Transcript: Joachim-Ernst Berendt | Sep 28, 1992

Classical piano music plays.
John and a guest sit at a round table in a TV studio decorated as a library. They each have a cup on the table.
John is in his late fifties, clean-shaven, with receding white hair. He's wearing glasses and a purple shirt.

A caption reads "Joachim-Ernst Berendt." Then, it changes to "John Miller."

John says HELLO, AND WELCOME
TO THIS SPECIAL SERIES,
TEACHING MUSIC.
I'M JOHN MILLER.
RECENTLY, THE WORLD
CAME TO CANADA,
AND TO TORONTO,
IN PARTICULAR,
TO CELEBRATE OUR GREAT
PIANIST AND VISIONARY,
GLENN GOULD.
AND AMONGST THE VERY
DISTINGUISHED PEOPLE
WHO CAME TO OUR CITY WAS
JOACHIM-ERNST BERENDT,
WHOM WE WELCOME TO
OW PROGRAM TODAY.

John nods at Joachim, who nods respectfully in return. Joachim is in his late fifties, with short tousled salt-and-pepper hair and a stubble. He's wearing glasses and a striped green, brown and black sweater.

John continues JOACHIM, WHEN I
LOOK AT THIS LIST
OF ACCOMPLISHMENTS THAT
DESCRIBES YOUR LIFE,
I DON'T KNOW WHEN YOU
HAVE THE TIME TO DO
VISITS LIKE THIS, AND
TO SPEND A FEW DAYS
IN ONTARIO.
22 BOOKS YOU'VE
WRITTEN.
THEY'RE TRANSLATED
INTO 16 LANGUAGES.
YOU'VE WRITTEN THE VERY
BEST SELLING BOOK
IN THE WORLD EVER
ON AMERICAN JAZZ,
1.5 MILLION COPIES.
YOU'RE THE FOUNDER
OF BERLIN JAZZ DAYS.
YOU'VE DONE GREAT CULTURAL
FESTIVALS AT EXPOS
IN OSAKA AND MUNICH.
REALLY, THE FIRST
PERSON IN THE WORLD
TO HAVE WORLD MUSIC, WHAT
WE THINK OF NOW AS WOMAD,
THIS IS AN IDEA
YOU STARTED.
AND NOW, AFTER
ALL OF THAT SOUND,
AND ALL OF THAT WRITING,
YOU'RE INTERESTED
IN SILENCE.

Joachim says YES.
IN LISTENING
AND SILENCE.
AND, WELL, IT HAS
VERY MUCH TO DO
WITH MY PERSONAL
DEVELOPMENT.
BECAUSE I THINK MODERN
MEN FORGOT ABOUT
LISTENING AND FORGOT
ABOUT SILENCE.
AND WE KNOW VERY
LITTLE ABOUT IT.
AND WE EVEN HAVE
ASSOCIATED THIS
WITH NEGATIVE IDEAS.
FOR INSTANCE WE TALK
ABOUT DEADLY SILENCE,
ICY STILLNESS, AND
THINGS LIKE THAT.
CANADIAN COMPOSURE MURRAY
SCHAFER HAS STUDIED
LITERATURE, AND HE FOUND
100, 150 YEARS AGO,
ALL THESE THINGS WERE
MOSTLY ASSOCIATED
IN LITERATURE AND WRITING
WITH POSITIVE IDEAS.
TODAY, THEY ARE ASSOCIATED
WITH NEGATIVE IDEAS.
AND WHEN WE TALK
ABOUT TEACHING,
I THINK TEACHING HAS TO
BE DONE IN SILENCE
BY THOSE WHO ARE TOLD,
AND THOSE WHO LISTEN,
AND IT HAS VERY MUCH
TO DO WITH LISTEN.

John says WHEN DO YOU
SEE THAT CHANGE
HAPPENING IN HISTORY?

The caption changes to "Joachim-Ernst Berendt. Germany."

Joachim says WELL, IT
CHANGED GRADUALLY,
THIS CONCENTRATION
ON OUR EAR.
YOU KNOW, IN ALL GREAT
CULTURES OF THE WORLD,
NOT THE EYE, BUT THE
EAR, IS THE HUMAN
NUMBER ONE SENSE
OF PERCEPTION.
AND ONLY FOR WESTERN
MEN, IT CHANGED.
YOU CAN DISCOVER THE
CHANGING ALREADY 300 YEARS
AGO WITH THE FRENCH
PHILOSOPHER DESCARTES,
AND WITH PEOPLE LIKE
NEWTON AND GALILEI,
THIS GRADUAL
SHIFTING OF ACCENT
FROM LISTENING
TO SEEING.
OF COURSE, THIS WAS
BEAUTIFUL BECAUSE
IT HELPED US TO DISCOVER
THE WORLD AND SEE
MANY THINGS WHICH WE
HAVE NOT SEEN BEFORE.
EVEN SEE SUCH FOR
EVERYBODY TODAY SIMPLY
THINK AS A LANDSCAPE; YOU
KNOW, IN OLD LITERATURES,
NOBODY EVER WROTE
ABOUT LANDSCAPE,
A SENSE OF PERCEIVING
LANDSCAPES WAS NOT EXISTING
FOR INSTANCE IN LITERATURE
OF THE OLD GREEKS.

John says DO YOU
HEAR A LANDSCAPE?

Joachim says YES.
THIS IS A BEAUTIFUL THING
TO HEAR LANDSCAPES.
FOR INSTANCE, I HAVE
WRITTEN MANY THINGS
ABOUT JUST PERCEIVING A
LANDSCAPE WITH YOUR EYES
CLOSED AND JUST LISTENING
WHAT'S HAPPENING.
FOR INSTANCE, BEING AT A
LAKE AND HEARING WHAT
A LAKE DOES, AND WHAT
ALL THOSE MANY ANIMALS
ARE DOING NEAR THE LAKE,
AND YOU BECOME SO ALIVE.
YOU GAIN A NEW KIND
OF CONSCIOUSNESS
WHICH WE HARDLY KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT.

John says I UNDERSTAND YOU
ARE GOING TO SPEND
SOME TIME LISTENING
TO ONTARIO.

Joachim says YES, I
HOPE SO.
I'LL HAVE TIME AFTER
THE CONFERENCE.

John says THAT'S SOMETHING
CLASSROOMS COULD DO.

Joachim says YES.
I THINK GRADUALLY MANY
THINGS ARE SHIFTING.
YOU KNOW, IN THE '50s,
THERE STARTED STRONG
ACCENTS ON VISUAL
AIDS IN TEACHING.
AND NOW, MORE AND MORE
TEACHERS FOUND OUT
THAT THIS DETRACTS
THE CHILDREN,
ESPECIALLY WHEN THE VISUAL
AIDS AND THE AUDITORY AIDS
ARE USED AT
THE SAME TIME.
THEY DETRACT
EACH OTHER.
THEY SPOIL
EACH OTHER.
THE BASIC SITUATION OF
TEACHING IS STILL
AS IT WAS 2,000
YEARS AGO.
SOMEONE WHO
SAYS SOMETHING,
AND SOME OTHER
PEOPLE WHO LISTEN.
AND EVERYTHING ELSE WHICH
DISTRACTS FROM THIS BASIC
SITUATION IS A
DISTRACTION OF THE
BASIC STRUCTURE
OF TEACHING.

John says ARE YOU BASICALLY
SAYING THAT TECHNOLOGY,
AND OUR ABILITY TO DO
THINGS WITH MACHINES,
IS GETTING IN THE WAY
OF OUR COMMUNICATING
BETWEEN PEOPLE?

Joachim says THAT'S
WHAT MANY, MANY
TEACHERS FEEL
IN EUROPE.
I FELT IT FROM
GERMAN, FROM FRENCH,
FROM BRITISH TEACHERS,
THAT THIS WHOLE EXCITEMENT
ABOUT USING ALL THE MODERN
TECHNOLOGY FOR TEACHING
HASN'T BROUGHT WHAT
WAS EXPECTED FROM IT.
IT HAS BROUGHT
JUST THE OPPOSITE.
MAKING CHILDREN MORE
AND MORE AGGRESSIVE,
MORE AND MORE NERVOUS,
MORE AND MORE UNABLE
TO REALLY LISTEN WHAT
IT'S ALL ABOUT.

John says SO THOUGH WE
MAY CALL OUR SERIES
TEACHING MUSIC,
IT'S
PERHAPS TEACHING SILENCE,
OR PERHAPS SOUND THAT YOU
WOULD CALL THIS SERIES.

Joachim says YEAH.
AND NOT EVEN TEACHING
ANYTHING BUT SILENCE
AND LISTEN IN SILENCE.
AND THIS, OF COURSE IT
HAS TO DO WITH MUSIC.
MY WHOLE BACKGROUND
IS MUSIC,
BUT IT STILL HAS TO
DO WITH MODERN LIFE.
WITH PEOPLE'S BEHAVING
IN MODERN SOCIETY.
YOU KNOW, NOT BY CHANCE
THIS IS THE MOST OFTEN
HEARD REPORT IN
MODERN LIFE.
MAN, YOU DON'T
LISTEN TO ME.
WOMAN, PLEASE LISTEN.
IT MUST BE TRUE, YOU
HEAR IT SO OFTEN,
IT MUST BE TRUE.
AND YOU COME AT THE
CORE OF WHAT'S WRONG
IN MODERN
COMMUNICATION.
IT IS NOT JUST THE
TECHNICAL THINGS,
IT'S THE BASIC THINGS
THAT PEOPLE ARE NOT
TO BE ABLE ANY LONGER
DON'T SEEM TO BE ABLE
ANY LONGER TO LISTEN TO EACH
OTHER BECAUSE THEY
ARE DISTRACTED THROUGH TOO
MANY OTHER THINGS WHICH
DO NOT HAVE ANYTHING TO
DO WHAT IT'S ALL ABOUT.

John says YOU TRAVEL THE
WORLD, I'M SURE.

Joachim says MM-HMM.

John says HAVE YOU NOTICED
IN SOME SCHOOLS,
OR SOME EDUCATIONAL
ENVIRONMENTS IN CERTAIN
COUNTRIES, A GREATER
TENDENCY TOWARD LISTENING
THAN PERHAPS WE SEE
IN THE WESTERN WORLD?

Joachim says YES.
IN ASIA, IT'S
ALL DIFFERENT.
IN JAPANESE SCHOOLS,
IN INDIAN SCHOOLS,
IN VIETNAMESE SCHOOLS,
IN THAI SCHOOLS.
I HAVE SPENT ALMOST A YEAR
ON BALI WHICH OF COURSE
HAS NOTHING TO DO
WITH WHAT TEACHING
IN WESTERN SCHOOLS
IS ALL ABOUT,
BUT THERE IS NO
DISTRACTION THERE.
THERE'S THIS OLD
RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN
THE TEACHER AND THE
CHILDREN WHICH YOU
REALLY CAN BUILD ON.
IT IS VERY HARD.
I HEAR THIS
AGAIN AND AGAIN.
AND TEACHERS SEEING
THIS PROGRAM MIGHT SAY
THEY HAVE DIFFERENT
EXPERIENCES BUT I HEAR IT
IN EUROPE AGAIN AND AGAIN
THAT IT IS VERY HARD
TO TEACH ANYTHING WITH
ALL THE NERVOUSNESS
AND AGGRESSIVITY OF
MODERN CHILDREN.

John says WELL, TAKE ME
TO BALI OR VIETNAM.
LET'S GO TO ONE OF
THOSE COUNTRIES.
SPECIFICALLY, TELL ME
WHAT YOU'VE EXPERIENCED
THERE THAT WE MIGHT
CONSIDER FOR OURSELVES
IN THE SCHOOLS
IN ONTARIO.

Joachim says WELL, I DON'T
DARE TO SAY IT IN SUCH
A DIRECT WAY BECAUSE YOU
CANNOT TAKE A BALINESE CLASS
AS A KIND OF
DEMONSTRATION OF HOW TO
DO IT IN ONTARIO, OR FOR
THAT MATTER, IN GERMANY.
BUT WHAT I HAVE REMARKED,
AND WHAT I HAVE FOUND
SO REMARKABLE IS
THIS DESIGNATION
AND CONSIDERATION
OF THE CHILDREN
FOR WHAT THE
TEACHER TELLS THEM.
THERE'S A GREAT DEDICATION
TO WHAT IS BEING TAUGHT.
AND I DO NOT FIND
THIS ANY LONGER
IN WESTERN SCHOOLS.
I'M NOT A TEACHER
AT ANY SCHOOL,
BUT I TEACH A LOT
AT UNIVERSITIES.
AND THERE I FEEL IT
IS THE SAME SITUATION.

John says LET ME
UNDERSTAND.
YOU FEEL THERE IS TOO MUCH
INDIVIDUAL EXPRESSIONS
BY THE YOUNG PEOPLE IN
THE WESTERN WORLD?

Joachim says YES.
AND TOO MUCH NERVOUSITY,
TOO MUCH AGGRESSIVITY.
YOU KNOW THE
EYES ARE THE ACCENT
ON VISUAL COMMUNICATION
IN MODERN SOCIETY,
MAKES PEOPLE
AGGRESSIVE.
IN ALL THIS, WHAT IS ABOUT
ENGLISH, I DON'T KNOW,
IN ALL THIS, WE
SAY IN GERMAN,
IT'S AN
INTERNATIONAL WORD,
IN ALL THIS
GEMUTLICHKEIT.
YOU SIT DOWN ON
TELEVISION...

John says COMMOTION, PERHAPS.

Joachim says IN YOUR CHAIR
AND WATCH TELEVISION.
YOU LOAD YOURSELF
WITH AGGRESSIVITY.
BECAUSE THE EYE IS
OUR WAY OF PUTTING
IN AGGRESSIVITY.
AND WHEN YOU PUT TOO MUCH
PERCEPTION IN THROUGH
OUR EYE, WHICH IS WHAT
WESTERN MAN DOES,
USUALLY, YOU LOAD
YOURSELF WITH AGGRESSIVITY.
THIS IS A KNOWLEDGE WHICH
IS LOST IN THE WEST,
BUT IT IS KNOWN IN ALL
THE OLD GREAT CULTURES,
IN CHINESE, IN
INDIA, IN JAPAN,
EVEN WITH AFRICAN YORUBAS,
THEY KNOW VERY MUCH
ABOUT THE EYE HAS TO DO
WITH LOADING YOURSELF
WITH AGGRESSIVITY.

John says BUT LOOK,
WE LIVE IN CITIES,
COMMOTION IS HERE
ALL THE TIME.
WE WATCH TELEVISION,
WHICH IS AGGRESSIVE,
AND WHICH IS FILLED
WITH ACTIVITY.
HOW, IN THAT SETTING, HOW
DO WE FIND THAT SILENCE?
HOW DO WE FIND THAT
QUIET EXPRESSION
YOU ARE SPEAKING ABOUT?

Joachim says THIS IS A
VERY, VERY DIFFICULT
SITUATION BECAUSE WE
ARE TALKING ABOUT
SOMETHING WHICH IS
VERY HARD TO DO
AND YET IT
HAS TO BE DONE.

John says HOW?

Joachim says EVEN
IN MODERN LIFE,
AND EVEN IN MODERN CITIES
YOU STILL FIND WAYS,
ONCE YOU START
SEARCHING FOR IT,
YOU FIND WAYS
TO MORE LISTEN,
AND TO MORE SILENCE.
IT IS POSSIBLE.

John says HOW?

Joachim says WELL...

John says GIVE ME
SOME EXAMPLES.

Joachim says IN YOUR
HOUSE, IN YOUR HOME,
YOU CAN MAKE TRIPS
ON THE WEEKEND,
GO OUT TO NATURE, AND
JUST BECOME SILENT.
I KNOW A TEACHER IN A
VERY BIG GERMAN CITY
NEAR BERLIN, IN EAST
GERMANY, AND SHE TAKES
HER CHILDREN OUT EVERY
TWO OR THREE WEEKS,
OUT TO NATURE, AND JUST
SITS THERE AND SAYS,
LET'S BECOME SILENT.
AND THAT'S JUST LISTENING
WHAT HAPPENS IN NATURE.
THIS IS POSSIBLE
EVERYWHERE,
EVEN FROM BIG AMERICAN
OR CANADIAN CITIES,
AND SHE HAS WRITTEN
AN ARTICLE ABOUT IT
AND SAYING IT CHANGED
THEIR WHOLE RELATIONSHIP
WITH THESE CHILDREN.
THEY ARE DIFFERENT, NOT
JUST IN MUSICAL TEACHING,
BUT THEY HAVE A DIFFERENT
WAY OF PERCEIVING
WHAT'S BEING TAUGHT IN
ALL THE DIFFERENT FIELDS
BEING TAUGHT
AT THAT SCHOOL.

John says SEEMS TO ME WE'RE
PARTICULARLY LUCKY
IN CANADA, IN THE
PROVINCE OF ONTARIO.

Joachim says OF COURSE.
HERE IN CANADA, IT IS NOT
AS DIFFICULT AS WE ALL
THINK, YOU KNOW, WE ARE
SO MUCH FULL OF
ALL MODERN LIFE,
NOISE, AND ALL THIS,
BUT IT IS POSSIBLE.
WE ONLY HAVE TO SEARCH
FOR IT, THEN WE FIND IT.

John says I REMEMBER WHEN I
FIRST MET THE WORK
OF MURRAY SCHAFER, I HEARD
OF MURRAY TAKING PEOPLE,
HIS AUDIENCES, OUT
AT 3 AND 4 AND 5 O'CLOCK
IN THE MORNING AND
LITERALLY TIMING HIS MUSIC
TO INCORPORATE THE SILENCE
OF THE PERFORMING,
THE OUTDOOR
PERFORMING AREA.
AND THEN, AS THE
BIRDS BEGAN TO SING,
THE MUSIC BEGAN TO
JOIN FROM THE MAN-MADE
INSTRUMENTS
WITH THE BIRDS.
AND IT WAS A
MAGNIFICENT BLENDING OF,
FIRST OF ALL THE
CALM, THE SILENCE,
AND THEN THE MAN-MADE
MUSIC WITH IT TOGETHER.

Joachim says YOU KNOW, I
THINK, AS YOU SAID,
THE CANADIAN WAY
OF LIVING HERE
IS ESPECIALLY
GOOD FOR THIS.
IT MAY BE NO CHANCE ONE
OF THE WORLD LEADERS
IN THIS FIELD, MURRAY
SCHAFER, IS A CANADIAN.
AND HE HAS TAUGHT US SO
MUCH ABOUT LISTENING,
ABOUT PERCEIVING, NOT
JUST A LANDSCAPE.
MURRAY, FOR INSTANCE,
PERCEIVES WHOLE CITIES
JUST IN AN AURAL WAY.
WITH CLOSING YOUR EYES,
AND HE DISCOVERS AMAZING
THINGS, HOW AN ITALIAN
CITY LIKE PADUA
IS DIFFERENT FROM,
SAY, PARIS,
OR FROM AN AMERICAN CITY,
OR FROM A CANADIAN CITY.
AND WE DO NOT KNOW THIS
ANY LONGER BECAUSE
WE JUST WATCH AND THEN
WE WATCH SOMETHING ELSE,
AND EVERYTHING IS
MUCH TOO SHORT,
AND MUCH TOO FAST.
WE FORGET WHAT
REALLY COUNTS.
THE BASIC - YOU KNOW, OF
COURSE EVERY MODERN MAN
AND EVERY MODERN WOMAN
THINKS IT WOULD BE MUCH
WORSE TO SUDDENLY BE
BLIND THAN TO SUDDENLY
BE DEAF, AND YET ALL THE
SCIENTISTS IN THIS FIELD,
DOCTORS, AND PSYCHOLOGISTS
AND PHYSIOLOGISTS
HAVE NO DOUBTS THAT
THIS IS NOT TRUE.
IT IS MUCH WORSE
IF YOU ARE DEAF,
AND CANNOT HEAR BECAUSE
HUMAN MAIN COMMUNICATION
IS THROUGH LANGUAGE, AND
THEN YOU ARE CUT OFF
WHEN YOU CANNOT
HEAR ANY LONGER.
THAT'S WHY BLIND PEOPLE
CAN MUCH MORE EASILY
ADAPT TO CERTAIN
PROFESSIONS
THAN DEAF PEOPLE.

John says AND I'VE READ IN
SOME OF YOUR BOOKS
WHERE YOU'VE WRITTEN
EVEN ABOUT,
IN THE HUMAN EMBRYO,
THE SPEED WITH WHICH
THE HEARING
ORGAN DEVELOPS.

Joachim says YES.
SEE, AFTER JUST FIVE OR SIX
DAYS AFTER CONCEPTION,
THERE ARE ALREADY
MICROSCOPIC SMALL SIGNS
OF DEVELOPING EARS
IN THIS SMALL BUNDLE
OF CELLS RECOGNIZABLE.
AND THEY GROW
VERY, VERY FAST.
FASTER THAN
ANYTHING ELSE.
AND FOUR-AND-A-HALF
MONTHS AFTER CONCEPTION,
OUR INNER EAR, OUR ORGAN
OF HEARING, THE SO-CALLED
COCHLEAR LABYRINTH
IS COMPLETELY DEVELOPED.
THE EVEN MORE FANTASTIC
THING IS THAT
IT HAS ALREADY ATTAINED
ITS DEFINITE SIZE.
YOU KNOW, WE ALL GROW
UNTIL WE ARE 18
OR 19 YEARS OLD.
WE HAVE ONLY ONE LITTLE
SPOT IN OUR BODY WHICH GAINS
ITS DEFINITE SIZE
ALREADY LONG
BEFORE WE ARE BORN.
WE STILL HAVE TO SPEND
ANOTHER FOUR-AND-A-HALF
MONTHS IN OUR
MOTHER'S WOMB.
AND YET OUR ORGAN OF
HEARING HAS ATTAINED
ITS FINAL SIZE.
WHAT DOES THIS MEAN?

John says IS THAT TRUE AT
THE OTHER END
OF THE LIFECYCLE
AS WELL?

Joachim says YES.
BUT LET'S FIRST TALK
ABOUT WHAT THIS MEAN.
IT SURELY MUST MEAN THIS
LITTLE BEING WANTS TO LISTEN.
IT DOESN'T WANT ANYTHING
FASTER THAN TO LISTEN.
IT TAKES EVERYTHING
FROM ITS MOTHER.
BLOOD CIRCULATION,
FOOD, BREATHING,
CLEANING OF ITSELF,
EVERYTHING IS DONE
BY WAY OF THE MOTHER, BUT
THERE'S ONLY ONE THING
IT WANTS TO DO AS FAST
AS POSSIBLE: LISTEN.
AND THEN, WHAT YOU JUST
MENTIONED, WHEN YOU DIE.
IN THE LAST
COUPLE OF YEARS,
IT'S REALLY LIKE A SCIENCE
NOW TO FIND OUT
WHAT'S HAPPENING WHEN
THE HUMAN BEING DIES.
AND BY PEOPLE LIKE
ELIZABETH KUBLER-ROSS
AND OTHERS.

John says YES.

Joachim says AND THEY LEAVE NO
DOUBT WHEN HUMAN BEINGS DIE,
WHEN ALL OF OUR
SENSES VANISH,
WHEN WE MAY HAVE HAD PAIN
AND HARDLY FEEL ANYTHING
ANY LONGER, WE HAVE
OUR EYES CLOSED,
WE DON'T SMELL, WE
DON'T TASTE ANY LONGER,
THAT WITH A MAJORITY
OF HUMAN BEINGS,
THE LAST SENSE TO VANISH
IS OUR SENSE OF HEARING.
THIS MEANS THAT NO OTHER
WAY OF PERCEPTION,
NO OTHER HUMAN SENSE
ACCOMPANIES US AS
COMPLETE THROUGH OUR
LIFE AS LISTENING.
IT'S THERE LONG
BEFORE WE ARE BORN,
AND IT VANISHES
AS THE LAST ONE.
AND WE NEVER CAN
CLOSE IT.
YOU KNOW WE CAN
CLOSE OUR EYES,
WE CAN CLOSE OUR MOUTH;
I HOPE WE OFTEN DO.
WE CAN ALL THESE
THINGS CLOSE,
BUT WE NEVER CAN CLOSE
OUR EYES - IT IS REALLY,
THAT'S WHY ONE OF MY
BOOKS IS CALLED
I HEAR THEREFORE I AM.
LISTENING HAS MUCH
MORE TO DO WITH BEING,
THAN FOR INSTANCE
THINKING,
WHEN SOMEBODY SAYS, I
HEAR THEREFORE I AM,
OF COURSE YOU THINK ON
THIS FAMOUS WORD
BY FRENCH PHILOSOPHER,
DESCARTES,
COGITO ERGO SUM.
I THINK,
THEREFORE I AM.
BUT, YOU KNOW, IT'S
EVEN FUNNY, I THINK,
THAT THIS WORLD BECAME
SOMETHING LIKE
A FOUNDATION OF
WESTERN THINKING.
BECAUSE EVERYBODY
HAS EXPERIENCED IT
JUST IS NOT TRUE.
EVERYBODY HAS
EXPERIENCED THIS.
THAT WHEN YOU'RE
NOT THINK,
WHEN YOU JUST HAVE AN
EXPERIENCE FOR INSTANCE
OF A BEAUTIFUL LANDSCAPE,
OR WHEN YOU JUMP IN THE WAVES
OF THE SEA AND SWIM, AND
YOU JUST FEEL ALIVE
MORE THAN IN ANY OTHER
MOMENT OF YOUR LIFE,
EVERYBODY HAS
EXPERIENCED IT IN LOVE.
EVERYBODY KNOWS ALL THE
PLEASURE, ALL THE ECSTASY,
ALL THE FEELING OF LOVE
GOES WHEN YOU START
THINKING AT
SUCH A MOMENT.
AND THIS IS A MOMENT HUMAN
BEINGS ARE MORE ALIVE
THAN IN ANY
OTHER SITUATION.
SO WE ALL KNOW
IT IS NOT TRUE.
AND YET THIS
ABSURD SAYING,
I THINK THEREFORE I AM,
HAS BEEN THE FOUNDATION
OF WESTERN THINKING
FOR 300 YEARS.
IT'S HIGH TIME
WE GET RID OF IT.

John says CAN WE JUST BUILD
ON WHAT YOU'VE SAID.
AND I WONDER IF, IN
FACT, COMMUNICATION
WITH MORE THAN HUMANS
IS AN ASPECT OF WHAT
YOU ARE TALKING
ABOUT AS WELL.
AND PERHAPS TEACHERS
SHOULD EXPLORE
THIS WITH THEIR
STUDENTS.
DO YOU THINK THERE
IS THE POTENTIAL
TO COMMUNICATE
WITH ANIMALS?
WITH NATURE?

Joachim says EVERYBODY DOES.
YOU COMMUNICATE
WITH YOUR CAT,
AND WITH YOUR DOG AND
WHEN YOU HAVE A BIRD
IN YOUR HOME, MAYBE IN A CAGE,
YOU COMMUNICATE WITH HIM,
AND EVERY KNOWS
IT IS POSSIBLE.
ESPECIALLY NOW WE KNOW SO
MUCH ABOUT COMMUNICATION
WITH WHALES.
AND WE CAN LEARN
VERY MUCH FROM THEM.
YOU KNOW WHALES ARE
SO SUPERIOR IN
SO MANY DIFFERENT ASPECTS
TO HUMAN BEINGS.
DO YOU KNOW, FOR INSTANCE,
THAT WHALES CAN SEND
A MESSAGE AROUND THE
WORLD IN 11 HOURS?
THE MESSAGE GOES
OUT TO THE WEST,
AND AFTER 11 HOURS IT
COMES BACK FROM THE EAST,
EXACTLY THAT
SAME MESSAGE.
YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENS
WITH HUMAN BEINGS,
WHEN YOU GIVE A MESSAGE,
MAYBE JUST IN A FAMILY,
SAY FATHER TO THE MOTHER
AND TO SOME CHILDREN...

John says WE GET IT WRONG.

Joachim says AFTER THREE OR
FOUR PEOPLE, YOU KNOW,
THE MESSAGE IS HARDLY
RECOGNIZABLE ANY LONGER.
YOU KNOW, OF COURSE WE
ALSO CAN SEND AROUND
THE EARTH A MESSAGE IN
EVEN LESS THAN 11 HOURS,
BUT WE CAN DO THIS ONLY
LIKE THE INVENTION
OF TELEGRAPHY WHICH
IS 150 YEARS.
BUT WHALES SEND MESSAGES
AROUND THE WORLD
SINCE 75 MILLION YEARS.
YOU MUST HAVE BRAIN;
WHALES HAVE LARGER
BRAINS THAN
HUMAN BEINGS.
WHEN THIS WAS DISCOVERED,
IT WAS LIKE A SHOCK
FOR THE BRAIN IMAGE
OF HUMAN BEINGS.
YOU KNOW, THEY ALWAYS
THINK THE SIZE
OF BRAIN IS THE SIGN
OF SUPERIORITY,
BUT NOW WE KNOW THAT
MOST WHALE SPECIES
HAVE A LARGER BRAIN
THAN HUMAN BEINGS,
AND YOU REALLY NEED A
BRAIN FOR SUCH A HIGHLY
DEVELOPED ANIMAL TO
SURVIVE 75 MILLION YEARS.
THAT'S HOW LONG WE HAVE
WHALES ON THIS PLANET.
YOU KNOW WHAT WE ARE DOING
AFTER JUST ONE MILLION,
NOT EVEN ONE MILLION
YEAR, WE ARE ABOUT
TO KILL OURSELVES
ON THIS PLANET.

John says I CAN'T THINK OF A
MOMENT WHEN I'VE EVER
MET SOMEONE WHO WANTED
TEACHERS TO CHANGE,
AND WHO SAID, ALL YOU
REALLY HAVE TO DO
IS LISTEN, AND CLOSE YOUR
EYES WITH THE STUDENTS,
AND BUILD YOUR
BEING ON HEARING.

Joachim says AND
CHILDREN LOVE THIS.
THERE ARE CERTAIN
PLAYS YOU CAN DO
WITH CHILDREN JUST WITH
HAVING YOUR EYES CLOSED,
AND PLAY
THESE GAMES.
I CANNOT
EXPLAIN THEM.
THERE ARE MANY
BOOKS ABOUT THIS.
AND CHILDREN LOVE THIS
BECAUSE THEY ALSO
FEEL THEY ARE DISTRACTED
THROUGH ALL THESE
MODERN WAYS WHICH ARE
MAKING THEM NERVOUS.
AND IT'S BEAUTIFUL FOR
THEM IF YOU LEAD THEM
TO LISTENING AND TO
SILENCE, CHILDREN USUALLY
ARE GRATEFUL WHEN THIS
IS BEING DONE WITH THEM.

John says JOACHIM, IF I WANT
TO READ MORE OF YOUR WORK,
WHAT BOOKS MIGHT
YOU RECOMMEND FOR US?

Joachim says WELL, THERE
ARE TWO BOOKS
WHICH ARE OUT
IN ENGLISH.
ONE IS CALLED
THE
WORLD IS SOUND.
IT'S PUBLISHED BY DESTINY
BOOKS IN AMERICA.
AND THE OTHER ONE IS
CALLED
THE THIRD EAR,
WHICH, OH, I
DON'T KNOW WHAT,
IT'S A VERY LARGE AMERICAN
PUBLISHER IN NEW YORK,
HENRY HOLT and CO.
THAT'S THE PUBLISHER.
AND THE TITLE IS
THE THIRD EAR.

John says THE THIRD EAR.
WELL, I HOPE WHEN
YOU'RE IN ONTARIO,
YOU'LL HEAR PERHAPS
SOME NEW SOUNDS.

Joachim says I HOPE SO TOO.

John says I HOPE WHEN YOU GO
OUT INTO THE PROVINCE
AND ENJOY THE NATURE
OF THE PROVINCE,
I HOPE YOU'LL ACTUALLY
MEET SOME TEACHERS
WHILE YOU'RE HERE, AND
THAT HEARING AND BEING
WILL BE A NEW
EXPERIENCE FOR YOU,
OR A FURTHER
DIMENSION FOR YOU.

Joachim says YOU KNOW,
HEARING NEW SOUNDS
IS NOT DIFFICULT
FOR ME.
I HEAR NEW SOUNDS
WHEREVER I GO.
ONCE YOU ARE OPEN
TO DISCOVER THEM,
YOU WILL
DISCOVER THEM.

John says I HEAR
THEREFORE I AM.

Joachim says THANK YOU.

John says I WISH WE HAD
A LOT MORE TIME.
THIS HAS BEEN
ABSOLUTELY FASCINATING.
I HOPE WE'LL BE ABLE
TO READ YOUR BOOKS
AND BUILD ON THAT.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH
FOR BEING WITH US.

Joachim says THANK YOU.

John says I'M JOHN MILLER.
THE IDEAS FOR OUR
PROGRAMS COME FROM YOU,
THE TEACHERS, SO PLEASE
BE IN TOUCH WITH US.
YOU COULD WRITE
TO US AT...

A striped blue slate pops up that shows the TVO Daytime logo and reads "TVO Daytime. Box 200, Station Q. Toronto, Ontario. M4T 2T1. Phone: 416-484-2866. Fax: 416-484-4742."

John continues THANK YOU FOR
JOINING US TODAY.
AND HEARING ABOUT SILENCE
FROM JOACHIM-ERNST BERENDT.
I'M JOHN MILLER.
OUR PROGRAMS CONTINUE
IN THIS SERIES
WITH OTHER GUESTS FROM
AROUND THE WORLD.
I HOPE YOU'LL BE WITH US
AS THE WEEK CONTINUES.
THANKS FOR WATCHING.

Classical piano music plays as the end credits roll.

Theme music, Glenn Gould, Piano. Courtesy Sony Classical.

A production of TVOntario.

Copyright 1992, The Ontario Educational Communications Authority.

Watch: Joachim-Ernst Berendt