Transcript: A Microcosm of Multiculturalism | May 22, 2017

Steve sits in the studio. He's slim, clean-shaven, in his fifties, with short curly brown hair. He's wearing a gray suit, white shirt, and striped blue tie.

A caption on screen reads "A microcosm of multiculturalism. @spaikin, @theagenda."

Steve says NEXT YEAR, THE CLINTON STREET
PUBLIC SCHOOL IN DOWNTOWN
TORONTO WILL CELEBRATE ITS 130TH
ANNIVERSARY.
OVER THAT TIME, THE STORY OF THE
SCHOOL HAS VERY MUCH MIRRORED
THE STORY OF ONTARIO'S CAPITAL
CITY.
IT'S ALL CHRONICLED IN A NEW
BOOK CALLED:
MAKING A GLOBAL CITY:
HOW ONE TORONTO SCHOOL
EMBRACED DIVERSITY.

A picture of the book appears briefly on screen. The cover features a black and white picture of students in a classroom.

Steve continues AND ITS AUTHOR, U OF T POLITICAL
SCIENCE PROFESSOR, ROBERT
VIPOND, JOINS US NOW WITH MORE.

Robert is in his late fifties, clean-shaven, with short white hair. He's wearing round glasses, a gray suit, white shirt, and spotted red tie.

Steve continues NICE TO HAVE YOU BACK HERE AT TVO!

Robert says THANK YOU VERY MUCH!

Steve says WHERE DID YOU GET THE NOTION OF
TELLING TORONTO'S STORY THROUGH
A SINGLE SCHOOL?

The caption changes to "Robert Vipond. Author, 'Making a global city.'"
Then, it changes again to "Clinton Street School is born."

Robert says IT REALLY BEGAN IN THE MOST
PROSAIC OF WAYS.
MY DAUGHTER ATTENDED CLINTON
SCHOOL, AND I WAS ASKED TO
PARTICIPATE IN THE 125TH
ANNIVERSARY.
AND LIKE MOST PARENTS AT THE
SCHOOL, I HAD A VAGUE SENSE
THAT--THAT IT HAD A LONG, RICH
HISTORY, THAT IT WAS A GATEWAY
FOR IMMIGRANT KIDS OF ALL SORTS,
UH, OF ALL SORTS.
BUT I DIDN'T REALLY KNOW MUCH
ABOUT IT UNTIL I BEGAN LOOKING
MORE CAREFULLY AT IT IN THE
CONTEXT OF THIS 125TH
ANNIVERSARY.
AND BEGAN TO DISCOVER THAT, IN
FACT, IT TOLD A STORY OF
TORONTO, INDEED PERHAPS EVEN OF
CANADA, UM, IN ITS OWN LOCAL WAY.

Steve says WELL, LET'S GO BACK AND TELL
SOME OF THAT STORY.
THE SCHOOL GOES BACK TO 1888.
WHAT WAS THE STUDENT BODY LIKE
BACK THEN?

An old black and white picture shows a three-story brick building.

Robert says THE STUDENT BODY WAS, UM...
TORONTO BEGAN TO MOVE WEST.
1880 WAS A CRUCIAL MOMENT
BECAUSE THAT'S WHEN THE COLLEGE
CAR CROSSED BATHURST STREET.
SO ALL OF A SUDDEN YOU HAVE THE
POSSIBILITY TO, UH, TO BUILD
HOUSES...
AND FOR A MIDDLE-CLASS
POPULATION LARGELY TO MOVE
IN--TO MOVE IN.
WHAT WERE THEY?
MAINLY--MAINLY ANGLO-SAXON,
IRISH, UH, THE--LOTS ACTUALLY
WERE IMMIGRANTS, WERE NEW TO THE
COUNTRY.
BUT TORONTO HAD BECOME
THIS--THIS REALLY DYNAMIC, UH,
CENTRE BOTH FOR MANUFACTURING
AND AGRICULTURAL, UH, STUFF, AS
WELL AS SERVICE.
AND SO IT WAS CALLING FOR LOTS
AND LOTS OF DIFFERENT PEOPLE,
BUT MAINLY ANGLO-SAXON UNTIL THE
FIRST--UNTIL THE END OF THE
FIRST WORLD WAR.

Steve says END OF THE FIRST WORLD WAR IT
BECOMES A MUCH MORE--MUCH MORE
OF A MAGNET FOR IMMIGRANT STUDENTS?

The caption changes to "Robert Vipond. University of Toronto."

Robert says AND THEN IT CHANGED.
IN 1918, UH, THERE WAS A SERIES
ON THE, UH, LOCAL SCHOOL, LOCAL
PUBLIC SCHOOLS IN TORONTO THAT
APPEARED IN THE
STAR WEEKLY.
AND THE FELLOW WHO WROTE IT
SAID, UM, THAT AT THAT POINT IT
WAS LARGELY OF BRITISH STOCK
WITH MAYBE 5 percent HEBREW STUDENTS.
BY THE END OF THE '20S, UH, 60 percent
OF THE SCHOOL WAS JEWISH.
SO THERE WAS A VERY, VERY
DRAMATIC, UH, CHANGE AND
INCREASE, AT THAT POINT, IN THE
NUMBER OF JEWISH STUDENTS, WHICH
IS WHY I END UP CALLING IT, THAT
FIRST WAVE, "JEWISH CLINTON."

Steve says IT'S INTERESTING THE TENSION AND
THE DYNAMIC THAT THAT CREATED,
BEING A SIGNIFICANT JEWISH
SCHOOL IN WHAT WAS THEN PRETTY
WASPY ONTARIO.
AND TO THAT END, I WANT TO READ
AN EXERT OF THE BOOK, BECAUSE
PART OF THE CHARTER THAT SCHOOLS
HAD TO LIVE UP TO AT THE TIME
WAS TO, YOU KNOW, TEACH STUDENTS
HOW TO LIVE IN A DEMOCRATIC
SOCIETY BASED ON THE CHRISTIAN
IDEAL, SO HERE WE GO...

A quote appears on screen, under the title "A clashing mission." The quote reads "The tension created by this way of defining the school's mission came to a head in the 1940s when Ontario's premier, George Drew, promulgated regulations that required every public school in Ontario to teach religion and that provided lesson plans that conveyed the message that the Jews were responsible for killing Jesus."
Quoted from Robert Vipond, "Making a global city." 2017.

Steve says HOW DID THE JEWISH STUDENT
BODY AND ITS PARENTS DEAL WITH THAT?

The caption changes to "Teaching the Christian ideals."

Robert says SO THIS IS A REMARKABLE STORY.
I MEAN THIS IS--YOU HAVE TO
UNDERSTAND, GEORGE DREW'S, UH,
THEY BECAME KNOWN AS THE "DREW
REGULATIONS."
LIKE BILL DAVIS, HE WAS BOTH
PREMIER AND MINISTER OF
EDUCATION, UM, REQUIRED TWO HALF
HOUR PERIODS OF INSTRUCTION PER
WEEK FOR EVERY, UH, EVERY CHILD
IN ONTARIO SCHOOL, GRADES 1
THROUGH 8.
UM, AND AS I SAY IN THE BOOK,
AND AS YOU'VE JUST--JUST--AND
JUST READ, UH, THE NARRATIVE WAS
PRETTY CLEAR FROM THE--THE
SYLLABUS.
OF COURSE, THE TEACHERS SAID,
YOU KNOW, "WE KNOW HOW TO TEACH
MATH AND WE KNOW HOW TO TEACH
SCIENCE, BUT NO ONE TAUGHT US
HOW TO TEACH RELIGION."
SO THEY--THE MINISTRY OF
EDUCATION PROVIDED THESE--THESE,
UH, WORKBOOKS, BASICALLY, WHICH
PROVIDED ALL SORTS OF HINTS.
AND THE NARRATIVE WAS, "THE JEWS
KILLED JESUS."
HOW DID CLINTON DEAL WITH IT?
WELL, TURNS--THERE WERE THREE
MAJOR JEWISH SCHOOLS IN
DOWNTOWN--DOWNTOWN TORONTO:
CLINTON, LANSDOWNE,
AND KING EDWARD.
AND THE CANADIAN JEWISH CONGRESS
DECIDED TO FIND THAT OUT FOR
THEMSELVES, SO THEY BROUGHT
TOGETHER SOME JEWISH TEACHERS
FROM ALL OF THOSE SCHOOLS AND
DISCOVERED THAT, IN FACT, AT ALL
OF THE SCHOOLS THEY BASICALLY
JUST TOOK A PASS.
THERE WAS, AS ONE PUT IT, "A
GENTLEMAN'S AGREEMENT, THAT
THEY JUST WOULDN'T ACTUALLY GO
DOWN THAT PATH."
AND THE ONE--THE TEACHER FROM
CLINTON SAID, "YOU KNOW, WE KNEW
THAT IT WOULD CREATE SUCH A
FUROR WITH PARENTS THAT THERE
WAS JUST NO WAY THE PRINCIPAL
WAS GOING TO GO THROUGH WITH IT."

Steve says SO, WAS THERE KIND OF AN "OUT
CLAUSE" THERE THAT IF PARENTS
DIDN'T WANT THEIR KIDS TO BE
PART OF THAT RELIGIOUS
INSTRUCTION THEY COULD GET THEM
OUT OF IT?

Robert says THERE WAS.
THERE WAS AN EXCEPTION CLAUSE
THAT IF YOU WANTED YOUR CHILD
NOT TO ATTEND THEY COULD--YOU
KNOW, THEY COULD STAND OUTSIDE
THE DOOR WHILE THE
EXERCISE--THIS, OF COURSE,
DIDN'T GO--WOULD HAVE BEEN
IMPRACTICAL IN THE FIRST PLACE
WITH 60 percent OF THE STUDENTS.
AND, IN FACT, NO, UH, NO SUCH,
UM, EXCEPTIONS WERE REQUESTED OR MADE.
INSTEAD, THEY JUST SHOWED A
LITTLE BIT OF, UH, GOOD CIVIL
DISOBEDIENCE AND, UH, UM,
RESISTED IT THAT WAY.

Steve says HERE'S A LIST OF NAMES: MORLEY
SAFER, FROM
60 MINUTES FAME,
ALLAN BOROVOY, WHO FOUNDED THE
CANADIAN CIVIL LIBERTIES
ASSOCIATION, SAM THE RECORD MAN
SNIDERMAN, LOUIS APPLEBAUM, THE
FAMOUS COMPOSER, SALLY ENOSKI
FROM THE LOVING SPOONFUL.
WHAT DO THEY ALL HAVE IN COMMON?

Robert says THEY WERE ALL JEWISH AND THEY
WERE ALL AT CLINTON PUBLIC SCHOOL.

Steve says AND APPARENTLY, DID OK.

Robert says AND DID VERY WELL.
YOU KNOW, THIS IS ONE OF THE,
AGAIN, ONE OF THE REMARKABLE
THINGS OF CLINTON IN THAT ERA,
IS THAT, UM, IN 1949 THE
MINISTRY OF EDUCATION DID A--DID
A SURVEY AND DISCOVERED THAT
ONLY ABOUT 60 percent OF ONTARIO
STUDENTS WERE GOING ON TO
SCHOOLING PAST GRADE 8.
THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THAT
LED TO BILL DAVIS', UM, YOU
KNOW, GREAT RENAISSANCE OF--OF
AND GROWTH OF PUBLIC EDUCATION.
AT CLINTON IT WAS ABOUT 80-85 percent
WHO WENT ON PAST GRADE 8.
SO IT WAS A VERY ACADEMIC SCHOOL.
TEACHERS, UM, YOU KNOW,
BUTTONED-DOWN ANGLO WASPS AS
THEY MAY HAVE BEEN, LOVED
THAT KIDS LOVED SCHOOL.
AND THEIR PARENTS, I CALL IT
"THE AXIS OF GOOD," UH, THE
CONNECTION BETWEEN PARENTS ON
THE ONE HAND AND TEACHERS ON THE
OTHER, ALL OF WHOM IN MORLEY
SAFER'S ACTUAL WORDS, "HAD THE
COMMON GOAL OF KICKING THEIR
KIDS UP THE SOCIAL LADDER."

Steve says HMM.
A LITTLE OVER 50 YEARS AGO, A
SECOND BUILDING, A NEW IF YOU
LIKE, CLINTON STREET PUBLIC
SCHOOL.
WHAT STORY WAS THAT NEW BUILDING
BEGINNING TO TELL?

The caption changes to "A new school for Clinton students."

A black and white picture shows a modern, two-storey brick building with a tower and a park in front.

Robert says THAT'S--UH, NEW BUILDING
WAS--WAS BEGINNING TO TELL THE
STORY OF WHAT I CALL THE SECOND
WAVE OF CLINTON AS A GATEWAY--AS
A GATEWAY SCHOOL.
NAMELY, THE COMPLETE
TRANSFORMATION, ACTUALLY AS
EARLY AS THE 1950S, UM, FROM
"JEWISH CLINTON" INTO WHAT I
CALL "EUROPEAN OR SOUTHERN
EUROPEAN CLINTON," IN WHICH
THE--MOST OF THE STUDENTS CAME
IN THE GREAT WAVE OF IMMIGRATION
FROM ITALY, AND THEN THE LATE
'60S FROM PORTUGAL.
AND THAT--THAT UTTERLY
TRANS--TRANSFORMED IT.
IN THE FIRST PLACE, IT PUSHED
THE ENVELOPE IN TERMS OF SIZE.
THERE WAS SUDDENLY A LOT MORE
KIDS IN THE NEIGHBOURHOOD.
AND IT CHANGED THE CHALLENGE AS
WELL, BECAUSE THESE--THESE WERE
DIFFERENT KIDS.
THESE WERE KIDS WHO TYPICALLY
DID NOT SPEAK ENGLISH WHEN THEY
CAME OR DID NOT GO HOME TO A
HOME IN WHICH ENGLISH WAS
SPOKEN.
AND WHAT HAPPENED THEN, THE
REMARKABLE THING, IS THAT
CLINTON, BASICALLY ON ITS OWN,
IT PIONEERED ESL IN DOWNTOWN
TORONTO PUBLIC--PUBLIC SCHOOLS.
THE SCHOOL BOARD ITSELF SHOWED
VERY LITTLE INTEREST IN IT UNTIL
THE MID-'60S.
AS EARLY AS 1951, THEY HAD
FIGURED OUT A WAY TO SHAVE SOME
STAFF HERE AND SOME STAFF THERE
SO AS TO CREATE DEDICATED
ESL--ESL COURSES AND CLASSES.

Steve says HMM.
IF WE GO INTO THE 1970S YOU TELL
US MORE BLACK STUDENTS MOVED
INTO THE AREA AND THE CLINTON
STREET SCHOOL REFLECTED THAT.
AND HERE'S A QUOTE FROM ONE OF
THE KIDS FROM YOUR BOOK...

Another quote from Robert's book appears on screen, under the title "The black experience." The quote reads "I have only positive memories of my classrooms. It was in those public spaces like recess and going home for lunch... and after school. Those were the times I was confronted with racism. It was hard. There was a lot of name-calling in the schoolyard."
A former Clinton Public School student, as quoted in "Making a global city." 2017.

Steve says IT'S INTERESTING THAT THERE'S
THIS DISTINCTION BETWEEN WHAT
HAPPENED IN THE CLASSROOM AND
THEN WHAT HAPPENED OUTSIDE THE CLASSROOM.
WHY DO YOU THINK IN TERMS OF THE
RACISM THAT BLACK KIDS WOULD
HAVE EXPERIENCED BACK THEN?

Robert says HARD TO KNOW EXACTLY.
I MEAN THE SCHOOL WAS ALREADY
BEGINNING TO THINK OF IT
AS--THINK OF ITSELF AS A SORT OF
SAFE PLACE, UH, FOR STUDENTS
OF--OF MANY DIFFERENT--MANY
DIFFERENT ORIGINS.
IT WAS BEGINNING TO MAKE THE
TRANSITION TO TAKE MORE
SERIOUSLY WHAT I CALL
INTEGRATION AS OPPOSED TO
ASSIMILATION.
UH, BUT OUTSIDE, IN A WAY THE
RECESS AND THE PLAYGROUNDS WERE
THAT TRANSITIONAL SPACE.
ATTITUDES ARE NOT REALLY
CHANGED, AND SO IT WAS--THAT WAS
OFTEN--OFTEN VERY DIFFICULT.
AND IT IS--IT IS REMARKABLE THAT
EVEN WITH THOSE--THOSE STORIES
THE SCHOOL ITSELF CAME OUT
PRETTY WELL.
NOW, IT WAS NOT GREAT FOR EVERY
STUDENT, THAT'S FOR SURE.
IT WAS HARD SCRABBLE ON THE--ON
THE--ON THE PLAYGROUND AND THERE
WAS A LOT--THERE WERE
LOTS--THERE WAS LOTS OF NAME
CALLING AND SO ON.
BUT THE SCHOOL ITSELF REMAINS,
UH, FONDLY IN THEIR MEMORY.

Steve says IF YOU GO TO THE LATE 1970S
YOU'VE GOT THE SO-CALLED "BOAT
PEOPLE," THE SOUTHEAST ASIAN
ÉMIGRÉS WHO LEFT THAT
DETERIORATING SITUATION IN
VIETNAM, CAMBODIA, UH, THEY END
UP AT CLINTON PUBLIC SCHOOL.
HOW DO THEY FARE?

Robert says IN ALMOST EVERY CASE, AGAIN, THE
STORY--THE STORY IS PRETTY POSITIVE.
THE INCREASE OF EAST ASIANS, AS
YOU MENTIONED, BUT ALSO IT
BECAME A CENTRE FOR LATIN
AMERICAN AND HISPANIC KIDS AS
WELL, NAMELY FROM COLOMBIA AND
ECUADOR.
YOU DON'T THINK OF THAT IN
LITTLE ITALY BUT, IN FACT, THERE
WAS A SIZEABLE POPULATION.
SO THERE WERE BASICALLY FIVE
DIFFERENT GROUPS, AS IT WERE,
OF--OF STUDENTS ALL OF WHOM HAD
AT LEAST--COULD ACCOUNT FOR AT
LEAST 15 percent OF THE SCHOOL'S
POPULATION.
SO IT REALLY DID BECOME HYPER
DIVERSE AT THAT POINT.
AND THE STORIES FROM THOSE
STUDENTS REFLECT, UM, THE GOOD
THINGS THAT CAN BE TAKEN FROM
THAT DIVERSITY.

Steve says AND IF WE MOVE THE STORY ALONG,
FIVE YEARS AGO YOU TELL US THEY
DID A CENSUS OF THE SCHOOL AND
MORE THAN HALF THE CLINTON'S
FAMILY REPORTED A HOUSEHOLD
INCOME OF MORE THAN 100,000 dollars A
YEAR.
THIS IS A VERY DIFFERENT SCHOOL
NOW I GATHER?

Robert says IT REALLY IS.
IT'S--THE NEIGHBOURHOOD HAS
GENTRIFIED TO--TO A MUCH GREATER EXTENT.
THE SCHOOL ITSELF REMAINS VERY
COMMITTED TO MULTICULTURAL
CURRICULUM AND SO ON AND SO FORTH.
BUT I THINK IT'S FAIR TO SAY
THAT THE SCHOOL ITSELF IS NOT,
UM, DIVERSE IN THE WAY IT WAS IN
THE--THE PERIOD THAT I COVER IN
THE BOOK, NAMELY 1920 TO 1990.

A colour picture shows the school in present day, on a snowy winter day. The name "Clinton" appears on colourful panels between the ground and top floor windows.

Steve says NOW AS A HISTORIAN, YOU HAPPENED
UPON WHAT EVERY HISTORIAN LOVES,
NAMELY A TREASURE TROVE OF INFORMATION.
THEY KEPT RECORDS, RIGHT?

Robert says THEY KEPT RECORDS.
EVERY--EVERY SCHOOL PRODUCED
REGISTRATION CARDS FOR EVERY KID
WHO WAS ENROLLED IN--IN THE SCHOOL.

Steve says AND THEY'RE ALL STILL AROUND?

The caption changes to "A professor's interest."

Robert says YEAH, THESE ARE LIKE THOSE
LITTLE RECIPE CARDS WHICH
INCLUDE THE NAME OF THE CHILD,
WHERE THE CHILD WAS BORN, THE
NAME OF THE PARENTS, WHERE THE
PARENTS ARE BORN, THEIR
OCCUPATION, THEIR RELIGION.
SO YOU CAN GATHER ALL SORTS OF
INFORMATION.
AND I WAS JUST LUCKY THAT
CLINTON STILL HAS A COMPLETE SET
OF THESE.
IN MANY OTHER CASES AS, YOU
KNOW, NO ONE'S QUITE SURE WHAT
HAPPENED TO THEM, BUT CLINTON
HAD A COMPLETE SET.
SO THAT WAS, FOR ME AS A SOCIAL
SCIENTIST, AN ABSOLUTE GOLDMINE.

Steve says SO YOU'RE BURIED IN LIKE 3X5
CARDS FOR A VERY LONG TIME?

Robert says THAT'S RIGHT.
THERE WERE ABOUT 22,000 OF THESE
CARDS AND...

Steve says OOF!

Robert says AND I HAD A SMALL ARMY OF
WONDERFUL RESEARCH ASSISTANTS
WHO WERE ABLE TO CREATE A RANDOM
SAMPLE OF THAT, AND CODE IT ALL,
AND ALL OF THAT--ALL OF THAT STUFF.

A black and white picture shows several dozen children sitting in a double circle in a large classroom.

Robert says SO IT ACTUALLY DOES PROVIDE US
WITH MORE THAN ANECDOTES, THOUGH
I FILLED IT OUT WITH 75
INTERVIEWS, BUT HARD DATA AS
WELL, SO THAT WAS A NICE COMBINATION.

Steve says I--YOU KNOW, AS I READ THE BOOK
I WAS CURIOUS ABOUT YOUR
PARTICULAR CONNECTION TO IT.
I KNOW YOUR DAUGHTER WENT THERE
BUT, UH, YOU KNOW YOU AS A
UNIVERSITY PROFESSOR CAN WRITE
ABOUT ANYTHING YOU WANT.
YOU'RE NOT FOREIGN BORN.
YOU'RE NOT JEWISH.
YOU DIDN'T GO TO THE SCHOOL.
WHERE DO YOU THINK YOUR
CONNECTION TO THE PLACE, UM, YOU
KNOW, DRIVES YOU IN ORDER TO
SPEND THE TIME REQUIRED TO WRITE
A BOOK ABOUT IT.

Robert says SO AS I WAS BEGINNING TO
WRITE--WRITE THE BOOK, AND
HONESTLY, I REALLY DID BEGIN
WITH THE IDEA, "WELL, THIS WOULD
BE A NICE CURIOSITY PROJECT JUST
TO WRITE THE HISTORY OF THE
SCHOOL AND DO SOME INTERVIEWS
AND SO ON AND SO FORTH."
BUT THIS WAS JUST AT THE POINT
THAT THEN PRIME MINISTER HARPER
DECIDED THAT IT WAS NECESSARY TO
PROHIBIT A MUSLIM WOMAN FROM
WEARING A NIQAB WHEN SHE WENT TO
HER CITIZENSHIP CEREMONY.
AND THEN WE GOT BREXIT WITH THE
UK DOING ITS MISCHIEF, AND THEN
TRUMP COMES ALONG.
AND I BEGAN TO REALIZE THAT, IN
FACT, THERE WAS A BROADER THEME
THAT ACTUALLY DID CONNECT TO THE
WORK I DO AS A POLITICAL
SCIENTIST.
WHICH IS, UH, I CALL IT, UM,
THESE STORIES OF CITIZENSHIP, OF
WHO BELONGS UNDER WHAT TERMS AND
TO WHAT--TO WHAT END?
'CAUSE REALLY WHAT--WHAT THE
SCHOOL WAS--WAS ASKING, WAS
BEING ASKED TO DO, WAS TO TURN
THESE CHILDREN, MOST OF THEM
IMMIGRANT, FIRST- OR
SECOND-GENERATION IMMIGRANTS,
INTO GOOD LITTLE CANADIANS.
AND IT OCCURRED TO ME THAT THERE
ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO'VE
TALKED ABOUT WHAT YOU DO TO--TO
DO THAT, TO, UM, TO INTEGRATE.

Another black and white picture shows women and girls standing in a large kitchen, wearing white aprons and caps.

Robert says BUT NOT ALL THAT MANY HAD
ACTUALLY TALKED ABOUT, WELL,
WHAT DOES IT ACTUALLY MEAN TO BE CANADIAN?
BECAUSE IT TURNS OUT THE
DEFINITION OF CANADIAN CHANGED
ALONG THE WAY AS WELL.

Another picture shows boys standing in a workroom with desks with tools in them.

Robert says AND SO THAT'S WHAT--WHAT GOT
ME--GOT ME GOING AND KINDLED THE
ACADEMIC INTEREST AS WELL AS,
UH, AND SUPERIMPOSED ON THE--ON
THE PERSONAL.

Steve says AND THE OVERARCHING CONCLUSION
THAT YOU SORT OF COME AWAY FROM
THE WHOLE EXERCISE WITH, IN
TERMS OF CLINTON SCHOOL'S ROLE
IN CREATING NICE LITTLE CANADIAN
CITIZENS, IS WHAT?

Robert says THE OVERALL CONCLUSION IS THAT I
THINK THE CURRENT DEBATE THAT
WE'RE HAVING ABOUT CITIZENSHIP,
UH, THAT IN CANADA, THE EXAMPLES
OF THE HARPER GOVERNMENT AND
CURRENT, UM, CURRENT LOCUS FOR
THAT CONTROVERSY IN, UH, THE
LEADERSHIP OF THE CONSERVATIVE
PARTY, IN BRITAIN, IN EUROPE, IN
THE U.S., IS THAT
MULTICULTURALISM, OR
MULTICULTURAL CITIZENSHIP, IS
REALLY--HAS REALLY BEEN
PORTRAYED AS A SORT OF EITHER-OR CHOICE.
THERE ARE THOSE WHO SAY, "EH,
IT'S REALLY JUST FLUFFY, IT'S
REALLY JUST WINDOW DRESSING,
THERE'S NOTHING THERE AT ALL."
IT'S REALLY JUST, AS ONE OF MY
COLLEAGUES LIKES TO SAY,
"ASSIMILATION BY STEALTH."
ON THE OTHER HAND, YOU GET THOSE
WHO--WHO CLAIM THAT
MULTICULTURALISM REALLY IS
DESTROYING THE--A SENSE OF REAL
CANADIAN IDENTITY, THAT THERE'S
NO "THERE" THERE.
AND THEY OFTEN QUOTE JAN
MARTEL'S FAMOUS--FAMOUS QUIP
THAT "CANADA IS THE WORLD'S
GREATEST HOTEL," RIGHT?
THERE'S NOTHING REALLY THERE,
IT'S JUST, UM, IT'S BALKANIZED,
AND WE'RE CONTINUING DOWN
THAT--THAT TERRIBLE PATH.
SO IT'S SORT OF AN EITHER-OR
CHOICE, WHICH SIDE DO YOU--?
AND CLINTON ON THE OTHER HAND
LOOKED AT IT NOT AS EITHER-OR,
BUT AS MORE OR LESS.
AND I THINK THEY FOUND THE SWEET SPOT.
THAT THEY FOUND--THEY--THEY
REALIZED THAT THEY, UM, DO HAVE
A RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE "GOOD
LITTLE CANADIANS" AND TO CONNECT
THEM TO A CULTURAL HERITAGE, UM,
AND TO HAVE THEM IDENTIFY IN
VARIOUS WAYS WITH THIS CANADA.
BUT THEY REALIZED, AS WELL, THAT
THE STATE DOES HAVE A
RESPONSIBILITY IN A
MULTICULTURAL COUNTRY TO RESIST
COMPLETE CULTURAL
HOMOGENIZATION.
AND SO THEY'VE GONE OUT OF THEIR
WAY TO CELEBRATE
MULTICULTURALISM IN VARIOUS WAYS
AND TO ACCOMMODATE DIVERSITY IN
VARIOUS WAYS.
AND THAT'S, YOU KNOW, NO ONE
SAID IT WOULD BE EASY, AND IT
ISN'T.
THERE ARE LOTS OF CONFLICTS AND
LOTS OF TENSIONS.
THAT'S WHAT CAME UP IN THE
LAST--IN THE LAST CHAPTER OF
MY--MY STORY HAVING TO DO WITH
HERITAGE LANGUAGE INSTRUCTION.
BUT IT'S THAT IDEA THAT IT'S
"MORE OR LESS" NOT "EITHER-OR."
THAT I THINK IS THE TAKEAWAY OF,
AND THE REASON WHY THE CLINTON
STORY IS MORE THAN JUST A LOCAL HISTORY.

Steve says YOU KNOW, THERE'S A GREAT
INTERSECTION RIGHT NEAR THE
SCHOOL, RIGHT?
YOU KNOW THE PRESIDENTIAL
INTERSECTION?

Robert says CLINTON AND GORE.

Steve says ISN'T THAT AMAZING?

Robert says says IT'S FANTASTIC, YEAH!
THERE IS AN INTERSECTION OF
CLINTON AND GORE RIGHT NEAR THE
SCHOOL.

Robert says WHO KNEW? WHO KNEW?

The caption changes to "Producer: Steve Paikin, @spaikin; Producer: Harrison Lowman, @harrisonlowman."

Steve says UH, IT'S REALLY GOOD OF YOU TO
COME IN AND SHARE THIS STORY WITH US,
MAKING A GLOBAL CITY...
HOW ONE TORONTO SCHOOL EMBRACED
DIVERSITY.
ROBERT VIPOND FROM THE
UNIVERSITY OF TORONTO, THANKS SO MUCH!

Robert says THANK YOU, STEVE!

Watch: A Microcosm of Multiculturalism