Transcript: Elizabeth May; Salman Rushdie; Ontario Regional Review | Nov 15, 2019

Steve stands in the studio. He's slim, clean-shaven, in his fifties, with short curly brown hair. He's wearing a blue suit, white shirt, and checked blue tie.
A wall screen behind him reads "The week in review."

Steve says THE AGENDA THIS WEEK
SPOKE TO OUTGOING GREEN PARTY
LEADER ELIZABETH MAY; REVIEWED
FIELD NOTES ON BEING A WOMAN IN
THE CANADIAN ARMED FORCES;
CRITIQUED SCIENCE'S MISTAKEN
UNDERSTANDING OF RACE; AND SAT
DOWN WITH AUTHOR SALMAN RUSHDIE.
THE AGENDA'S WEEK IN REVIEW
STARTS WITH REACTION FROM SOME
ONTARIO MAYORS TO THE PROVINCE'S
DECISION TO BACK OFF FORCING
MUNICIPALITIES TO AMALGAMATE.

Music plays as an animated slate reads "The week in review."

In a clip, Steve sits with four guests in the studio.
A caption reads "How to govern Ontario's regions. Reviewing the tiers."

Steve says THE FACT THAT THE
PROVINCE HAS OPTED TO DO
NOTHING, IN YOUR VIEW, IS WHAT?

The caption changes to "Jim Diodati. Mayor of Niagara Falls."

Jim is in his sixties, clean-shaven, with short, receding brown hair. He's wearing a blue suit, white shirt and blue tie.

He says I WILL SAY IT WAS A LITTLE
ANTICLIMACTIC.
WE WERE EXPECTING SOME ACTION.
WE PUT A LOT OF EFFORT INTO IT.
THERE WERE DIFFERENT SCHOOLS OF
THOUGHT IN NIAGARA.
ONE THING MOST OF YOU CAN AGREE
ON WE'RE HEAVILY GOVERNED WITH A
LOT OF POLITICIANS.
IN NIAGARA, WE HAVE ABOUT
430,000 PEOPLE AND 128 ELECTED
MUNICIPAL POLITICIANS.
THAT'S AN AWFUL LOT CONSIDERING
JUST UP THE HIGHWAY, HAMILTON,
THEY HAVE 100,000 MORE PEOPLE
AND THEY DO IT WITH 16 PEOPLE.
AND KNOWING THAT GTA WENT FROM
47 TO 25, THERE'S A LOT BIGGER
AREAS WITH MUCH HIGHER NUMBERS
WITH NOT NEARLY THE
REPRESENTATION THAT WE HAVE.

Steve says YOU SHOULD JUST
EXPLAIN THAT TO PEOPLE.
YOU DO HAVE TWO-TIERED
GOVERNMENT, YOU HAVE NIAGARA
REGION AND LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES.
HOW MANY LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES IN
NIAGARA?

Jim says WE HAVE 12 LOCAL
MUNICIPALITIES AND THE REGION OF
NIAGARA.
BETWEEN THE 12 MUNICIPALITIES
AND THE REGION, THERE'S...
THERE'S A BIG NUMBER OF
MUNICIPALLY ELECTED POLITICIANS,
AND, YOU KNOW, AND IT'S FUNNY.
I KNOW SOME PEOPLE SAID MORE
POLITICIANS IS BETTER BECAUSE IT
MAKES YOU CLOSER TO THE PEOPLE,
MORE DEMOCRATIC, YET I'VE NEVER
HEARD ANYONE SAY TO ME, YOU
KNOW, THE SOLUTION TO THIS
PROBLEM?
WE NEED MORE POLITICIANS.

Steve says SO WERE YOU
DISAPPOINTED THE PROVINCE DID
NOT UNILATERALLY MAKE A DECISION
TO CHANGE THE STATUS QUO IN
NIAGARA?

The caption changes to "The Week in Review. @theagenda. Tvo.org."

Jim says I AM AND I WISH THEY HAD OF
AT LEAST COME UP WITH A PLAN.
EVEN IF THEY SAID TO US, WE'RE
GOING TO GIVE YOU SIX MONTHS TO
COME US WITH A PLAN ON REDUCING
YOUR NUMBERS AND SHOWING SOME
CONSISTENCY THROUGH THE REGION,
THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN.
IT WAS, AS I SAY, ANTICLIMACTIC,
AND IT WAS A LITTLE
DISAPPOINTING, NOTHING CAME OUT
OF IT.
ALL THAT WORK, ALL THAT EFFORT,
ALL THAT DEBATE, AND NOTHING
CAME OUT OF IT.

Steve turns to a female guest and says FOR BURLINGTON,
YOU'RE IN HALTON REGION AS WELL.

The female guest says FOUR MUNICIPALITIES, ROUGHLY
THE SAME NUMBER, WE'RE LESS THAN
600,000.

Steve says HOW MANY
POLITICIANS?

The caption changes to "Marianne Meed Ward. Mayor of Burlington. @MariannMeedWard."

Marianne is in her fifties, with shoulder-length straight brown hair. She's wearing a black blazer and a purple shirt.

She says 24 AT THE REGION AND IN
BURLINGTON ACTUALLY THE
CONVERSATION IS GOING THE OTHER
WAY.
WE HAVE A COUNCIL OF SEVEN FOR
ABOUT 190,000 POPULATION.
WE ARE THE SMALLEST COUNCIL OF
ANY SIZE IN THE COUNTRY.
WE CUT OUR COUNCIL IN HALF IN
THE '90s AND HAVE NEVER
CHANGED IT.
SO NOW RESIDENTS ARE SAYING, YOU
KNOW, FOUR PEOPLE TO MAKE A
DECISION AND WE'VE GOT SOME BIG
DECISIONS.
WHEN THERE'S CONTROVERSY, THEY
WANT MORE VOICES AROUND THE
TABLE.
WHEN THINGS ARE GOING WELL,
THEY'RE QUITE HAPPY WITH THE
MAJORITY OF FOUR.

Steve says DO YOU THINK YOU
NEED A LARGER COUNCIL TO HANDLE
THE ISSUES THAT BURLINGTON IS
FACING?

Marianne says WELL, WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT IT.
ONE OF THE VERY FIRST REPORTS
THAT I HAD TO WRITE A YEAR AGO
AS A NEW MAYOR WAS ASSIGNMENTS
TO BOARDS AND COMMITTEES,
INCLUDING CITIZEN ADVISORY
COMMITTEES, LOCAL BOARDS LIKE
THE LIBRARY.
THERE WERE OVER 60 ASSIGNMENTS
FOR THE SEVEN OF US.

Steve says CAN YOU DO THAT?

Marianne says WE DO DO IT.
WE'RE ALL VERY TYPE-A AND WE
DON'T SLEEP MUCH.

Steve says SOUNDS LIKE A
HANDFUL, THOUGH.

The caption changes to "For more on this story visit: tvo.org/theagenda."

Marianne says IT IS A LOT TO... IT'S A LOT TO DO, YEAH, FOR SURE.
AND THE PUBLIC SEES THAT AS
WELL.
SO THEY'VE BEEN ASKING, YOU
KNOW, DO WE NEED MORE
POLITICIANS?
WELL, THAT CONVERSATION WAS BIG
IN THE LAST ELECTION.
IT DISAPPEARED DURING REGIONAL
REVIEW.
AND THE FOCUS WAS HEAD DOWN,
PROTECT WHAT WE HAVE, HALTON
REGION IS WORKING WELL.
WE DON'T WANT TO BE A CITY OF
HALTON.
WE WANT TO KEEP THE UNIQUE
IDENTITY IN BURLINGTON.
WE'RE ALREADY SMALL AND
EFFICIENT SO...

Steve says YOU'RE THE MAYOR OF
BRACEBRIDGE.
HOW MANY MEMBERS OF COUNCIL?

The caption changes to "Graydon Smith. Mayor of Bracebridge. @GraydonTheMayor."

Graydon is in his fifties, clean-shaven, with short ginger hair. He's wearing glasses, a gray sweater and a white shirt.

He says NINE ON OUR LOCAL COUNCIL BUT
DISTRICT IS ANOTHER STORY, SO 22
PLUS THE CHAIR.
SO WE ARE VERY OVERREPRESENTED
WHEN YOU LOOK AT OUR TOTAL
POPULATION VERSUS THE NUMBER OF
POLITICIANS THAT WE HAVE.
MIND YOU, WE HAVE A VAST
GEOGRAPHIC AREA, AND IT'S A VERY
DIFFERENT AREA THROUGHOUT
MUSKOKA THAT DO REQUIRE I THINK
A LITTLE BIT OF
OVERREPRESENTATION AT THE END OF
THE DAY.
BUT OUR COUNCIL, PRIOR TO THE
PROVINCE COMING OUT WITH THE
CONCEPT OF REGIONAL REVIEW, WAS
ALREADY LOOKING AT SHRINKING THE
SIZE OF OUR DISTRICT GOVERNMENT.
22 PEOPLE AROUND THE TABLE IS A
LOT, AND IT'S HARD TO FRANKLY
MAKE DECISIONS SOMETIMES WITH
THAT MANY VOICES.
SO THE TOWN OF BRACEBRIDGE, FOR
EXAMPLE, HAS MYSELF AND THREE
OTHER COUNCILLORS.
I THINK PROBABLY TWO OF US COULD
CARRY THAT MESSAGE INSTEAD OF
FOUR.
DOES RAISE SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT
WORKLOAD AND THOSE FUNCTIONS AT
THE DISTRICT AND COMMITTEES THAT
WOULD NEED TO BE COVERED.
I DO THINK WE'VE GOT TOO MANY
PEOPLE AROUND THE TABLE.
AS I SAID, WE STARTED THAT
PROCESS ALREADY.
MAYBE THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR
US TO PICK THAT UP.

Now music plays as an animated slate reads "The week in review."

Steve appears in the studio.

A caption reads "A legacy of leading the Green Party. Leadership style."

Steve says MS. MAY, OF COURSE,
YOU'RE ALL ABOUT TO GET INTO A
MINORITY PARLIAMENT ONCE
PARLIAMENT RECONVENES, AND, YOU
KNOW, I WANT TO GET YOUR SENSE
ABOUT HOW MUCH IMPACT YOU THINK
YOU CAN HAVE ON THE GOVERNMENT'S
CLIMATE AGENDA GIVEN THAT THE
NDP, WHICH HOLDS THE BALANCE OF
POWER, ALONG WITH YOU, ARE
BROKE.
THEY DON'T SEEM TO BE IN MUCH OF
A POSITION TO PUT PRESSURE ON
THE GOVERNMENT THAT, SAY,
PREVIOUS BALANCE-OF-POWER
HOLDERS COULD.
YOU MIGHT PUT YOURSELF IN THE
SAME CATEGORY.
WHO KNOWS WHAT THE BLOC IS GOING
TO BE COOPERATIVE ON.
AS YOU LOOK TOWARDS THE NEXT
PARLIAMENT, WHAT DO YOU THINK IS
POSSIBLE?

The caption changes to "Elizabeth May. Green Party MP, Saanich-Gulf Islands."

May is in her late fifties, with chin-length wavy blond hair. She's wearing glasses and a floral print dress.

She says I THINK IT
DEPENDS ON THE CIVIL SOCIETY
MOVEMENTS WE SAW SPRING UP.
SEPTEMBER 20TH TO 27TH SAW MORE
THAN A MILLION CANADIANS
PARTICIPATE IN ACTION, DEMANDING
REAL CLIMATE ACTION.
IRONICALLY, ONE OF THEM WAS
JUSTIN TRUDEAU AND ANOTHER WAS
JAGMEET SINGH, BOTH OF WHOM
SINCE THE ELECTION HAVE SHOWN
THAT CLIMATE ACTION IS NOT THEIR
PRIORITY.
IT IS THE GREEN PRIORITY.
IT'S MY PERSONAL PRIORITY.
AND PAUL MANLY FROM NANAIMO
LADYSMITH AND JENICA ATWIN, AS A
CAUCUS OF THREE, WE DON'T HAVE
THE NUMBERS NEEDED.
IT COULD HAVE EASILY BEEN WE HAD
BALANCE OF POWER IF THE
CONSERVATIVES HAD WON MORE SEATS
AND THE LIBERAL GAP WAS NARROWER
THAN 13.

The caption changes to "tvo.org/theagenda; agendaconnect@tvo.org."
Then, it changes again to "Looking forward."

May continues BUT WE HAVE THE CARDS WE ARE
DEALT AND GREENS WILL STAND FIRM
ON PRINCIPLE AND NEVER VOTE
CONFIDENCE IN A GOVERNMENT THAT
DOESN'T HAVE THE CLIMATE PLAN
AND THE CLIMATE TARGET THAT
SCIENCE DEMANDS, WHICH MEANS
TWICE WHAT WE CURRENTLY ARE
COMMITTED TO DOING BECAUSE THE
TARGET WAS LEFT IN PLACE BY
STEPHEN HARPER AND HASN'T BEEN
IMPROVED SINCE THEN.
IT'S NOT A MATTER OF POLITICS.
IT'S SCIENCE.
IT'S REALLY COMING DOWN TO A
MATTER OF LIFE AND DEATH.
AND I DON'T WANT TO SOUND
OVERDRAMATIC OR HYPERBOLIC, BUT
WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE DAILY NEWS
COMING OUT OF SCIENTIFIC
LITERATURE, WE ARE RUNNING OUT
OF TIME.

The caption changes to "The Week in Review. @theagenda. Tvo.org."

May continues SO WHAT WE DO IN PARLIAMENT CAN
AUGMENT ONLY WHAT PEOPLE CAN DO
BY PRESSURING... EVERY
CLIMATE-CONCERNED CANADIAN WHO
THOUGHT, WELL, I CAN VOTE
LIBERAL, I CAN VOTE NDP, THEY'LL
ACT ON CLIMATE.
IT'S CLEAR THEY WON'T WITHOUT
MASSIVE PRESSURE FROM THE
PUBLIC.
SO I'LL BE GOING TO THE CLIMATE
NEGOTIATIONS THAT START NEXT
MONTH IN MADRID.
I WILL BE MEETING WITH THE PRIME
MINISTER THIS FRIDAY.
ON EVERY OCCASION, IN THE HOUSE,
ON THE STREETS, IN THE MEDIA...
WHEREVER WE MOBILIZE AS GREENS,
WE WILL BE DEMANDING THAT CANADA
PULL OUR FAIR SHARE OF THE
WEIGHT TO RESPOND TO THIS GLOBAL
EMERGENCY.
WE'RE NOT THERE YET.
WE MUST BE.
AND WE'RE NOT WORRIED ABOUT
HAVING ANOTHER ELECTION.
WE'RE NOT BROKE.
WE ENDED UP WITH... IN A GOOD
FINANCIAL POSITION RELATIVE TO
WHERE WE ALWAYS ARE.

The caption changes to "For more on this story visit: tvo.org/theagenda."

May continues WE DON'T HAVE THE MONEY OF THE
BIG GUYS, BUT WE DON'T HAVE THE
DEBT OF THE BIG GUYS EITHER.
WE'RE READY FOR AN ELECTION
ANYTIME IF IT MEANS GETTING
CLIMATE ACTION.

Now music plays as an animated slate reads "The week in review."

Steve sits with different guests.

A caption reads "Soldiering through a military career. A family of soldiers."

Steve says IT WAS A BIT OF THE
FAMILY BUSINESS AND I'M GOING TO
READ AN EXCERPT FROM THE BOOK
THAT INDICATES THAT.
HERE WE GO...

A quote appears on screen, under the title "Paralyzed by PTSD." The quote reads "Although neither Dad nor Grandpa T could ever say the words post-traumatic stress disorder, both men carried the weight of its symptoms as though they'd gained a hundred pounds, the mental condition's burden impossible for family and colleagues to ignore. My anxiety was bred into me, Dad's was a product of military experience, and enroute to basic training, I wondered if the war I'd inevitably be facing would crack me in half like it had to the men of my family."
Quoted from Kelly S. Thompson, 'Girls need not apply.' 2019.

Steve says GIVEN THAT YOU HAD
ALL OF THAT WEIGHING ON YOU, OR
CERTAINLY AS AN EXAMPLE TO YOU,
IT KIND OF PROMPTS THE QUESTION
DOUBLY: WHY DO THIS?

The caption changes to "Kelly S. Thompson. Author, 'Girls need not apply.'"
Then, it changes again to "A family of soldiers."

Kelly is in her late thirties, with short blond hair and side-swept bangs. She's wearing a striped blue and white shirt, pendant earrings and a red poppy pin.

Kelly says I THINK
THAT A LOT OF FRIENDS I KNOW, WE
CALL THEM MILITARY BRATS, WHO WE
GREW UP WITH IN THE MILITARY
ENVIRONMENT, IT REALLY BECOMES
WHAT YOU KNOW AND THERE'S A LOT
OF COMFORT IN THAT.
I REALLY THINK BECAUSE A LOT OF
US GROW UP ON MILITARY BASES,
YOU SEE THAT PRIDE AND THAT
HONOUR IN SERVING SOMETHING
BIGGER THAN YOURSELF.
WITHOUT GETTING CORNY AND SAYING
IT'S A CALLING, THERE IS THIS
PART THAT I NEVER THOUGHT I
WOULD JOIN THE MILITARY AND THEN
THIS HAPPENED AND I THOUGHT,
WELL, NOW I KNOW WHY MY DAD GOES
TO WORK EVERY MORNING, NOW I
KNOW WHY HE IS AWAY FROM HOME
SIX MONTHS OR A YEAR.

Steve says THERE'S A PART IN
YOUR BOOK THAT SAYS SOLDIERS ARE
DESIGNED FOR SUFFERING.
HOW SO?

The caption changes to "Kelly S. Thompson, @KellyS_Thompson."

Kelly says I DON'T KNOW IF WE CAN EVER
ASK SOMEONE TO GO SEE THE THINGS
OUR SOLDIERS SEE AND EXPECT THEM
TO COME HOME UNCHANGED.
I THINK WE'RE LUCKY IN CANADA
WHERE THERE'S AN ELEMENT WE'RE A
BIT REMOVED FROM THAT KIND OF
VIOLENCE, IN A WAY.
WHEN WE GO OVERSEAS AND WE SEE
PEOPLE SUFFERING OR FOR ME OFTEN
WHEN I WOULD SEE THEM COME HOME
AND SEE THEM SUFFERING, IT'S
ALMOST LIKE A CROSS WE BEAR IN
SERVICE TO THE COUNTRY.

The caption changes to "The Week in Review. @theagenda. Tvo.org."

Steve says LET'S TALK A BIT
ABOUT SOME OF THE SUFFERING YOU
UNDERWENT, AND YOU REALLY DO
DESCRIBE IT IN GREAT DETAIL IN
THE BOOK.

Kelly says THANK YOU.

Steve says TALK ABOUT THE FIRST
FEW DAYS OF BASIC TRAINING.
WHAT WAS THAT LIKE?

The caption changes to "A rigid life."

Kelly says A BIT OF AN EYE-OPENER.
I DEFINITELY GOT TO BASIC
TRAINING EXPECTING THAT IT WOULD
BE PHYSICALLY HARD AND MENTALLY
HARD.
MY DAD HAD GIVEN ME A BIT OF A
WARNING.
THE FRAME OF REFERENCE THAT I
HAD WHAT MILITARY LIFE WAS GOING
TO BE LIKE WAS THROUGH THE
PERSPECTIVE OF MEN IN MY FAMILY,
NOT WOMEN.
I DIDN'T EXPECT THERE WOULD BE
THIS ADDED BARRIER OF THE
SEXISM.
THE FIRST FEW DAYS I THINK I GOT
IN THERE EXPECTING IT WAS GOING
TO BE THIS GAME BETWEEN ME AND
THE CORE STAFF, NOT WHAT A
DIVISIVE EXPERIENCE WOULD BE AND
A UNITING EXPERIENCE BUT BEING
MY CO-WORKERS, MY PLATOON MATES.

Steve says YOU CERTAINLY
EXPECTED THE GRUNT WORK, THE
PUKING, ALL OF THAT STUFF,
RIGHT?

Kelly says SO MUCH PUKING.
SO MANY PUSHUPS, SO MUCH PUKING.

Steve says SO MUCH PUKING.
IT WAS THE REST OF IT YOU DIDN'T
ANTICIPATE?

Kelly says YES.

Steve says OKAY.
AT WHAT POINT DOES THE FEELING
OF REALLY NOT BELONGING SET IN?

Kelly says PRETTY EARLY ON.
WE WERE A REALLY SMALL PLATOON,
WHICH WASN'T COMMON.
THERE WAS ONLY ABOUT 20 OF US
WHEN NORMALLY THERE IS 60 PEOPLE
IN A PLATOON.

Steve says WHERE ARE YOU AT
THIS POINT?

The caption changes to "For more on this story visit: tvo.org/theagenda."

Kelly says ST JEAN, QUEBEC.
THAT'S WHERE OUR BASIC TRAINING
IS DONE.
WE'RE FAR AWAY FROM HOME.
AND I DEFINITELY HAD AN INKLING
PRETTY EARLY ON BECAUSE I STOOD
OUT BECAUSE I WAS REALLY
PHYSICALLY WEAK.
I JUST COULD NOT KEEP UP.
I ALREADY STOOD OUT FOR THAT.
AND THEN WE WOULD GET INTO
INSPECTIONS AND THE CORPS STAFF
WOULD BE ASKING ME: DO YOU WORRY
THAT EVERYONE THINKS YOU'RE WEAK
AND DOES THAT CONCERN YOU?
OF COURSE IT CONCERNS ME.
IT'S SORT OF PICKING AT THAT
SCAB OF INSECURITY AND REALLY
HIGHLIGHTING IT IN A WAY THAT I
HOPED WAS TO BUILD ME UP BUT WAS
DOING MORE BREAKING ME DOWN.

Now music plays as an animated slate reads "The week in review."

Nam sits in the studio. She's in her early forties, with shoulder length curly brown hair. She's wearing glasses and a black blazer over a pale blue shirt.

A caption reads "The return of race science. tvo.org/theagenda; agendaconnect@tvo.org."

Nam says YOU MENTIONED THE
ACADEMIC JOURNAL MANKIND
QUARTERLY.
WHY IS IT SIGNIFICANT?

The caption changes to "Angela Saini. Author, 'Superior.'"
Then, it changes again to "Forgotten but not gone."

Angela is in her thirties, with long straight brown hair in a bun. She's wearing a black shirt and hoop earrings.

She says MANKIND QUARTERLY WAS
INVENTED AFTER THE SECOND WORLD
WAR AS A MEANS FOR THE FEW
SCIENTIFIC RACISTS THAT THERE
STILL WERE IN CIRCULATION AFTER
THE SECOND WORLD WAR, AS A MEANS
TO DISSEMINATE THE KIND OF WORK
THAT OTHER JOURNALS WOULD NOT
PUBLISH.
IT WAS FUNDED BY A VERY WEALTHY
MULTIMILLIONAIRE TEXTILE HEIR
CALL DRAPER, AN AMERICAN VERY
MUCH COMMITTED TO SEGREGATION,
TO MAINTAINING SEGREGATION IN
THE U.S., AND FOR HIM, IF HE
COULD PRESENT AN INTELLECTUAL
CASE IN FAVOUR OF SEGREGATION,
THEN SOMEHOW HE COULD, YOU KNOW,
PROMOTE THAT POLITICAL VIEW.
SO WHAT HE DID THROUGH THE
MANKIND QUARTERLY IS FUND
SCIENTISTS AND JOURNALS THAT
WOULD DEFEND THE IDEA THAT
RACIAL MIXING WAS SOMEHOW
DANGEROUS TO THE RACE.
AND HE USED TO HAND OUT COPIES
TO PROMINENT CONSERVATIVES IN
THE U.S. TO KIND OF PUSH THIS
IDEOLOGY.

The caption changes to "Angela Saini, @AngelaDSaini."

Angela continues WHAT TO ME IS REMARKABLE, FOR
THE FIRST ISSUE OF MANKIND
QUARTERLY CAME OUT, EARLY
1960s, I THINK 1961, IT WAS
ROUNDLY DEBUNKED AT THE TIME.
MAINSTREAM SCIENTISTS JUST
THOUGHT IT WAS SHOCKINGLY BAD,
NOT JUST IN TERMS OF POOR
SCHOLARSHIP AND FOR MORAL
REASONS, BUT THEY ALSO POINTED
OUT THE TYPOGRAPHICAL ERRORS, IT
WAS JUST SHODDY IN EVERY WAY,
AND YET IT'S STILL IN
PUBLICATION TODAY.

Nam says WHY IS THAT
SIGNIFICANT, THAT IT'S STILL
AROUND?

Angela says IT JUST GOES TO SHOW THAT THE
INTELLECTUAL CIRCLES THAT KEPT
SCIENTIFIC RACISM ALIVE AFTER
THE SECOND WORLD WAR ARE STILL
WITH US NOW.
THEY HAVE NURTURED THESE IDEAS
FOR 70 YEARS, GENTLY TAILORING
THE ARGUMENT, CHANGING THE KIND
OF LANGUAGE THAT THEY USED,
DEVELOPING EUPHEMISMS AROUND
RACIAL DIFFERENCE IN ORDER TO
MAKE IT MORE PALATABLE, AND
THEY'RE WINNING, ONLINE NOW.
MANKIND QUARTERLY IS JUST ONE OF
MANY SCIENTIFIC RACIST
PUBLICATIONS THAT EXIST.
THEY ARE CIRCULATING ON SOCIAL
MEDIA.
AND WHEN WE LOOK AT THE RISE OF
THE ALT-RIGHT AND THE FAR RIGHT
AND SOMETIMES WE FEEL SHOCKED,
IT SEEMS TO HAVE HAPPENED
SUDDENLY, THERE'S NOTHING SUDDEN
ABOUT IT.
FOR ALL THESE DECADES, THEY HAVE
BEEN CAREFULLY BIDING THEIR
TIME, AND THIS IS THEIR MOMENT.

The caption changes to "The Week in Review. @theagenda. Tvo.org."

Nam says WHO'S FUNDING IT?

Angela says IT'S DIFFICULT TO SAY.
SO DRAPER'S PIONEER FUND, LONG
AFTER HE DIED, WAS FUNDING
SCIENTIFIC RACISM.
IT'S ONLY RELATIVELY RECENTLY,
AS FAR AS WE KNOW, THAT THE
PIONEER FUND HAS RUN OUT OF
MONEY.
BUT THERE ARE OTHER SOURCES OF
FUNDING NOW.
THEY'RE VERY SHADOWY.
I DID LOOK INTO IT WHEN I WAS
WRITING "SUPERIOR."
IT'S VERY DIFFICULT WHEN YOU
HAVE BANK ACCOUNTS IN THE
BAHAMAS TO KNOW EXACTLY WHERE
THE FUNDING IS COMING FROM BUT
THEY ARE GETTING FUNDING FROM
SOMEWHERE.

The caption changes to "Connect with us: Twitter: @theagenda; Facebook, agendaconnect@tvo.org, Instagram."

Nam says YOU DISCUSS IN THE
BOOK THE POPULARITY OF ANCESTRY
KITS.
HOW DID THOSE COME ABOUT?

The caption changes to "Belonging."

Angela says DNA ANCESTRY TESTING, FOR ME,
PARADOXICALLY, GIVEN ALL THE
BRILLIANT GENETIC EVIDENCE THAT
WE HAVE NOW TO SHOW HOW SIMILAR
WE ARE, AS IN WAYS REINFORCED IN
THE PUBLIC IMAGINATION THAT RACE
MUST BE REAL.
BECAUSE IF YOU CAN DO THESE DNA
ANCESTRY TESTS, HOW CAN IT NOT
BE REAL IF THEY CAN TELL YOU
WHERE YOU'RE FROM.
I DON'T THINK PEOPLE ALWAYS
UNDERSTAND HOW THESE THINGS
WORK.
DIFFERENCE IS SUBTLE.
FOR EXAMPLE, IN MY CASE, I KNOW
EXACTLY WHERE MY ANCESTRY LIES.
MY PARENTS ARE FROM A CERTAIN
REGION OF NORTH INDIA, PUNJAB,
AND AS FAR AS I KNOW THE FAMILY
HAS LIVED THERE FOR AS LONG AS
WE CAN REMEMBER.
NOW, WHEN I HAD MY TEST DONE,
NOT VOLUNTARILY, I SHOULD SAY, I
WAS MAKING A TELEVISION
DOCUMENTARY AND THE PRODUCERS
HAD MY TEST DONE, AND I WOULD
HAVE THOUGHT AT THE VERY LEAST
THEY COULD PIN ME DOWN TO INDIA,
WHICH IS A HUGE COUNTRY IN
ITSELF.
MY TEST TOLD ME I WAS 96 percent SOUTH ASIAN.
SO JUST IMAGINE WHAT A HUGE
SLICE OF THE WORLD THAT IS.
ACTUALLY, THAT IS WHAT WE SHOULD
EXPECT GIVEN THE FUZZINESS OF
THIS.
WHEN WE DO THESE TESTS, WE
IMAGINE THAT THEY'RE LOOKING AT
ANCESTRY.
THEY'RE NOT.

Nam says WHY DO YOU THINK
THEY'RE SO POPULAR?

The caption changes to "For more on this story visit: tvo.org/theagenda."

Angela says WHAT THEY'RE ACTUALLY DOING
IS COMPARING YOUR GENOME TO THE
GENOMES OF OTHER PEOPLE LIVING
WHO HAVE HAD THESE TESTS DONE.

Now music plays as an animated slate reads "The week in review."

Nam sits with a male guest.
A caption on screen reads "A quixotic tale. The stories we tell."

Nam says DO YOU FEEL LIKE OUR
CULTURAL TASTES HAVE DECLINED OR
EXPANDED?

The caption changes to "Salman Rushdie. Author, 'Quichotte.'"

Rushdie is in his early seventies, balding, with a goatee. He's wearing glasses, a gray suit, and a dark blue shirt.

He says WELL, THERE'S ALWAYS BEEN
TRASH.
THAT IS TO SAY... I MEAN,
THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE HISTORY OF
THE HUMAN RACE, THERE'S BEEN
TRASH AND THERE'S BEEN BETTER
STUFF.
AND ACTUALLY A LOT OF MY LIFE, I
HAVE NOT REALLY TRIED TO
DISTINGUISH BETWEEN THOSE TWO.
I'M JUST AS INTERESTED IN POP
MUSIC AS IN OPERA, YOU KNOW?
BUT WHAT I THINK IS PARTICULAR
ABOUT RIGHT NOW IS THAT THE
TRASH HAS GOT TRASHIER AND THAT
THE GULF BETWEEN TRASH AND THE
GOOD STUFF HAS GOT WIDER.
AND THAT'S WHY... I THOUGHT IF
CERVANTES WAS ALIVE, WHAT WOULD
HIS TARGET BE?
IT WOULD BE THE TRASHIER PARTS
OF OUR CULTURE.
THE BOOK HAS A LOT OF FUN WITH
REALITY TELEVISION, SO ON.
BUT I THINK THE SERIOUS POINT IS
THAT I THINK, NOT JUST ON
TELEVISION BUT ALSO ON THE
INTERNET, THERE'S A KIND OF
BLURRING BETWEEN WHAT IS TRUE
AND WHAT IS NOT TRUE, YOU KNOW?
REALITY TELEVISION IS NOT
REALITY.
IT'S HIGHLY MANIPULATED AND
MASSAGED REALITY.
AND IT'S, IN A WAY, FUN REALITY.

The caption changes to "Watch us anytime: tvo.org, Twitter: @theagenda, Facebook Live, YouTube."

Nam says WHAT IMPACT DOES THAT
HAVE...

Rushdie says ON US?

The caption changes to "The Week in Review. @theagenda. Tvo.org."

Nam says ON US.
A LOT OF PEOPLE DO THINK THAT'S
REAL.

Rushdie says THAT'S WHY I SAY, IF YOU
INHABIT A MEDIA ENVIRONMENT IN
WHICH YOU ARE REALLY UNABLE TO
DISTINGUISH BETWEEN TRUTH AND
LIES, THEN IF THAT BOUNDARY
BECOMES BLURRED, THAT'S QUITE A
DANGEROUS PLACE FOR A CULTURE TO
BE, YOU KNOW, WHICH UNSCRUPULOUS
PERSONS CAN EXPLOIT.

Nam says DO YOU THINK WE'RE
THERE NOW?

The caption changes to "Salman Rushdie, @SalmanRushdie."

Rushdie says YEAH.
I DO.
I MEAN, THAT'S... THE BOOK IS
WRITTEN MORE OR LESS AS A
COMEDY.
BUT UNDER THE COMEDY, THERE'S
THERE.

Nam says WHEN YOU WROTE THE
SATANIC VERSES YOUR NAME BECAME
SYNONYMOUS WITH FREE SPEECH.
HOW HARD IS IT TO WAGE THAT
BATTLE RIGHT NOW?

The caption changes to "Normal is upside-down land."

Rushdie says I MEAN, THERE IT IS.
I THINK, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE
REASONS I LIVE IN THE UNITED
STATES IS BECAUSE OF MY
ADMIRATION FOR THE FIRST
AMENDMENT.
I'VE NEVER KNOWN IT TO BE SO
MUCH UNDER ATTACK AS IT IS NOW,
YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU HAVE
JOURNALISTS BEING CALLED ENEMIES
OF THE PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, AND
WHEN YOU HAVE A JOURNALIST IN
TROUBLE IN EGYPT WHICH THE
UNITED STATES PRESIDENT WON'T
HELP AND THE IRISH GOVERNMENT
HAS TO INTERVENE TO RESCUE HIM,
YOU KNOW, THESE ARE VERY
WORRYING DAYS.
I THINK I READ SOMEWHERE THE
OTHER DAY THAT MORE JOURNALISTS
WERE ATTACKED AND KILLED IN THE
LAST YEAR THAN IN ANY PREVIOUS
YEAR.
SO I THINK IT'S A DANGEROUS
TIME.
AGAIN, ONE OF THE REASONS WHY I
THINK WRITERS OF ALL KINDS,
WHETHER FICTION OR NON-FICTION,
YOU KNOW, NEED TO STAND UP FOR
THIS STUFF, BECAUSE IT'S THE
FREEDOM WITHOUT WHICH ALL THE
OTHER FREEDOMS VANISH.

The caption changes to "For more on this story visit: tvo.org/theagenda."

Nam says DO YOU EVER THINK
ABOUT WHAT IT WOULD HAVE BEEN
LIKE IF YOU HAD RELEASED THE
SATANIC VERSES NOW?

Rushdie says I THINK IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN
MORE DIFFICULT BECAUSE THAT
WAS... IN THE NOVEL THERE'S A
TERM FOR BG, WHICH IS BEFORE
GOOGLE.

Nam says AND THEN AFTER GOOGLE,
AG.

Rushdie says AFTER GOOGLE.
I THINK THE SAME THING HAPPENING
IN THE AGE OF THE INTERNET WOULD
HAVE BEEN MORE DANGEROUS, MORE
EXPLOSIVE, THAN IT WAS THEN.

The clips end and Steve stands in the studio alone.

He says THAT'S JUST SOME OF
WHAT WE COVERED THIS WEEK ON
THE AGENDA.
FOR MORE, INCLUDING THE FULL
CONVERSATIONS, YOU CAN VISIT OUR
WEBSITE, tvo.org, OR OUR YouTube
CHANNEL AT youtube.com/theagenda
OR OUR TWITTER FEED, THAT'S:
twitter.com/TheAgenda.

Watch: Elizabeth May; Salman Rushdie; Ontario Regional Review