Transcript: Examining the Quebec Mosque Shooting | Jan 30, 2017

Steve sits in the studio. He's slim, clean-shaven, in his fifties, with short curly brown hair. He's wearing a gray suit, pink shirt, and purple tie.

A caption on screen reads "Examining the Quebec mosque shooting."

Steve says A LAVAL UNIVERSITY
PROFESSOR.
A QUEBEC REVENUE MINISTRY
EMPLOYEE.
AN I.T. WORKER.
A PROGRAMMING ANALYST FOR THE
QUEBEC GOVERNMENT.
A GROCER.
A FATHER OF TWO.
LAST NIGHT, A TERRIBLE CRIME.
TODAY, TEARS, PLEAS FOR UNITY
AND
TOLERANCE,
AND SPECULATION
IN A WORLD THAT SEEMS TO BE
MOVING IN UNEXPECTED DIRECTIONS.
WHAT SHOULD WE MAKE OF THIS
AWFUL SHOOTING THAT CLAIMED SIX
LIVES?
WITH US TO FOR THEIR THOUGHTS
TONIGHT:
IN OTTAWA, ONTARIO:
AMIRA ELGHAWABY, COMMUNICATIONS
DIRECTOR WITH THE NATIONAL
COUNCIL OF CANADIAN MUSLIMS...

Amira is in her late thirties. She's wearing glasses, a pale blue hijab, burgundy blazer, and pale blue blouse.

Steve continues AND HERE IN OUR STUDIO:
BESSMA MOMANI, SENIOR FELLOW
WITH THE CENTRE FOR
INTERNATIONAL
GOVERNANCE INNOVATION...

Bessma is in her forties, with long wavy blond hair. She's wearing a gray blazer over a burgundy blouse, and a silver pendant necklace.

Steve continues CHRISTIAN LEUPRECHT, PROFESSOR
OF POLITICAL SCIENCE WITH RMC
AND QUEEN'S UNIVERSITY...

Christian is in his early forties, with short gray hair and a trimmed goatee. He's wearing glasses, a gray suit, and a pale blue shirt.

Steve continues AMARNATH AMARASINGAM, FELLOW
WITH THE PROGRAM ON EXTREMISM
AT GEORGE WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY...

Amarnath is in his forties, clean-shaven and shaven-headed. He's wearing glasses, a dark gray suit, and a striped purple shirt.

Steve continues AND KAMRAN BHATTI, MUSLIM
COMMUNITY ACTIVIST.

Kamran is in his late thirties, with short black hair and a boxed beard. He's wearing a gray suit and a checkered blue shirt.

Steve continues WE ARE UNHAPPY AT THE
CIRCUMSTANCES THAT HAVE GATHERED
ALL OF YOU HERE IN OUR STUDIO
AND AMIRA TO YOU IN OTTAWA,
TOGETHER THIS EVENING, BUT WE
ARE GRATEFUL FOR YOUR TIME AND
WE HOPE WE CAN START SOME KIND
OF CONVERSATION TONIGHT,
STARTING, IF YOU WOULD, SHELDON,
PLEASE, THE EVENTS OF THE LAST
24 HOURS.

A satellite map of North America pops up highlighting Ontario and Quebec. Then, it homes in on Quebec City and highlights the location of the Centre Culturel Islamique de Québec.

Steve continues THERE'S WHERE IT'S ALL HAPPENED,
IN THE PROVINCE OF Québec JUST
OUTSIDE Québec CITY, AND WE WILL
TAKE YOU THROUGH A BIT OF A TIME
LINE OF THE LAST 24 HOURS,
STARTING WITH...

A slate shows bullet points detailing the events that took place.

Steve reads from the slate and says
7:50 P.M., SEVERAL
PEOPLE CALLING 911 FROM THE
MOSQUE IN QUESTION.
AT 8:10 P.M., A MAN CALLS 911
AND TOLD POLICE HE WOULD WAIT
FOR OFFICERS AT AN ACCESS ROAD.
POLICE ARREST HIM.
HE IS THOUGHT TO BE THE SUSPECT.
10 P.M. LAST NIGHT, THE
R.C.M.P., NATIONAL SECURITY TASK
FORCE IS DEPLOYED.
TODAY, 9 A.M., POLICE CONFIRM
TWO SUSPECTS IN CUSTODY.
AT NOON, THE Québec PROVINCIAL
POLICE ANNOUNCED ONE MAN IS
STILL A SUSPECT; THE OTHER IS A
WITNESS.
AND AT 6 P.M., ALEXANDRE
BISSONNETTE, CHARGED WITH 6
COUNTS OF FIRST DEGREE MURDER.
THE PRIME MINISTER AND THE
LEADERS OF THE OTHER PARTIES
SPOKE ABOUT THIS IN THE HOUSE OF
COMMONS TODAY.
WE HAVE TAPE OF THE PRIME
MINISTER.
SHELDON, LET'S ROLL THAT NOW,
PLEASE.

A clip plays on screen with the caption "Routine proceedings. Statement by Minister."
In the clip, Justin Trudeau gives an official statement in the Parliament.

Trudeau says WE VALUE YOU.
YOU ENRICH OUR SHARED COUNTRY IN
IMMEASURABLE WAYS.
IT IS YOUR HOME.
LAST NIGHT'S HORRIBLE CRIME
AGAINST THE MUSLIM COMMUNITY WAS
AN ACT OF TERROR COMMITTED
AGAINST CANADA AND AGAINST ALL
CANADIANS.
WE WILL GRIEVE WITH YOU.
WE WILL DEFEND YOU.
WE WILL LOVE YOU.
AND WE WILL STAND WITH YOU.

The clip ends. The caption changes to "What happened?"

Steve says AMIRA, I'M NOT GOING
TO PRETEND THIS IS A UNIQUE OR
DIFFERENT QUESTION, BUT IT SEEMS
LIKE THE RIGHT PLACE TO START.
WHEN YOU HEARD THE NEWS, WHAT
WENT THROUGH YOUR MIND?

The caption changes to "Amira Elghawaby. National Council of Canadian Muslims."

Amira says SHOCK, OF
COURSE, STEVEN.
I THINK EVERYONE IN CANADA IS
ACTUALLY IN SHOCK AS WELL AS IN
MOURNING.
YOU KNOW, STILL CAN'T REALLY
BELIEVE THAT THIS HAS HAPPENED
IN OUR COUNTRY.
YOU KNOW, I'VE JUST COME BACK
FROM A VIGIL ON PARLIAMENT HILL,
JOINED BY HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE AND
I KNOW THAT VIGILS HAVE BEEN
HAPPENING ACROSS THE COUNTRY.
I THINK IF THERE'S ANYTHING TO
BE SAID RIGHT NOW IS THAT
CANADIANS ARE JOINED, LIKE OUR
HEARTS ARE TOGETHER RIGHT NOW,
AND ALL WE CAN THINK OF IS THE
VICTIMS OF THIS HORRIFIC
TERRORIST ACT THAT'S HAPPENED IN
Québec CITY, AND WE'RE THINKING
OF THE FAMILIES OF THESE VICTIMS
AND WE ARE SIMPLY JUST, YOU
KNOW, WITH ONE VOICE SAYING WE
EMBRACE THESE COMMUNITIES, WE
LOVE EACH OTHER, AND WE WILL NOT
LET SUCH A DIVISIVE, HORRIFIC,
CONDEMNABLE ACT DEFINE US.

Steve says KAMRAN, THE PRIME
MINISTER TODAY CALLED IT AN ACT
OF TERROR.
WHAT DID YOU THINK OF HIS USE OF
THAT WORD?

The caption changes to "Kamran Bhatti. Muslim Community Activist."

Kamran says I THINK IT
IS VERY IMPORTANT.
I THINK LANGUAGE IS EXTREMELY
IMPORTANT IN MOMENTS LIKE THIS.
WHEN THE PRIME MINISTER COMES
OUT AND SO BOLDLY SAYS THAT THIS
WAS AN ACT OF TERROR, I KNOW
THAT PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITIES
WERE ALL... THEY WERE TALKING
ABOUT IT.
THEY WERE SAYING, WOW, THE PRIME
MINISTER SAID THIS IS AN ACT OF
TERROR.
THIS ISN'T SOMETHING THEY'RE
TRYING TO SWEEP UNDER THE RUG
AND CALL IT SOMETHING ELSE.
IT WAS VERY CLEAR.
AND IT SENT A VERY CLEAR MESSAGE
TO MEMBERS OF THE COMMUNITY THAT
THE PRIME MINISTER WAS SO BOLD
IN CALLING IT AN ACT OF TERROR.

Steve says BESSMA, WOULD YOU
CALL IT AN ACT OF TERROR?

The caption changes to "Bessma Momani. University of Waterloo."

Bessma says I THINK IT WAS.
OF COURSE, IT'S INTERESTING THAT
FOR US AS POLITICAL SCIENTISTS
THERE NEEDS TO BE A SPECIFIC
DEFINITION THAT IT NEEDS TO HAVE
A POLITICAL MOTIVE, AND AS WE
SORT OF UNDERSTAND MORE OF THIS
INDIVIDUAL'S BACKGROUND AND
IDEOLOGIES AND HIS
RADICALIZATION PROCESS, IT'S
GOING TO BE IMPORTANT TO KNOW
WHETHER OR NOT THERE IS A
POLITICAL MOTIVE BEHIND THIS.
BUT I CAN'T HELP BUT SEE THE
POLITICAL CONTEXT OF WHAT'S
GOING ON AROUND THE WORLD, IT'S
NOT A COINCIDENCE BECAUSE TRUMP
HAS TAKEN POWER AND WE'VE SEEN
THIS MUSLIM BAN THROUGHOUT THE
WEEKEND REALLY SWEEP AMERICA AND
MANY PARTS OF THE WORLD IN
UPROAR, YOU CAN'T HELP BUT SEE A
POLITICAL CONNECTION.
SO I THINK IT IS SAFE TO SAY
THAT AT MINIMUM THIS IS A HATE
CRIME, AND I THINK THAT THE NOTE
OF CALLING IT A TERROR ATTACK IS
NOT FAR.

Steve says I WASN'T GOING TO GO
THERE YET BUT BESSMA HAS OPENED
THE DOOR.
I DON'T THINK IT MAKES SENSE ON
HOLDING OFF ON HAVING THIS
DISCUSSION BECAUSE PEOPLE ALL
OVER NORTH AMERICA WANT TO
CONFRONT THE ISSUE OF WHETHER OR
NOT WHAT THE PRESIDENT DID WITH
HIS EXECUTIVE ORDER THE OTHER
DAY AND WHAT HAPPENED IN Québec
YESTERDAY, WHETHER THERE IS A
CONNECTION.
ARE YOU DRAWING A LINE BETWEEN
THE TWO?

The caption changes to "Amarnath Amarasingam. George Washington University."
Then, it changes again to "The Trump effect?"

Amarnath says I THINK SO.
I MEAN, I WAS IN TOUCH WITH A
FEW OF BISSONNETTE'S FRIENDS
THIS MORNING ON Facebook,
MESSAGING BACK AND FORTH.
WHAT THEY KIND OF SAID WAS, OVER
THE LAST YEAR AND A HALF HE'S
BEEN VERY ANTI-HILLARY, VERY
PRO-TRUMP, PRO-ISRAEL,
ANTI-PALESTINIAN RIGHTS,
ANTIFEMINISM, SO HE'S KIND OF
GONE DOWN THAT PATH.
WE'RE LEFT TO KIND OF ASK THE
SAME QUESTION WE ASK OF ALL
RADICALIZED INDIVIDUALS, WHICH
IS WHAT WAS THE TURNING POINT.
FOR ME IT SEEMS AND IT'S KIND OF
TOO EARLY TO SAY THAT THE
SO-CALLED MUSLIM BAN PLUS THE
BACKLASH TO IT, THE PROTEST WAS
A KIND OF TRIGGERING MOMENT FOR
HIM AND HE FELT LIKE HE HAD TO
TAKE SOME KIND OF ACTION TO
PROVE A POINT.
SO I THINK IT'S NOT A NEW THING
THAT HE WAS GOING THROUGH.
IT'S NOT A SUDDEN
RADICALIZATION, BUT THE PUSH TO
VIOLENCE IS VERY MUCH TIED TO
THE BROADER EVENTS THAT WE SAW
LAST WEEK.

Steve says CHRISTIAN, ARE YOU
IN AGREEMENT WITH THAT?

The caption changes to "Christian Leuprecht. Royal Military College."

Christian says YEAH,
I THINK HERE WE NEED TO BE
CAREFUL ABOUT WHAT CAUSAL
MECHANISMS THAT WOULD DRIVE
SOMEBODY TO DO THIS BECAUSE IT
SEEMS THEY COMBINE DIFFERENTLY
IN EACH CASE.
WE NEED TO REMEMBER A SPECIFIC
MICRO CONTEXT WITHIN Québec
CITY, WHICH IN FRENCH THEY CALL
(SPEAKING FRENCH) A SHOCK TO
THIS.
IT IS AN OVERALL ECOSYSTEM AND
ENVIRONMENT THAT ALLOWS PEOPLE
WHO PROBABLY WOULD HAVE MOVED TO
SOME SORT OF ACTION AT ONE POINT
OR ANOTHER ANYWAYS, BUT IT
ALLOWS THEM TO JUSTIFY AND TO
RATIONALIZE THAT PARTICULAR
ACTION INTO THE VIOLENCE THEY
DECIDED TO TAKE AND LEGITIMATES
IT IN THEIR OWN MINDS.

Steve says DON'T TAKE THIS AS
ME TRYING TO STIR SOMETHING UP
BUT BY THE SAME TOKEN I DON'T
WANT TO UNDERPLAY WHAT THE
COMMUNITY MAY BE FEELING TONIGHT
AS WELL, WHICH IS: HOW AFRAID
ARE YOU RIGHT NOW?

The caption changes to "Dissecting the day."

Amira says I THINK WE
TRY NOT TO LET FEAR TAKE OVER.
I THINK THAT UNFORTUNATELY
CANADIAN MUSLIMS HAVE GONE
THROUGH SIMILAR FEELINGS BEFORE,
UNFORTUNATELY, WHENEVER THERE
IS, WHETHER IT'S A TERRORIST
ATTACK ABROAD OR HERE IN CANADA,
WHETHER IT IS SORT OF POLITICAL
RHETORIC THAT IS VERY DIVISIVE
AS WE SAW IN THE LAST FEDERAL
ELECTION, WHETHER IT IS THE
CHARTER OF VALUES THAT WAS BEING
DEBATED IN Québec.
WHENEVER WE HAVE THIS SCRUTINY,
THE SPOTLIGHT ON CANADIAN
MUSLIMS, ON MUSLIMS GENERALLY IN
A NEGATIVE FRAME, WE IMMEDIATELY
SEE A SPIKE IN REPORTED HATE
CRIMES AND INCIDENTS AT THE
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF CANADIAN
MUSLIMS WHERE WE DO RECEIVE A
REGULAR REPORT, NOT JUST OF HATE
CRIMES AND HATE INCIDENTS, BUT
REGULAR REPORTS OF
DISCRIMINATION THAT PEOPLE ARE
FEELING, WHETHER IT'S... JUST
TODAY WE GOT A REPORT OF SOMEONE
SAYING HE TRIED TO RENT A PLACE
AND HE WAS DENIED THAT.
SO IN WORKPLACE SCENARIOS.
AT SCHOOL SETTINGS.
SO THERE ARE MICRO AGGRESSIONS,
AND THEY CAN SORT OF GO UP
TOWARDS WHERE YOU HAVE JUST A
SIMPLE LOOK ON A BUS ALL THE WAY
TO SOMETHING BEING SAID TO YOU
TO A THREAT, TO THE POSTINGS YOU
SEE ON SOCIAL MEDIA, TO THE
TYPES OF VERY DIVISIVE RHETORIC
WE'RE HEARING TALKED ABOUT ON
THE RADIO, FOR EXAMPLE, IN
Québec, UP UNTIL UNFORTUNATELY
THIS IS SORT OF THE VERY WORST
MANIFESTATION OF HOW FAR HATE
CAN GO.
I THINK THAT'S WHAT WE'VE BEEN
HEARING TODAY IS WORDS MATTER.
IT STARTS WITH WORDS.
I THINK WE NEED TO REALLY PAY A
LITTLE BIT MORE ATTENTION IN
THIS COUNTRY ABOUT WHAT OUR
POLITICAL LEADERS ARE SAYING.
WE HEARD, YOU KNOW, VERY
IMPORTANT WORDS OF SOLIDARITY
TODAY, BUT LET'S NOT FORGET THAT
HERE IN CANADA, THERE HAVE BEEN
VERY DIVISIVE POLITICAL RHETORIC
COMING FROM CERTAIN QUARTERS IN
OUR POLITICAL ECOSYSTEM OF ITS
OWN.
I THINK WE NEED TO CALL THAT
OUT.
BECAUSE THAT DOES FIND AUDIENCE
AND WE NEED TO SORT OF COUNTER
WITH POSITIVE NARRATIVES ABOUT,
YOU KNOW, THE CANADIAN MUSLIMS,
THE Québec MUSLIM CONTRIBUTION
TO THIS COUNTRY, THE AMOUNT OF
WORK THAT'S BEING DONE TO
POSITIVELY IMPROVE OUR COUNTRY
TOGETHER, COLLECTIVELY.
I THINK THAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT
WE HEAR THAT.
WE CANNOT DISMISS SORT OF THE
ZEITGEIST AND HOW THAT IS
IMPACTING THE DAY-TO-DAY LIVES
OF CANADIAN MUSLIMS, OF Québec
MUSLIMS.

Steve says KAMRAN, I WANT TO BE
CAREFUL HOW I PUT THIS QUESTION,
BUT IF YOU ARE ON SOCIAL MEDIA
TODAY OR LISTENING TO TALK RADIO
TODAY, YOU WOULD HAVE HEARD THE
VIEW EXPRESSED THAT IT'S NOT A
COINCIDENCE THAT THIS HAPPENED
IN THE PROVINCE OF Québec.
THAT'S A PRETTY BROAD CHARGE BUT
IT'S OUT THERE.
WHAT DO YOU THINK?

The caption changes to "Kamran Bhatti, @bhattikj."

Kamran says YOU KNOW, I
DON'T NECESSARILY EQUATE THE
IDEA OR THE NOTION THAT BECAUSE
IT WAS Québec, IT'S SOMETHING
SEPARATE FROM THE REST OF
CANADA.
I THINK THERE HAS BEEN THIS
MOVEMENT TOWARDS, YOU KNOW, THIS
ANTI-MUSLIM RHETORIC, THIS
ISLAMOPHOBIC RHETORIC, LIKE WHAT
AMIRA WAS TALKING ABOUT.
ONE OF THE THINGS I READ EARLIER
TODAY WAS SOMETHING THAT
IMPACTED BISSONNETTE WAS THIS
VISIT FROM LE PEN FROM FRANCE,
YOU KNOW?
AND THESE TYPES OF LEADERS, LIKE
WHAT AMIRA IS SAYING, LANGUAGE
MATTERS.
AND THE THINGS LEADERS ARE
SAYING, LIKE DONALD TRUMP, LIKE
LE PEN, TALKING ABOUT THESE
DIVISIVE POLITICS, ABOUT LETTING
PEOPLE KNOW THAT THERE ARE
MUSLIMS AND THERE'S US.

The caption changes to "Connect with us: @theagenda, TVO.org, Facebook, YouTube, Instagram, Podcasts."

Steve says IT SHOULD BE STATED
THAT THESE LEADERS HAVE MILLIONS
OF FOLLOWERS AND THEY ALL
OBVIOUSLY DON'T GO OUT AND DO
THESE HEINOUS ACTS.
THERE'S SOMETHING DIFFERENT
ABOUT THIS SUSPECT, IF HE'S IN
FACT THE GUY, ISN'T THERE?

Kamran says OH, ABSOLUTELY.
ABSOLUTELY.
GOING BACK TO THE IDEA OF DONALD
TRUMP, I THINK WHAT DONALD TRUMP
HAS BROUGHT FORTH OR BROUGHT TO
THE SURFACE ARE THOSE SORT OF
CLOSET XENOPHOBES OR THE COUCH
ISLAMOPHOBES, AND NOW THEY'RE
BECOMING A LOT MORE EXPRESSIVE.
I THINK ON SNL, YOU KNOW,
THERE'S A COMEDIAN ON RECENTLY.

Steve says "SATURDAY NIGHT LIVE."

Kamran says RIGHT.
HE COMES ON AND ONE OF THE
THINGS HE SAYS, HE SAYS, ALL YOU
PEOPLE THAT WERE PRETENDING, GO
BACK TO PRETENDING.
THIS IS NOT OKAY.
GO BACK TO THAT.
THAT WAS THE WAY THINGS SHOULD
BE.
AND I THINK THAT THAT'S SORT OF
AN EMOTION OR A FEELING THAT A
LOT OF PEOPLE ARE FEELING,
ESPECIALLY AFTER THE ELECTION OF
DONALD TRUMP.

Steve says CHRISTIAN, IN YOUR
MIND, ANY CONNECTION BETWEEN THE
PROVINCE OF Québec AND ITS... I
MEAN, WE SAW WHAT THE PARTI
QUEBECOIS TRIED TO DO BEFORE,
BANNING RELIGIOUS SYMBOLS AND
THAT KIND OF THING.
DO YOU THINK IT'S A COINCIDENCE
THAT THIS HAPPENED IN THE
PROVINCE OF Québec?

The caption changes to "Christian Leuprecht. Queen's University."

Christian says I
THINK THERE'S AN INTERESTING
POLITICAL ECOSYSTEM HERE.
GOING BACK AS FAR AS UNION
NATIONAL, A CONTINENTAL
EUROPEAN, A THICKER CONCEPTION
OF CITIZENSHIP AND WHAT MAKES
YOU A QuébecER, AND WE SEE THIS
EXPRESSED IN OTHER FORMS AS
WELL.
FOR INSTANCE, WHILE SORT OF
ATTACKS AGAINST SORT OF JEWISH
INSTALLATIONS, SO ANTI-SEMITIC
EXPRESSIONS HAVE NOT COMPLETELY
BUT LARGELY DISAPPEARED IN
ANGLOPHONE CANADA, IT'S STILL
QUITE A REGULAR OCCURRENCE IN
Québec, FOR INSTANCE.
THERE IS A BROADER SENTIMENT OF
IT, IT IS MUCH MORE DIFFICULT
FOR SOMEONE WHO IS NOT PART OF
THAT THICK CONCEPTION OF Québec
NATIONALISM AND CITIZENSHIP IN
AT LEAST SOME QuébecERS' MINDS
TO BE PART OF THE Québec
POLITICAL COMMUNITY.

Steve says DO YOU WANT TO FOLLOW
UP ON THAT?
IT'S REALLY HARD TO SORT OF
FIGURE OUT HOW MUCH OF THIS IS A
Québec STORY, IS A MUSLIM STORY,
IS A TERRORISM STORY... THERE'S
A BUNCH... A TRUMP STORY, A LOT
OF DIFFERENT COMPETING INTERESTS
HERE, IS A CONSERVATIVE PARTY OF
CANADA, SOME OF THE CANDIDATES,
WHAT ROLE SOME OF THAT MAY HAVE
PLAYED IN ANY OF THIS?
HAVE YOU GOT ANY OF THAT FIGURED
OUT YET?

The caption changes to "Bessma Momani. Centre for International Governance Innovation."

Bessma says I THINK IT'S
ALL OF THE ABOVE AND IT'S REALLY
IMPORTANT.
THE DANGER WE HAVE IN SAYING
THIS IS JUST A Québec STORY IS
TO ARGUE IN THAT ISLAMOPHOBIA
DOESN'T EXIST OUTSIDE OF Québec.

Steve says WHICH IS RIDICULOUS.
OF COURSE IT DOES.

Bessma says ISLAMOPHOBIA
IS A PROBLEM IN ANGLOPHONE
CANADA AND IN FRANCOPHONE
CANADA.
DEFINITELY FRANCOPHONE CANADA
AND Québec HAVE BIGGER DEBATES
ABOUT INTEGRATION, BIGGER
DEBATES ABOUT WHO BELONGS AND
WHAT ARE Québec VALUES, AND
SECULARISM BEING A CORE
PHENOMENA THERE.
I HAVE TO POINT OUT, MARINE
LE PEN IS AN INSTIGATOR CLEARLY
IN THIS PROCESS BECAUSE WE KNOW
THIS FELLOW WAS RADICALIZED WHEN
SHE CAME TO Québec AND SPOKE IN
MARCH.
ONE OF THE THINGS I TAKE COMFORT
IN IS THE POLITICAL
ESTABLISHMENT COMPLETELY IGNORED
HER WHEN SHE WAS THERE, THEY DID
NOT WANT TO CATER TO THAT.

Steve says ACTUALLY TRUMP DID
TOO, FUNNILY ENOUGH, WHEN SHE
VISITED HIM IN NEW YORK.
THERE WASN'T MUCH PUBLICITY
AROUND THAT EITHER.

Bessma says I DON'T KNOW
WHAT HAPPENS IN BACK CHANNELS.
I'M NOT SURE ABOUT THAT STORY.
I CAN TELL YOU ONE THING WE KNOW
IS WHEN THE BLOC QUEBECOIS, FOR
EXAMPLE, KNEW THAT SOME OF ITS
MEMBERS WENT AND ATTENDED HER
TALK, HE WAS PRETTY OUTRAGED AT
THIS, AND I THINK THAT'S REALLY
IMPORTANT.
SO THE POLITICAL ESTABLISHMENT
THANKFULLY HAS NOT GONE DOWN
THAT PATH IN Québec.
WE HAVE TO POINT OUT THAT KELLIE
LEITCH, SAD TO SAY, DOES
SOMETIMES, I THINK, KIND OF PUSH
THIS NARRATIVE OF US VERSUS THEM
AND THAT SOMEHOW MUSLIM
CANADIANS DON'T BELONG OR DON'T
FOLLOW CANADIAN VALUES.
SHE IS A PERPETRATOR OF THAT.

Steve says IF SHE WERE HERE,
SHE WOULD SAY, AND I THINK SHE
WAS, I WAS THE FIRST PERSON TO
PUT A NOTE OUT ON TWITTER THAT
SHE WAS APPALLED BY WHAT
TRANSPIRED AND OBVIOUSLY OPPOSED
TO IT AND HAD THAT OUT THERE ON
THE RECORD PROBABLY BEFORE
ANYBODY ELSE.

Bessma says BUT ACTIONS
SPEAK LOUDER THAN TWEETS.
IT JUST DOES.
ANYBODY WHO... THEIR HEAD IS IN
THE SAND TO ARGUE THAT SOMEHOW
KELLIE LEITCH IS NOT PROPOSING
THIS KIND OF NARRATIVE AND
UNFORTUNATELY FEEDING INTO THE
POPULIST SENTIMENT THAT IS THAT
UNDERCURRENT THAT KAMRAN TALKED
ABOUT.
THEY ARE OUT THERE.
THERE IS THIS XENOPHOBIC, I
THINK, PART OF THIS SOCIETY
THROUGHOUT THE ENTIRE WORLD THAT
FRANKLY WANT TO PLAY UP THIS
DIVISIVE NARRATIVE.
IT'S INCUMBENT ON LEADERS LIKE
KELLIE LEITCH AND OTHERS SEEKING
HIGH OFFICE TO PUT THAT DOWN AND
NOT ENTERTAIN IT WHATSOEVER, AS
DID I THINK THE PARTI QUEBECOIS
DID WHEN MARINE LE PEN CAME TO TOWN.

The caption changes to "Amira Elghawaby, @AmiraElghawaby."

Amira says YES, THANKS.
I THINK IT'S ALSO IMPORTANT TO
POINT OUT THAT KELLIE LEITCH
JUST A FEW DAYS AGO CAME OUT
VERY STRONGLY AGAINST A MOTION
THAT HAS BEEN PUT FORWARD BY AN
M.P. WITH THE LIBERAL PARTY
WHERE SHE HAS PUT OUT A MOTION
TO SORT OF EXAMINE AND EXPLORE
ISLAMOPHOBIA IN CANADA, SO
CALLING ON THE FEDERAL
GOVERNMENT TO UNDERSTAND THIS
PHENOMENON, AS HAS BEEN STUDIED
PREVIOUSLY THE ISSUE OF
ANTI-SEMITISM, THAT WE NEED TO
SORT OF UNDERSTAND THE FACT THAT
ISLAMOPHOBIA IS INDEED RISING IN
CANADA ACCORDING TO STATISTICS
CANADA POLICE-REPORTED DATA.
SO KELLIE LEITCH JUST A FEW DAYS
AGO, YOU KNOW, PUT DOWN THIS
MOTION, AND THEN A FEW DAYS
LATER TWEETS HER SYMPATHIES.
SO ONE HAS TO ASK, YOU KNOW,
OKAY, TWEET YOUR SYMPATHY, BUT
WE DO EXPECT OUR POLITICAL
LEADERS TO TRY TO UNDERSTAND THE
PHENOMENON OF HATE WHEREVER IT
COMES FROM, AND TO UNDERSTAND
THAT, YES, CANADIAN MUSLIMS AND
Québec MUSLIMS AND OTHER
PROVINCES, NOT JUST Québec, ARE
DEEPLY CONCERNED ABOUT THIS.
AS I MENTIONED, WE ARE SEEING A
RISE IN HUMAN RIGHTS COMPLAINTS
COMING TO US ABOUT THIS
PHENOMENON.
WE DO NEED TO STUDY IT IN
CANADA.
I WOULD HOPE THAT THERE WOULD BE
ALL-PARTY SUPPORT FOR THIS MOTION.

Steve says YOU KNOW, I WANT TO
TALK ABOUT THE INVESTIGATION A
BIT AND I APPRECIATE THE POLICE
HAVE A DIFFICULT JOB TO DO AND
IT'S AN EVOLVING CASE AND HAVING
SAID THAT, THERE WAS A LOT OF
CONFUSION AT FIRST AS TO WHETHER
IT WAS ONE OR TWO SHOOTERS.
THE POLICE WERE, SOME WOULD
ARGUE, A LITTLE SLOW OFF THE
MARK IN GETTING INFORMATION OUT
TO THE PUBLIC, ANNOUNCING THE
NAME OF THE SUSPECT CAME WELL
AFTER THEY HAD THE SUSPECT IN
DETENTION.
WHAT'S WITH ALL THAT?

Amarnath says I MEAN, IT WAS A VERY
IRRITATING MORNING FOR ME
BECAUSE OF ALL THAT CONFUSION.
WHAT HAPPENED WAS THE NAMES WERE
LEAKED.
THEY DIDN'T ACTUALLY MENTION THE
NAMES IN THE PRESS CONFERENCE
BUT THE NAMES WERE LEAKED AND
BECAUSE THE TWO NAMES AND THE
TWO IDENTITIES DON'T REALLY FIT
TOGETHER IN ANY KIND OF
IDEOLOGICAL WAY THAT WOULD
SATISFY PEOPLE, LOTS OF
CONFUSION STARTED.
SO THIS GUY'S JUST A WHITE KID
FROM Québec CITY, THIS IS A
MOROCCAN MAN, PEOPLE WERE SAYING
IS HE A CONVERT, YOU KNOW, IS
THIS MOROCCAN GUY SOMEHOW
FORCING HIM TO DO THIS BECAUSE
HE HAD SURRENDERED A WHILE LATER
AND ALL THIS KIND OF CONFUSION
STARTED AND IT WAS ONLY MUCH
LATER, AS YOU'VE POINTED OUT, AT
NOON OR 1:00 WHERE FINALLY THEY
SAID, OH, BISSONNETTE WAS THE
SUSPECT AND THE OTHER IS THE
VICTIM OR A WITNESS.

Steve says A WITNESS.

Amarnath says I THINK PART OF WHAT HAPPENS
WITH THAT IS, WITH SOCIAL MEDIA,
MISINFORMATION SPREADS AT VERY
HIGH RATES.
EVEN NOW IF YOU GOOGLE THESE TWO
NAMES, ALL OF THAT HASN'T BEEN
CORRECTED.
SO THE NAMES OF THE MOROCCAN MAN
WENT WORLD WIDE, IT WAS ON THE
BBC, A FRIEND OF MINE GOT
INTERVIEWED BY NEW ZEALAND
RADIO, IT WAS EVERYWHERE.
AND OF COURSE THE CORRECTION
DIDN'T MAKE THAT KIND OF A
SPLASH.
AND SO... ANOTHER INTERESTING
TIDBIT OF ALL OF THIS IS THERE
WAS A SECOND GUY WITH THE SAME
NAME, MOHAMMED KHADIR, WHOSE
Facebook PAGE WAS MAKING THE
ROUNDS ON TWITTER.
I WENT ON AND NOTICED PICTURES
OF HIS FACE WERE STARTING TO
DISAPPEAR OFF OF THIS Facebook
PAGE.
IT BECAME OBVIOUS THIS WASN'T
THE RIGHT PERSON BECAUSE THE
OTHER GUY IS SUPPOSED TO BE IN
CUSTODY.
AND SO I MESSAGED HIM AND THEN
WE GOT TO TALKING A BIT AND HE
SAID, YEAH, I'VE BEEN GETTING
THREATS AND GETTING ALL KINDS
OF e-mails.
SO I THINK PART OF THE PROBLEM,
IF IT'S NOT DONE CAREFULLY, IS
IT CAN LEAVE DESTRUCTION IN ITS
WAKE IF YOU'RE NOT CAREFUL ABOUT
HOW YOU KIND OF WALK CANADIANS
THROUGH WHAT'S HAPPENING.

Steve says THIS FOLLOW-UP
QUESTION TO A GUY WHO DOESN'T
EVEN HAVE A TWITTER ACCOUNT IS A
BIT UNUSUAL, CHRISTIAN, HOWEVER,
YOU ARE A MILITARY GUY AND
OBVIOUSLY THE Québec PROVINCIAL
POLICE IS A QUASI-MILITARY
ORGANIZATION.
IT'S TRULY INCUMBENT UPON OUR
POLICE SERVICES NOWADAYS TO GET
FAST, ACCURATE INFORMATION OUT
AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE, ISN'T
IT, SO THAT THESE CHARACTER
ASSASSINATIONS DON'T TAKE ON A
LIFE OF THEIR OWN ON SOCIAL
MEDIA AND PEOPLE'S LIVES ARE
DISRUPTED AND-OR RUINED BY FALSE
ALLEGATIONS.

Christian says WE SAW
TWO INSTANCES OF THAT, ON
BERLIN, THE MAYOR WAS ON THE
MEDIA AND SAYING IT WAS TO
FORESTALL MISCOMMUNICATION.
IN THIS DAY AND AGE THE MOMENT
YOU LEAVE A VOID, PEOPLE WILL
START TRYING TO FILL IT IN ONE
WAY OR ANOTHER, AND NAME
ASSOCIATIONS MEAN THAT
COMPLETELY INNOCENT VICTIMS END
UP BEING... AND PEOPLE END UP
BEING VICTIMIZED AS AS A RESULT
OF THE RAPID SPREAD OF SOCIAL
MEDIA.
ON A SUNDAY NIGHT YOU'RE LIMITED
IN TERMS OF YOUR RESOURCES TO
RESPOND AND SO YOUR MEDIA
RESPONSE IS GOING TO BE MAKE
SURE THERE'S NO FURTHER RISK TO
THE COMMUNITY AND THEN YOU WANT
TO IMMEDIATELY ESTABLISH WHAT
MIGHT BE THE FURTHER LINKS THESE
INDIVIDUALS HAVE THAT MIGHT POSE
RISKS TO THE COMMUNITY.
IF I'M THE INCIDENT COMMANDER,
I'M GOING WITH, MY OBJECTIVE IS
TO MAKE SURE WE KEEP EVERYBODY
SAFE AND THERE'S NO IMMEDIATE
PEOPLE HE MIGHT BE LINKED TO TO
TRY TO REPLICATE THIS, ELSEWHERE
IN THE CITY OR THE PROVINCE.

Steve says PLEASE.

The caption changes to "Amarnath Amarasingam, @AmarnathAmarasingam."

Amarnath says WHILE INITIALLY THE FACT THAT
THE PRESS CONFERENCE DIDN'T
MENTION THE NAMES IS A BIT
IRRITATING.
IT WAS ACTUALLY A SMART MOVE ON
THE PART OF LAW ENFORCEMENT.
RIGHT BEFORE THEN OVERNIGHT YOU
HAD FOX NEWS KIND OF RUN WITH
THE STORY THAT THIS IS DONE BY A
MOROCCAN AND SOMEBODY SAID
ALLAHU AKBAR DURING THE ATTACK.
IF THOSE TWO WERE MENTIONED AS
SUSPECTS DURING THE PRESS
CONFERENCE, A LOT MORE DAMAGE
WOULD HAVE BEEN DONE.
THEY WERE SMART NOT TO MENTION
THE NAMES BUT SOMEHOW THEY STILL
GOT LEAKED.

Steve says KAMRAN, YOU WANTED TO ADD?

Kamran says ONE OF THE
CHALLENGES ENDED UP BEING WHEN
THE NAMES DID GET LEAKED, LIKE
YOU SAID, THERE WAS ALL THIS HIT
TER I CAN'T.
I KNOW... HYSTERIA.
I KNOW PEOPLE WERE CALLING ME
SAYING A MUSLIM WAS SHOOTING UP
THE MOSQUE?
A MUSLIM WAS THE ONE THAT WAS
KILLING ALL THESE PEOPLE?
YOU KNOW, WHO IS BISSONNETTE?
WAS HE A CONVERT, LIKE YOU SAID?
WERE THEY IN ON IT TOGETHER?
ARE THEY ISIS?
WAS THIS A SHIA MOSQUE?

Steve says THAT'S WHAT I GOT.
SOMEONE SENT ME AN e-mail
SAYING IS THIS A SUNNI-SHIA THING.

Kamran says THAT STARTED
RUNNING ON TWITTER AND THROUGH
NEWS CHANNELS AS WELL.
THERE IS A RESPONSIBILITY ON THE
POLICE SERVICES TO SORT OF
CLEARLY LAY OUT WHO'S WHO IN
THIS STORY AND THAT THERE WILL
BE FURTHER INFORMATION THAT WILL
BE PROVIDED.
BECAUSE THEN EVEN AFTER THAT,
THERE WAS THE VACUUM OF SAYING,
WELL, ONE OF THEM IS A SUSPECT
AND THE OTHER ONE IS JUST A
WITNESS.
AND THEN I HEARD THAT MINORITY
PRAYER SAYING, OH, PLEASE DON'T
LET IT BE US.
BECAUSE WE KNEW WE WERE DOWN TO
50-50 NOW.
REALLY, PEOPLE WERE SAYING THAT.
THEY'RE SAYING LET'S HOPE THAT
MOHAMMED IS THE ONE THAT'S THE
WITNESS.
I CAN TELL YOU THAT WHEN IT
TURNED OUT THAT MOHAMMED WAS THE
WITNESS IN THIS, I CAN TELL YOU
THAT THAT SIGH OF RELIEF WAS
ALMOST PALPABLE.

Steve says AMIRA, IS THAT FAIR
TO SAY?

Amira says ABSOLUTELY.
BUT I THINK... I JUST WANT TO
TAKE A MOMENT BECAUSE THE
REALITY IS THAT AROUND THE WORLD
THERE IS CONFLICT BETWEEN
DIFFERENT MUSLIM COMMUNITIES AS
WELL.
SO I THINK IT WAS RIGHT FOR MANY
PEOPLE TO SORT OF PAUSE.
I THINK WE WERE ALL TRYING TO
SORT OF PAUSE AS WELL IN OUR
COMMENT ON WHAT WAS GOING ON
BECAUSE WE REALLY DID... AND
STILL DO... NEED MORE
INFORMATION.
AND I THINK THAT BECAUSE... OF
COURSE, IT'S A VERY VOLATILE
SITUATION.
PEOPLE ARE AFRAID, YOU KNOW,
THEY'RE AFRAID TO TAKE THEIR
CHILDREN TO SCHOOL.
REMEMBER, THERE ARE ISLAMIC
SCHOOLS AROUND THE COUNTRY.
THERE ARE OTHER MUSLIM COMMUNITY
CENTRES.
THERE ARE PLACES THAT ARE
VISIBLY MUSLIM.
THERE ARE WOMEN LIKE MYSELF
WEARING HEADSCARVES WALKING IN
THE STREET.
WAS IT SOMEONE WITHIN THE MUSLIM
COMMUNITY THAT HAS A BEEF WITH
THAT PARTICULAR MOSQUE?
YOU KNOW, WHAT WAS GOING ON?
AND I THINK IN THAT VOID I ALSO
STARTED SEEING SOME SORT OF FAKE
NEWS, I SAW SORT OF AN ACCOUNT
FOR REUTERS THAT HAD, YOU KNOW,
PICTURES OF TWO WHITE GUYS WITH
COWBOY HATS AND PEOPLE WERE
CIRCULATING THIS AS IF IT WAS
REAL.
SO I THINK THAT WE HAVE TO
UNDERSTAND THAT IN A MOMENT LIKE
THIS, WE ACTUALLY DO ALL
COLLECTIVELY HAVE TO BE PATIENT
FOR THE RIGHT INFORMATION
BECAUSE IT IS EXTREMELY
FRIGHTENING.
IT IS EXTREMELY FRIGHTENING.
WE CAN ONLY IMAGINE WHAT THE
COMMUNITY IMMEDIATELY THERE IS
DEALING WITH.
SO WE ALSO HAVE TO BE VERY
CAREFULLY BECAUSE WE DON'T KNOW.
WE DON'T KNOW EXACTLY ALL THE
DETAILS STILL AND ARE WAITING
FOR THAT.
SO IT IS VERY DIFFICULT IN THAT
TIME.
PEOPLE DO WANT TO FILL IN THE
INFORMATION.
BUT WE DO LOOK TO THE MEDIA AND
WE LOOK TO LAW ENFORCEMENT TO
SORT OF OPERATE WISELY AND BE
VERY CAREFUL.

Steve says BESSMA, I WANT TO
FOLLOW UP ON SOMETHING YOU SAID
TO ME ABOUT HALF AN HOUR AGO AS
WE WERE WALKING INTO THE STUDIO
TONIGHT IN THE HALLWAY.
YOU JUST LOOKED AT ME AND SAID,
THIS IS THE NEW NORMAL.
WHAT DID YOU MEAN BY THAT?

Bessma says TWO THINGS:
THE RISE OF POPULIST PARTIES
AROUND THE GLOBE, THE
XENOPHOBIA, THE OUTWARD RACISM
OF POLITICAL LEADERS WHO
UNABASHEDLY GO ON TELEVISION OR
TWEET THEIR HATRED AND NOBODY
BLINKS AN EYE.
THE WHOLE LOSS OF CIVILITY IS
REALLY SADDENING AND I SEE THAT
OBVIOUSLY NOT JUST IN IN THE
UNITED STATES, OUR EYES AND EARS
ARE TURNED THERE, BUT IT'S
HAPPENING THROUGHOUT EUROPE.
THE RISE OF RIGHT WING POPULIST
XENOPHOBIC PARTIES ARE CREEPING
UP IN MANY PARTS OF EUROPE AND
THEY HAVE A REAL SHOT AT SOME OF
THESE NATIONAL ELECTIONS COMING
UP, NOT JUST MUNICIPAL
ELECTIONS, NO LONGER FRINGE
MOVEMENTS, THEY'RE INCREASINGLY
BEING MAINSTREAM AND THAT'S
REALLY QUITE FRIGHTENING.
AND TERRORISM SADLY HAS BECOME A
NEW NORMAL.
THE GENIE IS OUT OF THE BOTTLE.
THERE ARE LOTS OF SOFT TARGETS.
WEAPONRY NOW... IF THE WHOLE
INDICATION THAT HE HAD AN AK 47
IS TRUE, THESE KIND OF WEAPONRY
THAT WERE NEVER IN THE HANDS OF
CRIMINALS BEFORE BUT WERE ONLY
IN THE HANDS OF MILITARY ARE NOW
COMMON PLACE.
THE MASS KILLINGS... THE NUMBER
OF PEOPLE THAT CAN BE KILLED BY
THESE ASSAULT WEAPONS ARE MUCH,
MUCH HIGHER THAN IN THE OLD
DAYS, SO TO SPEAK.
SO WE'RE GOING TO SEE MORE OF
THESE SOFT TARGETS, MORE TERROR,
AND UNFORTUNATELY MORE
RADICALIZATION FOR SOME OF THE
SAME REASONS THAT WE ATTRIBUTE
TO, YOU KNOW, TERRORISM GLOBALLY
ON THE RISE, I'M AFRAID TO SAY
WE'RE GOING TO SEE THAT FROM
BOTH THE RIGHT AND THE LEFT NOW.

The caption changes to "tvo.org/theagenda."

Steve says SOMEBODY FROM THE
JEWISH COMMUNITY eMAILED ME
TODAY SAYING... GO BACK TO THE
BIBLE AND JEWS AND MUSLIMS ARE
COUSINS... SAID, YOU KNOW, IT'S
DIFFICULT AT HIGH HOLIDAY TIME
TO GO TO ANY SYNAGOGUE ANYWHERE
IN THE COUNTRY AND NOT SEE ARMED
POLICE OFFICERS STANDING OUTSIDE
AND THEY EXPECTED THAT TO BECOME
THE NEW NORMAL AT MOSQUES.
DO YOU THINK SO TOO?

Bessma says I THINK
THERE'S GOING TO BE A CALL FOR
THAT, DEFINITELY.
I DARE SAY THAT UNFORTUNATELY IF
WE SEE MORE OF THESE KINDS OF
INCIDENCES, THERE'S GOING TO BE
CALLS FOR THAT.
YOU KNOW, I THINK OF SORT OF
WHAT HAPPENED IN PARIS IN THE
SYNAGOGUE AS WELL, THE SAME TYPE
OF FEAR THAT'S EXISTING THEN IN
THE PARIS COMMUNITY IS HAPPENING
NOW IN THE MUSLIM COMMUNITY HERE
IN CANADA.
AND THERE WILL BE CALLS I THINK
FOR ADDED SECURITY, ABSOLUTELY.

Steve says I DON'T KNOW HOW
MANY OF YOU SAW ANY OF THE
AMERICAN NETWORK NEWSCASTS
TONIGHT, WHATEVER TIME THEY PLAY
THEM, 6:30, 7:00, WHEREVER YOU
HAPPEN TO LIVE.
THE PRIME MINISTER OF CANADA WAS
ALL OVER THOSE NETWORK
NEWSCASTS, HIS SPEECH IN THE
HOUSE TODAY, YOU KNOW, WAS
REALLY QUITE SOMETHING, AND THE
OTHER LEADERS AS WELL, RONA
AMBROSE, TOM MULCAIR, ELIZABETH
MAY... THEY ALL GAVE QUITE
STIRRING, IMPRESSIVE,
IMPASSIONED SPEECHES, ATTACKING
ISLAMOPHOBIA AND DEFENDING THE
DIVERSITY THAT IS SUCH A
FOUNDATION OF THIS COUNTRY.
I'D LIKE YOU ALL TO CONTRAST
THAT WITH THE PRESIDENT'S
SPOKESPERSON, A MAN BY THE NAME
OF SEAN SPICER, WHO HAD HIS OWN
MOMENTS IN FRONT OF THE CANADA
TODAY.
SHELDON, ROLL IT.

A clip plays on screen in which Sean Spicer gives an official briefing at the white house. He's in his fifties, clean-shaven, with short, side-parted blond hair.

He says I WANT TO START OFF BY NOTING
THE PRESIDENT GOT OFF THE PHONE
JUST A SHORT TIME AGO WITH
CANADIAN PRIME MINISTER TRUDEAU
TO DISCUSS THE VICIOUS ATTACK ON
A Québec CITY MOSQUE LAST NIGHT.
THE PRESIDENT OFFERED HIS
CONDOLENCES AS WELL AS HIS
THOUGHTS AND PRAYERS TO THE
VICTIMS AND THEIR FAMILY AND TO
ALL CANADIANS.
THIS IS ANOTHER SENSELESS ACT OF
VIOLENCE THAT CANNOT BE
TOLERATED.
THE PRESIDENT ALSO PLEDGED TO
SUPPORT THE CANADIAN POLICE AND
INTELLIGENCE SERVICE IN ANY WAY
NECESSARY.
PRIME MINISTER TRUDEAU WAS
EXTREMELY APPRECIATIVE AND HE
WAS ALSO CAUTIOUS TO DRAW
CONCLUSIONS OF THE MOTIVES AT
THIS STAGE OF THE INVESTIGATION.
CANADIAN LAW ENFORCEMENT
OFFICIALS ARE ACTIVELY
INVESTIGATING THIS MATTER.
WE CONDEMN THIS ATTACK IN THE
STRONGEST POSSIBLE TERMS.
IT'S A TERRIBLE REMINDER OF WHY
WE MUST REMAIN VIGILANT AND WHY
THE PRESIDENT IS TAKING STEPS TO
BE PRO ACTIVE RATHER THAN
REACTIVE WHEN IT COMES TO OUR
NATION'S SAFETY AND SECURITY.

The clip ends.

Steve says THAT, OF COURSE, A
REFERENCE TO THE SUSPENSION
AND-OR BAN OF CITIZENS FROM
SEVEN PREDOMINANTLY MUSLIM
COUNTRIES AND OBVIOUSLY ALL OF
THE CONFUSION AND, WELL, I'LL
JUST LEAVE IT THERE, THAT'S
TAKEN PLACE OVER THE LAST COUPLE
OF DAYS ON THAT.
CONTRAST THAT WITH WHAT THE
PRIME MINISTER OF CANADA SAID
WHEN HE DID SAY WE'RE GOING TO
REACH OUT WITH LOVE, ET CETERA.
YOUR THOUGHTS?

Kamran says I SAW SEAN
SPICER, THE PRESS CONFERENCE,
AND I WAS THINKING IN MY HEAD, I
SAID, WHERE IS HE GETTING HIS
INFORMATION FROM?
AND HOW BOLD, YOU KNOW, OF
COMMENTS WAS HE MAKING.
HE JUST FLAT-OUT WITH A STRAIGHT
FACE SAID, YOU KNOW, HE WAS FROM
MOROCCO AND THE U.S. GOVERNMENT
WILL DO WHAT IT CAN TO BE
PROACTIVE IN BANNING PEOPLE FROM
THESE COUNTRIES.
AND THEN YOU LOOK AT WHAT THE
PRIME MINISTER SAYS, AND THE
TIMING WAS AROUND THE SAME TIME.
SO QUESTION PERIOD IS ABOUT
2 P.M. AND HIS SPEECH IS JUST
BEFORE 2 P.M. AND SEAN SPICER
WAS UP AROUND 2 P.M. AS WELL.
AND THE FEELING THAT I GOT AFTER
LISTENING TO PRIME MINISTER
TRUDEAU AND ALL THE LEADERS, YOU
KNOW, ELIZABETH MAY WAS ALMOST
IN TEARS, IF YOU WATCHED HER.
THESE WERE HEARTFELT MESSAGES
THAT LET THE MUSLIM COMMUNITY
KNOW, THIS FEARFUL MUSLIM
COMMUNITY, KNOW THAT THEY'RE
PART OF THE FABRIC OF THIS
SOCIETY AND THAT THEY'RE WELCOME
HERE AND THAT, YOU KNOW, THE
CONTRIBUTIONS OF MUSLIMS IN THIS
COUNTRY IS SOMETHING THAT'S VERY
SIGNIFICANT AND SOMETHING THAT
SHOULD BE CELEBRATED, VERSUS
WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN THE UNITED
STATES WHERE, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE
BEING TOLD THAT IT'S FOR THEIR
SAFETY.
WE NEED TO SAVE YOU FROM THE
MUSLIMS.
IN PARTICULAR, MUSLIMS FROM
THESE SEVEN PARTICULAR
COUNTRIES, OF WHICH, IN THE
HISTORY OF THE UNITED STATES,
THERE HAS BEEN NO TERRORIST
ATTACK IN THE UNITED STATES FROM
ANYBODY OF ANY OF THESE SEVEN
NATIONS.

Steve says IRONICALLY, 19 OF
THE 20 HIJACKERS ON 9-11 WERE
FROM SAUDI ARABIA AND SAUDI IS
NOT ON THE LIST.

Kamran says THAT'S RIGHT.

Steve says GO AHEAD, AMIRA.

Amira says IT WAS,
YOU KNOW, A MISSED OPPORTUNITY,
AND I THINK... IT'S BEEN ONLY A
WEEK THAT PRESIDENT TRUMP HAS
BEEN IN OFFICE AND, YOU KNOW,
BEFORE HE TOOK OFFICE, PEOPLE
WERE LIKE, MAYBE HE'S GOING TO
CHANGE HIS TONE.
MAYBE HE'LL START SOUNDING MORE
PRESIDENTIAL, IF THAT'S EVEN
POSSIBLE.
BUT WHAT WAS VERY DISAPPOINTING
WAS HERE THERE WAS A MOMENT FOR
THE AMERICAN ADMINISTRATION TO
SHOW SOME SYMPATHY, SOME
COMPASSION FOR THE LOSS OF LIFE
IN Québec CITY, BUT RATHER, THEY
USED IT AS AN OPPORTUNITY TO
FURTHER SORT OF CAUSE DIVISION,
SUSPICION OF AN ENTIRE
COMMUNITY.
AGAIN, A MISSED OPPORTUNITY.
WHY DID WE NOT HEAR ANYTHING
ABOUT THE HATE CRIMES THAT ARE
HAPPENING IN THE UNITED STATES
RIGHT NOW?
AT LEAST ONE OR TWO MOSQUES WERE
FIRE-BOMBED OVER THE WEEKEND, IN
TEXAS AND OTHER PLACES WE'RE
HEARING ABOUT HATE CRIMES ACROSS
THE UNITED STATES.
AMERICAN MUSLIMS ARE EXTREMELY
FEARFUL RIGHT NOW, THOUGH AGAIN
BUOYED BY THE SOLIDARITY THEY'RE
SEEING BY FELLOW AMERICANS.
NEVERTHELESS, PRESIDENT TRUMP IS
SUPPOSED TO BE EVERYONE'S
PRESIDENT.
WHY ISN'T HE SPEAKING OUT ON
BEHALF OF AMERICAN MUSLIMS AS
WELL.
THAT'S THE BIG, OF COURSE,
QUESTION.

Steve says AMIRA, I SHOULD
POINT OUT, SINCE YOU MENTIONED
TEXAS, I THINK I SAW ON THE NEWS
TONIGHT THE MAYOR OF DALLAS WITH
FLOWERS... HAVE I GOT THIS RIGHT?
WITH FLOWERS, DELIVERING THEM
TO A GROUP OF MUSLIM REFUGEES IN
TEXAS AS IF TO SAY, YOU KNOW,
THE PRESIDENT MAY BE THE
PRESIDENT, BUT HE DOESN'T SPEAK
FOR ALL OF US ON THIS OCCASION.
AMARNATH, I WONDER WHAT YOU
THOUGHT OF BETWEEN WHAT THE
PRIME MINISTER OF CANADA SAID
AND WHAT THE PRESIDENT OF THE
UNITED STATES SIGNED?

Amarnath says IT'S A NIGHTMARE.
OBAMA IS GOOD AT THIS LANGUAGES
THING.
HE HAD THE POWER TO UNITE AND
SPEAK TO PEOPLE.
BUT, I MEAN, PART OF MY PROBLEM
IS THE MEDIA THAT'S SITTING IN
FRONT OF SEAN SPICER RARELY ASKS
HIM THE QUESTIONS THAT MATTER,
LIKE THE ONES, SO WHAT DO YOU
THINK OF THE ATTACKS IN TEXAS?
NO QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT.
THERE'S NO CHALLENGING QUESTIONS
ABOUT... YOU KNOW, THERE'S THIS
HILARIOUS STORY OVER THE WEEKEND
THAT ANGELA MERKEL HAD TO
EXPLAIN TO THE PRESIDENT OF THE
UNITED STATES WHAT THE 1951
REFUGEE CONVENTION WAS BECAUSE A
LOT OF THE BACKLASH THAT YOU'RE
GETTING IS BASED ON THIS
CONVENTION, THE 1967 PROTOCOL.

Steve says IN FAIRNESS, YOU
WOULDN'T EXPECT A NEW YORK
PROPERTY DEVELOPER TO KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT THE
'51 CONVENTION ON REFUGEES, RIGHT?

Amarnath says NO, BUT IF YOU'RE GOING TO
PUT IN REFUGEE LAW AND THEN GET
BACKLASH BASED ON THAT, YOU
SHOULD HAVE SOME UNDERSTANDING
OF WHAT YOU'RE DOING.
SO I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF... I
MEAN, YOU SPEAK OF THE NEW
NORMAL.
I THINK THE OTHER NEW NORMAL IS
A WHOLE LOT OF THINGS ARE
HAPPENING BASED ON
MISINFORMATION AND THIS KIND OF
OBSESSION WITH FAKE NEWS.
A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T UNDERSTAND
WHAT'S HAPPENING.
THERE'S A GOOD CNN ARTICLE TODAY
WHERE THEY WENT OUT AND
INTERVIEWED THE SUPPORTERS OF
THE BAN AND THE THINGS THEY SAY
ARE ABSOLUTELY INSANE.
YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE KEY
STATEMENTS WAS, ALL THE RAPES IN
GERMANY ARE HAPPENING BY SYRIAN
REFUGEES.
WHO IS CHALLENGING THESE IDEAS
AND WHERE ARE THESE IDEAS COMING
FROM?
IS ANYONE CHALLENGING THEM?
I THINK PART OF THE PROBLEM
ISN'T JUST, YEAH, THEY SAY CRAZY
THINGS, BUT WHO IS THERE TO SAY,
WAIT A MINUTE, LIKE YOU'RE
TALKING CRAZY.

Steve says BESSMA, LET ME GET
YOU IN HERE ON THE INTERNATIONAL
RELATIONS THAT ARE GOING TO BE A
PART OF THIS GOING FORWARD.
YOU KNOW, PRESIDENT TRUMP HAD
WHAT LOOKED LIKE A PRETTY
SUCCESSFUL MEETING WITH THE
BRITISH PRIME MINISTER THE OTHER
DAY AND SHE CAME OUT WITH A
STATEMENT TODAY SAYING I
COMPLETELY DISASSOCIATE MYSELF
FROM THIS ORDER.
JUSTIN TRUDEAU HAS HAD A COUPLE
OF PHONE CALLS WITH THE NEW U.S.
PRESIDENT BUT THEY HAVEN'T MET
YET.
WHAT DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH
HIS MEETING WITH WORLD LEADERS?

Bessma says PEOPLE WOULD
USUALLY RUSH TO MEET THE NEW
PRESIDENT.
NOW I THINK IT'S A POLITICAL
LIABILITY.
I REALLY DO THINK PEOPLE DON'T
WANT TO HAVE A PHOTO OPPORTUNITY
WITH THIS MAN.
THERE IS A LOT OF, I THINK,
OTHER EXECUTIVE ORDERS COMING
DOWN THE PIPE, WHETHER HE'S
GOING TO BE ATTACKING THE LGBTQ
PLUS COMMUNITY.
WE'RE JUST AT THE BEGINNING OF
IT.
IT'S ONLY DAY 8.
THIS IS WHAT IS SO SCARY.
THERE'S A LOT MORE TO COME FROM
THIS ADMINISTRATION THAT I THINK
ARE REALLY GOING TO FRIGHTEN US
FROM A LIBERAL DEMOCRATIC
PERSPECTIVE OF REALLY WANTING TO
SEE THE KIND OF HUMAN RIGHTS
THAT WE CHERISH SO MUCH.
I THINK IT'S A POLITICAL
LIABILITY.
SO IN TERMS OF INTERNATIONAL
DIPLOMACY, I THINK OF ALL THE
MEETINGS COMING UP, THE G-20,
THE G-7, A NUMBER OF MEETINGS
WHERE USUALLY THIS KIND OF
CIVILITY AND DECORUM WOULD BE
EXPECTED.
THIS MAN IS A RENEGADE.
WE DON'T KNOW WHAT TO EXPECT
FROM HIM.
I WOULDN'T BE RUSHING TO GO TO
THE WHITE HOUSE TO TRY TO TAKE A
PHOTO WITH HIM NOR WOULD I WANT
TO HAVE SUBSTANTIVE POLICY
DISCUSSIONS WITH HIM.
THIS IS THE KIND OF ERA WE'RE IN
WHICH IS REALLY PROBLEMATIC FOR
ANY POLICY MAKER.

Steve says CHRISTIAN, IT'S
INTERESTING THAT MOST OF THE
TIME WHAT CANADA DOES DOESN'T
AMOUNT TO A PEBBLE IN THE SEA
WHEN IT COMES TO INTERNATIONAL
RECOGNITION AND THAT KIND OF
THING.
AND YET I HAVE HEARD IT NUMEROUS
TIMES OVER THE LAST COUPLE OF
WEEKS THAT THE JUSTIN TRUDEAU
GOVERNMENT REPRESENTS ONE OF THE
VERY FEW PRO-LIBERAL DEMOCRATIC
GOVERNMENTS WITHOUT ANY KIND OF
TINGE OF EXTREMISM ANYWHERE IN
THE WORLD TODAY.
DO YOU SEE THAT, OR ARE THESE
PEOPLE JUST SORT OF, YOU KNOW,
EXAGGERATING?

Christian says IN THE
LAST WEEK IT'S INTERESTING
READING EUROPEAN NEWSPAPERS.
THERE'S A CONTRAST AND REGULARLY
ON FRONT PAGES BETWEEN CANADA
AND WHAT HAPPENS IN THE UNITED
STATES AND IT'S BASED OBVIOUSLY
ON IDEOLOGY, IT'S BASED ON A
NARRATIVE, AND BASED ON THE FACT
WE HAVE A U.S. ADMINISTRATION,
IF YOU LOOK AT WHAT HAPPENED IN
THE LAST 24 HOURS, WHERE TRUMP
RESTRUCTURED THE NATIONAL
SECURITY COUNCIL TO REMOVE SOME
OF THE KEY ELEMENTS FROM THAT
COUNCIL, ELEVATE STEPHEN BANNON.
THE CHALLENGE THAT POSES IS HE'S
SURROUNDING HIMSELF WITH PEOPLE
THAT ARE GOING TO REINFORCE THE
NARRATIVE HE WANTS TO HEAR.

Steve says THE ALT-RIGHT NARRATIVE.

Christian says THE
PRIME MINISTER HAS BEEN ABLE TO
ESTABLISH HIMSELF AS SOMEONE WHO
IS INTERESTED IN INFORMED DEBATE
ABOUT THESE ISSUES AND WHO IS...
IT SEEMS LIKE THE LAST BASTION
LEFT TO PLAY A BIT OF AN
OPPOSITION TO THE UNITED STATES
BECAUSE OF COURSE WE HAVE 150
YEARS OF EXPERIENCE AT HAVING TO
LIVE WITH THE FOLKS SOUTH OF THE
49TH PARALLEL AND HAVING BEEN
ABLE TO MAKE THAT RELATIONSHIP
WORK EVEN UNDER DIFFICULT
CIRCUMSTANCES, AND I THINK THE
WORLD IS LOOKING TO CANADA AS A
BIT OF A LITMUS TEST OF HOW DO
WE REIN THIS PERSON IN AND HOW
DO WE ACTUALLY HAVE ANY SORT
OF... NOT SO MUCH A PROTECTIVE
RELATIONSHIP BUT ANY SORT OF
MEANINGFUL RELATIONSHIP WITH
THIS ADMINISTRATION.

Steve says AMIRA, WE'VE HAD A
FASCINATING AND ENGAGING
DISCUSSION TONIGHT AND I'M SORRY
TO SAY WE'RE DOWN TO OUR LAST
MINUTE AND A HALF HERE.
LET US GIVE IT TO YOU.
Québec IS GRIEVING TONIGHT.
I WANT TO KNOW WHAT THE Québec
MUSLIM COMMUNITY DOES NOW.

Amira says WELL, I
MEAN, I THINK Québec MUSLIMS
HOLD THEIR CHILDREN A LITTLE
TIGHTER, THEY TALK ABOUT THE
INCREDIBLE OUTPOURING OF SUPPORT
WE'VE SEEN ACROSS CANADA AND
AROUND THE WORLD.
I THINK WHAT WE HAVE TO REALLY
HOLD ONTO AT THIS MOMENT IS A
LOT OF HOPE THAT WE ARE GOING TO
GET THROUGH THIS VERY DIFFICULT
TIME.
CHILDREN ARE AFRAID.
WHEN I WAS AT THE VIGIL, THERE
WERE KIDS THERE, AND IT MEANT A
LOT TO SEE ALL THE PEOPLE
GATHERED TOGETHER AND SORT OF
REALLY REAFFIRMING WHAT IT IS WE
STAND FOR AS A SOCIETY, AND I
THINK THAT REALLY MUST BE THE
MESSAGE THAT WE SORT OF CARRY IN
OUR HEARTS GOING FORWARD.

Steve says I SURE HOPE YOU'RE
WRONG, BESSMA, AND THAT THIS
ISN'T THE NEW NORMAL, BECAUSE WE
CANADIANS SURE LIKE TO THINK OF
OURSELVES AS BEING SOMEWHAT
IMMUNE FROM THESE HORRENDOUS
INTERNATIONAL FORCES.

Bessma says I HOPE I'M
WRONG AS WELL.
I REALLY DO.

The caption changes to "Producer: Cara Stern, @carastern; Producer: Katie O'Connor, @KA_OConnor."

Steve says YOU HAVEN'T BEEN
MUCH IN THE PAST.
THAT'S WHAT CONCERNS ME HERE.
THAT'S OUR TIME.
I WANT TO THANK EVERYBODY FOR
PARTICIPATING TONIGHT ON
OBVIOUSLY SHORT NOTICE, AMIRA
ELGHAWABY WITH THE NATIONAL
COUNCIL OF CANADIAN MUSLIMS FROM
OUR STUDIOS IN OTTAWA.
HERE IN OUR STUDIO, AMARNATH,
PROGRAM ON EXTREMISM, GEORGE
WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY, AND
BESSMA MOMANI SENIOR FELLOW WITH
THE CIGI, THANKS FOR MAKING THE
TRIP IN FROM WATERLOO TONIGHT.
AND CHRISTIAN LEUPRECHT,
PROFESSOR OF POLITICAL SCIENCE
WITH THE ROYAL MILITARY COLLEGE
IN KINGSTON AND AFFILIATED WITH
QUEEN'S UNIVERSITY AS WELL.
KAMRAN BHATTI, MUSLIM COMMUNITY
ACTIVIST.
WE'RE GRATEFUL FOR ALL OF YOUR
PARTICIPATION ON THIS VERY, VERY
SAD DAY IN CANADIAN HISTORY.
THANKS.

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