL THAT THEY
ARE BETTER OR IMPROVED OR
ENHANCED BY MANAGING
DEPRESSION THIS WAY.
CERTAINLY YOU'LL RUN INTO
PEOPLE WHO MAY BE ARTIST,
WRITER, SBR TAKENERS WHO SAY
THEY CAN GRABS -- GRASP THE
ESSENCE BETTER AS A RESULT
OF HAVING DEPRESSION.
FROM A HISTORICAL
PERSPECTIVE THERE HAS ALWAYS
BEEN THIS THING CALLED
MELANCHOLY AND THERE HAVE
BEEN TIMES IN HISTORY WHERE
MELANCHOLY HAS BEEN VERY
CULTURALLY ACCEPTABLE.
PROBABLY, IN MY OPINION IN
THE LAST 20 YEARS OR SO,
MELANCHOLY HAS NOT BEEN SO
CULTURALLY ACCEPTABLE.
AND IT MAY HAVE TO DO WITH
MORE PRESSURE ON PEOPLE TO
PRODUCE, TO PRODUCE SOCIALLY,
ACADEMICALLY, OR IN THEIR
JOBS AND TO PUT ON A BRIGHT
FACE.

Maureen says AND SO DO YOU
TREAT THAT AS IF THERE'S A
CHEMICAL IMBALANCE IN THE
BRAIN AND THIS PERSON NEEDS
SOME SAIRT TONE ANYONE?
OR DO YOU TREAT THAT WITH
GET THE STRESS OUT OF YOUR
LIFE.
YOU KNOW, LEARN HOW TO
RELAX.
AS TOM SAYS, GET SOME
EXERCISE.
IS THAT THE FIRST LINE OF
TREATMENT?

Doctor Turner says I PREFER
THE LATTER, GET THE STRESS
OUT OF YOUR LIFE, WORK ON
THE DEPRESSION.
WHAT ARE SOME OF THE ROOT
CAUSES?
WHAT'S GOING ON DAY TO DAY
THAT'S MAKING THESE ROOT
CAUSES COME UP FOR YOU?
IS IT ABOUT NOT BEING
ASSERTIVE ENOUGH?
IS IT ABOUT NOT REACHING OUT
IN RELATIONSHIPS?
IS IT ABOUT NOT PURSUING A
LIFE DREAM OR SOMETHING OF
THAT SNORT BUT MANY PEOPLE
WHEN YOU LAY OUT THE
ALTERNATIVES WOULD SAY “I
DON'T HAVE TIME FOR THAT OR
I DON'T WANT THAT, I WANT A
MEDICATION.”
JUST A BIT ABOUT THE
SEROTONIN, INCREASINGLY,
THAT'S NOT BECOMING THE
DEFINING ISSUE BECAUSE SOME
VERY INTERESTING IMAGING
WORK THAT LOOKS AT THE
FUNCTION OF THE BRAIN, NOT
JUST THE STRUCTURE OF THE
BRAIN BUT THE FUNCTION OF
THE BRAIN, WHEN WE HAVE WHAT
MIGHT BE CALLED A MILD
DEPRESSION SHOWS THAT THERE
ARE CHANGES IN SEROTONIN
THAT HAPPEN THERE, TOO.
AND IN FACT REALLY WHAT
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS WHERE
THE BRAIN AND THE MIND COME
TOGETHER, OR THE BODY AND
THE MIND COME TOGETHER.
AT SOME POINT IT REDUCES TO
CHEMISTRY AND NERVE IMPULSES,
NOT THAT WE WANT TO TREAT
PEOPLE AS IF THEY'RE
BIOLOGICAL OBJECTS AND JUST
GO AFTER THE CHANGES IN
CHEMISTRY AND NERVE IMPULSES
EXCLUSIVELY, SO WE NO LONGER
USE THE WORD CLINICAL
DEPRESSION OR CHEMICAL
DEPRESSION.

Maureen says ALTHOUGH I WILL
SAY FOR SOMEBODY I KNOW
WHO'S BEEN DIAGNOSED AS
BEING DEPRESSED, THE FACT
THAT SHE CAN TELL HERSELF
IT'S NOT HER FAULT, IT'S NOT
THAT THESE A WEAK PERSON BUT
SOMETHING IN HER BRAIN IS
DIFFERENT THAT MAKES HER
EASIER FOR HER TO TALK ABOUT
IT, ADMIT SHE HAS THE
PROBLEM --

Doctor Turner says SURE,
DESTIGMATISES THE WHOLE THING.

Maureen says YES, YES, SO
YOU'RE STILL SAYING IN BRAIN
IMAGING SOMETHING IS
DEFINITELY DIFFERENT IN THE
BRAINS OF PEOPLE WHO ARE
DEPRESSED.

Doctor Turner says AND ONCE
AGAIN IT'S A PERSONAL CHOICE.
THE PERSON CAN SEEK TO
EXPLAIN THEIR DEPRESSION
THROUGH CHANGES IN CHEMISTRY
OR SEEK TO EXPLAIN THEIR
DEPRESSION IN TERMS OF THE
WAY I WAS TREATED AS A CHILD
OR THE WAY I WAS DEPRIVED OR
ABUSED, OR IT'S BECAUSE I'M
NOT LIVING MY LIFE THE
PROPER WAY FOR ME.
ONCE AGAIN, IT GETS BACK TO
CHOICE, PARTICULARLY WITH
MILDER DEPRESSIONS.

Maureen says I SEE.
ALRIGHT, TOM THANKS VERY MUCH.
DIANE IS IN St. CATHARINES.
HELLO, DIANNE.

The Caller says OH, HI.
HI Dr. TURNER.

Doctor Turner says HI.

The Caller says MY QUESTION TODAY
IS I'M WONDERING AT WHAT
POINT IN MY SON'S LIFE, HE'S
13 NOW.
HIS FATHER HAS BEEN
ESTRANGED ALMOST FROM BIRTH
EXCEPT AT THE AGE OF TWO.
THAT'S HIS FATHER'S CHOICE,
TO BE ESTRANGED FROM HIS
SON.
BUT HIS FATHER DOES HAVE A
HISTORY OF DEPRESSION AND HE
HAS HAD SOME PRIOR EPISODES
BEFORE I HAD EVEN MET HIM OF
SCHIZOPHRENIA, AND I'M
WONDERING IF, YOU KNOW, MY
SON IS OLDER, IF I SHOULD
EVER REVEAL THAT INFORMATION
OR IF IT MAY, YOU KNOW, HURT
HIS OWN SELF SIM IMAGINE --
SELF-IMAGE OF MY SON.
I'M WONDERING IF I SHOULD
DISCLOSE THAT AT SOME POINT
IN LIFE TO THE CHILD.

Doctor Turner says I JUST TO
WANT MAKE THE POINT THAT
DEPRESSION AND SCHIZOPHRENIA
ARE DIFFERENT DISORDERS.
AND SO IT'S SOUNDING AS IF
MAYBE THERE ARE TWO
DISORDERS, OR I'M NOT SURE.
SOMETIMES PEOPLE CAN HAVE
PRINCIPALLY SCHIZOPHRENIA
AND BE DEPRESSED AS A RESULT
OF SCHIZOPHRENIA.
SOMETIMES A PERSON CAN HAVE
A DEPRESSION AND A
SCHIZOPHRENIA AS TWO
SEPARATE DISORDERS THAT MAY
HAPPEN AT THE SAME TIME OR
SEPARATE TIMES BUT
NEVERTHELESS, IN TERMS OF
INFORMING YOUR SON,
THAT'S -- ONCE AGAIN, THAT'S
A PERSONAL DECISION.
I SUSPECT YOU WILL DRAW TOO
YOUR DECISION-MAKING VARIOUS
FACTORS SUCH AS YOUR SON'S
ABILITY TO HANDLE THE
INFORMATION ON A
CONSTRUCTIVE WAY.
TO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE
SAYING TO HIM AND WHAT THE
IMPLICATIONS FOR HIM MIGHT BE.
YES, THERE IS SOME INHERIT
ABILITY IN BOTH
SCHIZOPHRENIA AND DEPRESSION,
MORE IN DEPRESSION THAN IN
SCHIZOPHRENIA, CERTAINLY.
I THINK IT WOULD BE
IMPORTANT FOR HIM TO BE
INFORMED AT AN AGE WHERE HE
CANNOT ONLY UNDERSTAND THAT
THERE'S SOME INHERIT ABILITY
BUT FOR THE MOST PART HIS
CHANCES, EVEN WITH A FATHER
WITH THAT HISTORY OF GETTING
DEPRESSION OR SCHIZOPHRENIA
ARE FAIRLY LOW
STATISTICALLY.
SO HE'D NEED TO BE ABLE TO
HAND DEALT BAD NEWS AND THE
GOOD NEWS IN TERMS OF WHEN,
THAT'S AN ASSESSMENT YOU
WOULD MAKE AS A PARENT,
KNOWING YOUR SON AND HIS
ABILITY TO HANDLE
INFORMATION IN MY EXPERIENCE
THAT CAN COME BETWEEN 14 TO
18 OR THEREABOUT.
I DO, FOR MYSELF, BELIEVE
THAT AT SOME POINT IT'S
IMPORTANT FOR PEOPLE WHO
KNOW WHAT THEIR INHERITANCE
IS.
AND I THINK THIS IS
IMPORTANT FOR THEM AND THEIR
OWN DECISION MAKING AS THEY
GO THROUGH LIFE.

Maureen says LET'S TALK ABOUT
SCHIZOPHRENIA AND SOME OF
THE NEW RESEARCH IN THE
DIAGNOSIS AND TREATMENT OF IT.
THERE'S RESEARCH FROM
ENGLAND THAT SUGGESTED THAT
BRAIN SCREENING PROGRAMMES
MIGHT ACTUALLY IDENTIFY
PEOPLE AT RISK OF BECOMING
SCHIZOPHRENIC.
CAN YOU TELL US --
SCHIZOPHRENIC.
CAN YOU TELL US SOMETHING
ABOUT THAT?

Doctor Turner says THIS IS SOMETHING AT A
VERY EARLY STAGE.
IT'S A RESEARCH TOOL AND
IT'S ABOUT IMAGING TESTS
THAT CAN, THAT CAN SHOW A
PART OF THE BRAIN THAT HAS
DEVELOPED IN A DIFFERENT
WAY.
AS FAR AS I'M AWARE, THESE
TESTS ARE VERY, VERY
EXPENSIVE AND NOT READILY
AVAILABLE.
AND THIS IS THE SORT OF
THING THAT IS VERY
INTERESTING AND IT MIGHT
EVENTUALLY PROVIDE SOME HOPE
BUT WE'RE GOING TO NEED TO
GO BEYOND HAVING TO UNDERGO
A MAJOR TEST THAT --

Maureen says YEAH, THEY'RE
NOT GOING TO SCREEN THE
WHOLE POPULATION.

Doctor Turner says RIGHT THAT
COULD COST 10 TO 15,000 dollars,
AND I THINK THIS IS
SOMETHING THAT WE'LL HAVE TO
KEEP ON TOP OF AND MONITOR
OVER THE NEXT THREE TO FIVE
YEARS.

Maureen says OKAY, GENE IS IN
SUDBURY.
HELLO, GENE?
HI, JEN?
NOT THERE ANYMORE?
OKAY, WE'LL GET ANOTHER
CALLER UP.
WOULD YOU AGREE IT IS
IMPORTANT TO DIAGNOSE
SCHIZOPHRENIA AS EARLY AS
POSSIBLE SO YOU CAN START
SFLEEMT.

Doctor Turner says OH, YES.
THERE'S LOTS OF RESEARCH AND
EXPERIENCE SHOWS THAT THE
SOONER THE TREATMENT IS
STARTED THE BETTER THE
RESULT, THE BETTER THE
OUTCOME, THE MORE LIKELY THE
YOUNG PERSON -- IT USUALLY
ONSETS IN LATE TEENS, IN
MALES AND IN EARLY 20s IN
FEMALES.
AND IF YOU CAN GET IT EARLY
ENOUGH THE PERSON'S MORE
THAN LIKELY ABLE TO GO BACK
TO SCHOOL, GO BACK TO
RELATIONAL LIFE, TO
PARTICIPATE MORE FULLY.

Maureen says OKAY.
DIANA'S IN OTTAWA.
HELLO, DIANE?

The Caller says HI.

Maureen says HI.

The Caller says I'VE RECENTLY
BEEN DIAGNOSED WITH SEVERE
PMS AND I'VE BEEN TAKING
ZOLOFT FOR IT.
I WAS WUBD DERING IF YOU
COULD TELL ME ABOUT THAT.

Doctor Turner says THESE MED
KAIGS ORIGINALLY FOUND FOR
DEPRESSION HAVE BEEN KNOWN
TO HELP IMMENSELY IN A
VARIETY OF OTHER AREAS AND
IT SEEMS AS IF THE LIST HAS
GROWN.
AND SOMETIMES THERE'S SOME
PRETTY GOOD RESEARCH.
SOMETIMES IT'S MORE
EXPERIENCE AND ANECDOTE.
BUT THERE IS SOME RESEARCH
THAT SHOWS ANTIDEPRESSANTS
OF THE DHIND AFFECT
SEROTONIN CAN HELP WITH PMS,
AND SOMETIMES IT'S ABOUT
TAKING THE MEDICATION IN A
CONTINUOUS WAY THROUGHOUT
THE ENTIRE MONTH, SOMETIMES
ABOUT TAKING THE MEDICATION
EPISODICALLY, PRE
MENSTRUALLY, AND IT'S A
MATTER OF FINDING OUT, A
WOMAN FINDING OUT WHICH
WORKS THE BEST ON HERSELF.

Maureen says AND WE DON'T
THINK YOU'LL GAIN WEIGHT ON
IT BUT Ft. YOU DO, TELL US,
YOU WHAT OTHER SIDE SNEAKT.

Doctor Turner says A LITTLE
DOES DISPLEENESS, HEADACHE,
MAYBE A LITTLE TREMBLING,
FINE TREMOR, PERHAPS A
LITTLE BIT OF RUMBLING IN
THE STOMACH.
IT TENDS TO BE A VERY EASY
MEDICATION TO BEGIN WITH.
WHEN THESE SIDE EFFECTS
HAPPEN THEY TEND TO BE
PRETTY MILD AND FOR THE MOST
PART THEY'RE TEMP RAURRY.
I SHOULD JUST MENTION, ONE
SIDE AFFECT WHICH IF IT
HAPPENS IS NOT TEMPORARY AND
THAT'S THE SEXUAL
DYSFUNCTION.
WHEN THAT HAPPENS WITH THESE
MEDICATIONS, IT TENDS TO
CONTINUE AS LONG AS THE
PERSON'S TAKING THE
MEDICATION.

Maureen says BUT WHEN YOU
STOP TAKING THE
MEDICATION --

Doctor Turner says YOU GO BACK TO NORMAL.

Maureen says THANKS FOR THE
QUESTION, DIANE.
MARY IS IN WELLAND.
HELLO, MARY?

The Caller says HELLO.

Maureen says HI.

Maureen says YES, I'D LIKE TO
KNOW MENOPAUSE AND
DEPRESSION, ARE THEY
ASSOCIATED?

Doctor Turner says THEY CAN BE.
IN A WOMAN WHO IS VULNERABLE
TO DEPRESSION, AND THAT CAN
BE IDENTIFIED THROUGH THE
WOMAN'S HISTORY, IF SHE'S
HAD DEPRESSION IN THE PAST,
OR IT MIGHT BE SHE'S NOT
REALLY HAD SIGNIFICANT
DEPRESSION BUT THERE'S A
FAMILY HISTORY OF
DEPRESSION.
PERHAPS HER MOTHER OR SISTER
HAS BEEN DEPRESSED.
AND IN SUCH A PERSON, THE
ABRUPT DROP IN ESTROGEN
PRODUCTION BY THE OVARIES
CAN BE ASSOCIATED WITH THE
DEVELOPMENT OF DEPRESSION.
I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT
THOUGH NOT TO PUT ALL THIS
DOWN TO CHEMICAL HAPPENINGS.
BECAUSE AT AROUND THE TIME
THAT A WOMAN IS GOING
THROUGH THE MENOPAUSE, A LOT
OF OTHER THINGS ARE
HAPPENING IN HER LIFE.
KIND OF LIKE RON IN THE FILM,
IN THE PIECE, AS HE WAS
APPROACHING MIDDLE AGE.
CHANGES WERE TAKING PLACE IN
HIS LIFE.
HE WASN'T FEELING LIKE THE
SAME PERSON HE'D BEEN
BEFORE.
AND OF COURSE THAT CAN
HAPPEN WITH A WOMAN, SO I
THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO BE
ALERT FOR THE POSSIBILITY OF
DEPRESSION, AND IT'S
HAPPENING, IF IT'S HAPPENING.
GET AN ASSESSMENT.
GET A SOLID ASSESSMENT BY
SOMEBODY WHO CAN LOOK AT THE
BIOLOGICAL FACTORS AND THE
PSYCHOLOGICAL OR THE SOCIAL
FACTORS CONTRIBUTING TO THE
DROP IN THE MOOD.

Maureen says THAT'S SORT OF
DEPRESSION IN MIDDLE LIFE
AND THE LATER YEARS.
WHAT ABOUT VERY YOUNG
CHILDREN?
WHAT'S THE YOUNGEST CHILD
YOU'VE TREATED FOR depression.

Doctor Turner says WELL, I DON'T TEND TO
TREAT CHILDREN, BUT I WORK
WITH PSYCHIATRISTS WHO DO
TREAT CHILDREN.
AND INCREASINGLY WE'RE
NOTICING THAT YOUNG CHILDREN
HAVE DEPRESSION.
DOESN'T MANIFEST IN THE SAME
WAY THAT'S DEPRESSION
MANIFESTS IN ADULT, OF
COURSE.
THEY'RE NOT SAYING I FELLOW
OR I HAVE NO INTEREST IN
THINGS.
IT CAN MANIFEST IN A CHILD
BECOMING WITHDRAWN, BECOMING
WHAT WE CALL AVOIDANT.
AVOIDING WANTING TO PLAY
WITH OTHER KIDS.
TO BE -- TO GO OVER AND SEE
GRANNY TO GO TO PARTIES.
AND A BIG ONE IS WHAT WE
CALL SCHOOL PHOBIA.
NOT WANTING TO GO TO SCHOOL.
AND SOMETIMES DEVELOPING A
HEADACHE OR A TUMMY ACHE OR
SOMETHING THAT WILL CAUSE
MOM, DAD TO LET THE CHILD
STAY IN BED.
THAT IS SEEN AS POSSIBLY AN
INDICATOR OF WHAT WE CALL A
DEPRESSIVE EQUIVALENT IN A
CHILD.
IN TERMS OF TREATMENT, YES,
INCREASINGLY RESEARCH
SCIENTISTS ARE LOOKING AT
MEDICATION FOR YOUNGER
CHILDREN.
FOR THE MOST PART, TREATMENT
TENDS TO BE ABOUT LOOKING AT
FACTORS IN THAT CHILD'S LIFE
THAT COULD BE CONTRIBUTING
TO THE SADNESS AND
UNHAPPINESS COMPCHLT IN THE
CASE OF AN AVOIDANT CHILD,
HOW TO IN A POSITIVE WAY GET
THAT CHILD OUT OF BED AND
GET THE CHILD SCHOOL.

Maureen says HMM,
INTERESTING.
IT'S ALL BEEN VERY
INTERESTING.
I THANK YOU FOR DOING THIS
AND I HOPE YOU'LL COME BACK
AGAIN SOON.

Doctor Turner says THANK YOU
VERY MUCH.

Maureen says Dr. TY TURNER
IS A PSYCHIATRIST AT
St. JOSEPH'S HEALTH CENTRE
IN TORONTO.
IF YOU'D LIKE MORE
INFORMATION ABOUT MENTAL
HEALTH, CHECK OUT
The Canadian Mental Health Association at
www.cmha.ca
OR CONTACT THE CENTRE FOR
ADDICTION AND MENTAL HEALTH TORONTO
At 416-595-6111 or 1-800-463-6273
And they have a website at www.camh.net
Thanks for watching More to Life today.
I’m Maureen Taylor.
Do tune in Monday through Friday, 1 to 2 o’clock on TVO.

A closing slate reads “The advice given in the preceding program is of a general nature only. Viewers should consult their own medical professional for medical advice specific to their circumstances.”

Watch: Mental Health