Transcript: Toronto Shutdown? | Oct 24, 1996

Steve sits in the studio. He’s in his thirties. He has short, curly brown hair and is clean-shaven. He’s wearing a gray shirt and suit and a brown tie.
His round chair is placed in front of a white glass divided window.

He looks at the audience and opens the show.

He says WELL, OF COURSE, THE BIG
QUESTIONS IN TORONTO
THIS WEEK: ARE YOU GOING
TO WORK ON FRIDAY?
AND IF YOU'RE WORKING,
HOW'RE YOU GONNA GET THERE?
ON FRIDAY, LABOUR AND SOCIAL
GROUPS SAY THEY'LL SHUT DOWN
TORONTO IN THE
BIGGEST PROTEST YET
AGAINST THE MIKE
HARRIS GOVERNMENT.
THERE WERE SIMILAR GENERAL
STRIKES IN LONDON AND
HAMILTON AND KITCHENER
AND PETERBOROUGH,
BUT THE SHUTDOWN OF THE
COUNTRY'S LARGEST CITY
AND FINANCIAL CENTRE IS AN
AMBITIOUS AND CONTENTIOUS PLAN.

Paula, a woman in her thirties, appears. She has blonde hair in a bob cut and earrings. She’s wearing a white blouse under a blue tailored suit.

She says TOMORROW THE COURTS WILL
HEAR THE FIRST IN A SERIES
OF INJUNCTIONS AIMED AT
STOPPING THE UNIONS.
THE TORONTO TRANSIT
COMMISSION IS SEEKING
A COURT ORDER TO KEEP THE
BUSES AND THE SUBWAYS RUNNING.
THE TTC IS ALSO THREATENING
TO SUE UNION LEADERS
FOR LOST BUSINESS AND
THE PROVINCE HAS TOLD
ITS CIVIL SERVANTS THEY ARE
EXPECTED TO BE AT WORK.
TO TALK ABOUT
FRIDAY'S SHUTDOWN,
I'M JOINED BY TORONTO CITY
COUNCILLOR TOM JAKOBEK,

Tom Jakobek is in his forties. He has receding short curly blond hair and is clean-shaven. He’s wearing a white shirt, gray suit and a brownish tie.

Paula goes on WHO OPPOSES LABOUR'S
ACTION, AND SID RYAN,
ONTARIO PRESIDENT OF THE
CANADIAN UNION OF PUBLIC
EMPLOYEES, THE LARGEST
GROUP PARTICIPATING
IN FRIDAY'S
GENERAL STRIKE.

Sid Ryan is in his forties too, he has straight blond hair, he wears a trimmed van dyke beard and brown glasses.
His white shirt is buttoned to the neck and he has a brown sports jacket over it.

She continues WELCOME BOTH.
TOM, SID, MAY I
CALL YOU THAT?

She smiles.

She sits at the head of a brown wooden table and both guests face each other. There are three glasses of water on the table.

Paula turns to Tom and says TOM, I WOULD LIKE
TO START WITH YOU.
CAN YOU GIVE US A SENSE
OF WHY YOU'RE OPPOSED
TO FRIDAY'S ACTION.
IS IT THE OBJECTIVE
OR IS IT THE TACTICS?
OR IS IT BOTH?

Tom answers WELL, I THINK IT REALLY
COMES DOWN TO A BALANCING ACT
BETWEEN THE RIGHTS
OF A PERSON TO PROTEST
AND THE RIGHTS OF A
PERSON TO GO TO WORK
AND I THINK THAT THE DAY
OF PROTEST BEING ORGANIZED
IS A PERFECT EXAMPLE OF
THE FREEDOM OF SPEECH
THAT WE ENJOY IN
THE COUNTRY.
IT'S THE RIGHT OF THE
PEOPLE TO PROTEST,
TO SAY THAT THEY'RE NOT
HAPPY WITH THE GOVERNMENT,
TO SAY THAT THEY'RE NOT
HAPPY ABOUT THE DIRECTION
THAT THE LABOUR
MOVEMENT IS GOING IN,
OR THE LACK OF SUPPORT.
BUT IT CERTAINLY
ISN'T SOMETHING THAT
SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO
STAMP ON THE RIGHTS
OF OTHER PEOPLE WHO,
FOR WHATEVER REASON,
BECAUSE THEY AGREE WITH
THE GOVERNMENT OR BECAUSE
THEY'RE NOT INVOLVED IN THE
LABOUR MOVEMENT OR BECAUSE
THEY ARE INVOLVED IN THE
LABOUR MOVEMENT BUT DECIDE
THAT THEY DON'T AGREE
WITH THE PROTEST,
THAT YOU CAN'T TAKE
AWAY THEIR RIGHTS
TO BASICALLY GO TO WORK.
AND THAT'S REALLY WHAT IT
COMES DOWN TO; IT COMES DOWN
TO THE FUNDAMENTAL
RIGHT OF WHETHER OR NOT
I HAVE THE RIGHT TO STAND UP
WITH A SIGN AND A PLACARD
AND SAY HEY, I'M AGAINST
THE GOVERNMENT - SURE I DO!
DO I HAVE THE RIGHT
TO STOP YOU, PAULA,
FROM GOING TO WORK?
ABSOLUTELY NOT.

Paula says HOW 'BOUT THAT, SID, ARE YOU
MAYBE TAKING THIS TOO FAR?

Sid says NO, WE'RE NOT AND, TOM, WHO
LIKES TO BE THE CHEERLEADER
FOR MIKE HARRIS AND THE
CHIEF SPOKESPERSON
FOR THE HARRIS GOVERNMENT

A caption appears under Sid. It reads “Sid Ryan, Ontario president C.U.P.E”

He continues BECAUSE HARRIS IS NOT ABLE
TO DEBATE THIS ISSUE HIMSELF,
IS ABSOLUTELY WRONG
WHEN HE TALKS ABOUT UNIONS
TRYING TO PREVENT ANYBODY
FROM GOING TO WORK.
LET ME MAKE IT PERFECTLY
CLEAR, THAT IN OUR
DEMONSTRATIONS IN HAMILTON,
KITCHENER-WATERLOO,
LONDON - WHAT WE PUT UP
WERE PEACEFUL, LAWFUL
INFORMATION PICKET LINES AND
WHAT WE DO IS WE ENCOURAGE
OUR MEMBERS TO JOIN US
ON THE PICKET LINE.
AND AS A MATTER OF FACT, IN
TOM'S OWN COUNCIL LAST WEEK
THEY VOTED TO SUPPORT
THE DAYS OF PROTEST
AND THEY'VE GONE EVEN
FURTHER THAN THAT,
THEY'VE GIVEN TO RIGHT TO
EVERYBODY WHO WANTS TO BE
AWAY FROM WORK TO BE AWAY
ON THAT PARTICULAR DAY,
WITHOUT ANY FORM
OF DISCIPLINE.

Tom interrupts. He says WELL MAYBE, PAULA, I'M
SURPRISED BECAUSE MAYBE
WE DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM THEN
BECAUSE AS SID HAS POINTED OUT,
TORONTO CITY COUNCIL
HAS SAID IF THE EMPLOYEES
WANT TO TAKE OFF, IF THEY
WANT TO TAKE A LIEU DAY
OR WHATEVER, OR A DAY THAT'S
OWED TO THEM RATHER THAN
BEING PAID TO TAKE OFF
THEN THEY CAN DO SO.
I DON'T HAVE A
PROBLEM WITH THAT.
I THINK YOU HAVE TO
ACKNOWLEDGE THE FACT
THAT I DON'T HAVE A
PROBLEM WITH THAT.
AND FOR THAT MATTER, IF YOU
WANT TO USE NATHAN PHILLIPS
SQUARE OR IF YOU WANT TO
USE ANY MUNICIPAL BUILDING
AS A PUBLIC PLACE TO PROTEST,
YOU CAN GO AHEAD AND DO THAT,
AND IF THE PROTEST IS GONNA
BE AS MEEK AND AS PEACEFUL
AS SID HAS SAID IN OTHER
CITIES, THEN I DON'T THINK
THE PEOPLE OF TORONTO ARE
GONNA HAVE A PROBLEM.
BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT
WE'RE READING ABOUT
IN THE NEWSPAPERS AND THAT'S
NOT, SID, WHAT YOU'VE SAID.

He looks directly at Sid and shakes his head.

Sid answers THAT'S INCORRECT
ONCE AGAIN.
THERE HAS NOT BEEN ANY
INCIDENTS OF VIOLENCE IN
ANY OF THE DEMONSTRATIONS
THAT LABOUR HAS CONDUCTED -
YOU'VE JUST ADMITTED THAT
YOURSELF A SECOND AGO -
AND THERE'S NO REASON TO
BELIEVE THAT THE DEMONSTRATIONS
IN TORONTO, IN ANY
OF OUR LOCATIONS,
WILL RESULT IN VIOLENCE.
AS A MATTER OF FACT, WHAT
WE'RE ALL ABOUT, TOM,
IS TRYING TO GET A MESSAGE
ACROSS TO QUEEN'S PARK.
TO GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE, I
WAS DOWN AT METRO HALL
TWO OR THREE DAYS AGO AND I
WITNESSED ALL OF THESE PEOPLE
COMING IN IN WHEELCHAIRS
AND PEOPLE WITH WALKERS
AND PEOPLE WITH RESPIRATORY
EQUIPMENT MAKING
THEIR WAY INTO METRO HALL.
WHY?
BECAUSE THEY'VE BEEN
CUT OFF THE WHEEL-TRANS.
AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TRYING
TO DO IS TOGETHER SAY, HEY,
SOMEBODY HAS GOT TO BE
SPEAKING OUT ON BEHALF
OF THE DISABLED COMMUNITY
IN THIS PROVINCE.
WE'RE DOING THAT WITH
THESE DAYS OF PROTEST.

Paula says WE KNOW THAT
METRO, FOR EXAMPLE,
IS SEEKING AN INJUNCTION.
THEY WANT TO KEEP
THE TTC RUNNING,
THEY'RE AFRAID THAT IN
FACT TRANSPORTATION,
WHICH IS CONSIDERED BY MANY
TO BE AN ESSENTIAL SERVICE,
WILL BE SHUT DOWN.
IF THEY GET THEIR
INJUNCTION,
WILL YOU OBEY IT?

Sid says FIRST OFF, THE LEGAL
ADVICE THAT WE ARE GETTING
IS THAT THE INJUNCTION WILL
NOT PROHIBIT PICKETERS
FROM APPEARING AT THE TTC,
PROVIDING THOSE PICKETS
ARE PEACEFUL,
THEY'RE LAWFUL,
AND THEY'RE INFORMATIONAL
PICKET LINES.
IT'S NOT A LEGAL DISPUTE
BETWEEN THE EMPLOYER AND
THE UNIONS; IT IS SIMPLY A
POLITICAL PROTEST AND SO
LONG AS WE CONDUCT IT IN
THAT FASHION AND ENCOURAGE
OUR MEMBERSHIP TO JOIN
US, BUT NOT HOLD THEM OUT
FORCEFULLY, THEN WE WILL BE
ABLE TO HAVE THOSE PICKETS.
SO WE FULLY INTEND TO
HAVE THOSE PICKETS UP,
INFORMATION PICKETS, AND I
FULLY INTEND TO BE AT THOSE -

Paula questions BUT ISN'T YOUR
HOPE THAT, IN FACT,
THAT YOU WILL
BRING THE TTC DOWN;
THAT IT WILL NOT OPERATE
AS IT NORMALLY DOES?

Sid explains OUR OBJECTIVE IS TO HAVE
AN INFORMATION PICKET LINE,
TO GET AS MUCH INFORMATION
OUT AS WE POSSIBLY CAN,
AGAIN ABOUT MIKE HARRIS -
NOTHING TO DO WITH TOM,
NOTHING TO DO WITH ALAN
TONKS - IT IS PURELY
DIRECTED AT QUEEN'S PARK AND
WHAT MIKE HARRIS IS DOING.
ACTUALLY, WHAT I'D
LIKE TO SEE TOM DO,
TO BE VERY HONEST, I'D LOVE
TO SEE TOM STAND UP AND SAY
TO MIKE HARRIS, YOU KNOW,
WE'RE REALLY FED UP
WITH THE HOSPITAL CLOSURES
IN THE CITY OF TORONTO
WHERE WE'RE GOING TO SEE 14
HOSPITALS CLOSE IN THIS CITY.
I'D LOVE TO SEE YOU SPEAK UP ON
BEHALF OF YOUR CONSTITUENTS
AND SAY WHY ARE YOU TAKING
500 MILLION DOLLARS OUT OF
THE EDUCATION SYSTEM RIGHT
HERE IN THIS VERY CITY?
I'D LOVE TO SEE YOU SPEAK OUT
AGAINST THE WHEEL-TRANS CUTS.
I'D LOVE TO SEE YOU SPEAK
OUT ABOUT THE CHILDCARE CUTS -

Paula interrupts him and says OKAY, SID, BUT LET'S GET
BACK TO THE INJUNC-
SID, LET'S GET BACK TO THE
INJUNCTIONS FOR A MOMENT -

Tom says HOLD ON, I DON'T THINK I CAN
LET HIM GET AWAY WITH THAT.
I MEAN, I THINK, SID, WE HAVE
TO FIRST OF ALL SAY THIS.

A caption appears under Tom. It reads “Tom Jakobek, Toronto city Councillor.”

He goes on FIRST OF ALL, I CONSIDER
MYSELF TO BE VERY FRIENDLY
TO LABOUR AND I THINK YOU'D
HAVE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THE FACT
THAT I'M NOT SOME SORT OF
RIGHT-WING EXTREMIST
WHO GOES OUT CONTRACTING OUT
YOUR JOBS OR LAYING PEOPLE OFF.
I'VE TAKEN A DIFFERENT
APPROACH AND I THINK THAT'S
VERY IMPORTANT TO MENTION.
NOT TO GIVE PEOPLE THIS
PAINTED PICTURE OF SOME
EXTREME VIEWPOINT.
HAVING SAID THAT

Sid says TOM, I'M NOT,

Tom raises his hand and says I DIDN'T INTERRUPT YOU.

Sid says GO AHEAD.

Tom continues THE POINT I WANT TO MAKE,
AND I THINK THIS IS
AN IMPORTANT POINT, IS THAT
WHAT YOU'VE JUST SAID,
AND WHAT YOU'VE BEEN SAYING
AND A LOT OF THE PROTEST
LEADERS HAVE BEEN
SAYING IN THE NEWSPAPER,
ARE TWO DIFFERENT THINGS.
NO ONE IS GONNA CHALLENGE
YOUR RIGHT AND YOUR NEED
TO GO OUT AND PROTEST,
TO GIVE OUT INFORMATION,
TO LET THE PUBLIC KNOW, THE
GENERAL PUBLIC KNOW
HOW UPSET YOU ARE AND WHY YOU
THINK THEY SHOULD BE UPSET,
BUT THAT'S NOT
WHAT'S BEING SAID.
AND I TELL YOU THAT THE
WHOLE TENOR OF THIS
HAS NOT BEEN DRIVEN
FROM ONE SIDE!
IT'S BEEN DRIVEN,

Sid says TOM, YOU'RE WRONG -

Tom repeats I DIDN'T INTERRUPT YOU.

Sid says CARRY ON, TOM.

Tom goes on I'M JUST GONNA SAY THAT
I THINK THE ISSUE HERE
IS WHEN YOU CROSS THAT LINE,
THAT LINE IN THE SAND
AS YOU WOULD CALL IT, WHEN YOU
START DEPRIVING OTHER PEOPLE
OF THEIR RIGHT, FREE MOVEMENT,
AND TO GO TO WORK.

Sid cuts him off TOM, YOU'VE HAD ENOUGH
TIME ON THAT ONE.
LET ME TELL YOU, YOU'VE
JUST SAID THAT I WOULD NOT
DEPRIVE ANYBODY OF THE
RIGHT TO GO TO WORK.
YOU'VE INDICATED THAT YOU,
SORRY, THAT YOU DISAGREE,
OR WOULD NOT DISAGREE, WITH
MY RIGHT TO BE ABLE TO SAY
TO MY WORKERS JOIN US
PEACEFULLY ON THE PICKET LINE,
WHEN IN FACT YOU
JUST SERVED ME WITH
AN INJUNCTION TONIGHT!
TRYING TO PROHIBIT ME
FROM DOING EXACTLY THAT.

Tom shakes his head and says NO, I DIDN'T.

Sid continues I'M TRYING TO GIVE MY
WORKERS THE ABSOLUTE RIGHT
TO SAY LET'S JOIN A
POLITICAL PROTEST -
TOM, YOU DID, DON'T
LIE TO US - TONIGHT -

Tom asks DOES IT SAY YOU
CAN'T PICKET?

Sid says ABSOLUTELY.
YOU SAID YOU DID NOT
WANT ANY PICKETS,
YOU DON'T WANT ANY
INFORMATIONAL PICKETS,

Tom says NO, YOU DIDN'T READ IT.

Sid answers YES, I DID READ IT, TOM.

Paula interrupts OKAY, LET'S JUST, FOR THE
BENEFIT OF OUR VIEWERS.
TOM, YOU'VE BROUGHT
YOUR OWN INJUNCTION
TO TRY TO MAKE
SURE THAT WHAT?

Tom explains THE INJUNCTION THAT I
BROUGHT FORWARD IS BASICALLY
TO GIVE MYSELF, MY EMPLOYEES
AND ANY OTHER MUNICIPAL
EMPLOYEE OR MEMBER
OF THE PUBLIC,
FREE ACCESS TO AND FROM
ANY MUNICIPAL BUILDING
ON OCTOBER THE 25TH.
IT DOES NOT, UNDER ANY
CIRCUMSTANCES, YOU PULL IT
OUT AND YOU READ IT, IT DOES
NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES
INFRINGE ON SID, OR ANYBODY
ELSE, PROTESTING.
IN FACT, I THINK
THEY SHOULD PROTEST.

Sid asks WHY DIDN'T TOM TAKE OUT
AN INJUNCTION AGAINST
THE DOCTORS IN THE PROVINCE
WHO HAVE DEPRIVED
HIS CONSTITUENTS OF
BASIC MEDICAL SERVICES
AROUND THIS PROVINCE?
NOT ONE PEEP OUT OF
YOU, TOM, NOT ONE PEEP.
NO, YOU DIDN'T GO TO THE
COURTS AND GET AN INJUNCTION
AGAINST THE DOCTORS, YOU
DIDN'T GO TO A COURT WITH
AN INJUNCTION TO STOP HARRIS
FROM CLOSING THE HOSPITALS
IN TORONTO, YOU DIDN'T GET
AN INJUNCTION TO TRY AND
STOP TAKING MONEY OUT
OF THE EDUCATION SYSTEM,
WHICH ALL DEPRIVE YOUR
CONSTITUENTS OF BASIC SERVICES.
BUT NO, YOU'RE TRYING TO
ATTACK THE UNIONS WHO HAVE
A LITTLE BIT OF BACKBONE TO
TRY AND STAND UP AGAINST HARRIS.
WHY AREN'T YOU SPEAKING
OUT AGAINST HARRIS?

Tom mimics playing violin and says WELL, SID, IT'S GREAT TO
PLAY THE VIOLIN ON THE POOR
WORKING PERSON
BUT YOU KNOW WHAT?
IT'S THE VERY PEOPLE THAT
YOU CLAIM TO REPRESENT
AND THE VERY PEOPLE THAT
YOU CLAIM TO WANT TO BE
CONCERNED ABOUT, THE PEOPLE
IN WHEELCHAIRS TRYING
TO FIGHT FOR
WHEEL-TRANS SERVICE,
THAT YOU'RE GONNA
SHUT DOWN ON FRIDAY.
AND THEIR DOCTORS'
APPOINTMENTS CAN'T WAIT
THE EXTRA DAY, SID.
AND THEIR KIDS NEED
TO GO TO DAYCARE.

Sid says WE'RE SHUTTING
DOWN FOR 24 HOURS.
YOU SAT IDLY BY AND
ALLOWED THAT SERVICE
TO BE COMPLETELY CUT ON
A PERMANENT BASIS.
WE'VE DONE IT FOR
24 HOURS.

Paula puts in OKAY, SO TOM - HOLD
ON - SO IN FACT,
WHAT HAPPENS IS THAT THE
INJUNCTION - LET'S SAY YOU
WIN THE INJUNCTION - AND
IT'S NOT OBEYED AND PEOPLE
DO HAVE DIFFICULTY
GETTING ACROSS LINES
OR THEY DO HAVE DIFFICULTY
ACCESSING SERVICES,
IS THERE A REMEDY FOR YOU?

Tom says ABSOLUTELY, BUT I -
Paula asks WHAT IS IT?

Tom says ACCORDING TO SID I DON'T
HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT IT.
ACCORDING TO SID, THERE'S
NOTHING GONNA HAPPEN.
PEOPLE ARE GOING
TO BE PROTESTING,
THEY'RE GONNA HAND OUT
AN INFORMATION SHEET,
AND IT'S ALL OVER AND I'M
GONNA BE A HAPPY CAMPER
AND SO WILL EVERYBODY
ELSE, SID,

Paula looks at Sid and asks IS THAT RIGHT?

Tom raises his voice and says COME OUT TOMORROW AND
TELL PEOPLE THAT, SID!

Sid answers vehemently I'M TELLING THEM
RIGHT NOW.
THEY'RE LISTENING
TO ME TONIGHT!
WHAT WE'RE SAYING IS, WE'RE
GOING TO BE HANDING OUT
INFORMATION, PIECES
OF INFORMATION,
WE'RE GOING TO HAVE AN
INFORMATION PICKET LINE.
ALREADY THOUGH, ON
A VOLUNTARY BASIS,
THE UNIVERSITIES
HAVE CLOSED DOWN,
THE SCHOOLS HAVE GIVEN THE
EMPLOYEES THE TIME OFF -

Tom asks WHY?

Sid repeats WHY?
BECAUSE THEY WANT THEM
TO HAVE THE RIGHT TO
PARTICIPATE IN
A LEGAL PROTEST!

Tom says MORE THAN THAT.

Sid answers THAT'S WHY.

Tom says again MORE THAN THAT.
THERE'S PEOPLE WHO AREN'T
GOING TO WORK ON FRIDAY
BECAUSE THEY'RE AFRAID, SID.
AND YOU'VE DONE A LOT TO DO
THAT AND THAT'S TERRIBLE.

Sid says NO TOM, THESE ARE THE SCHOOL
BOARD'S ADMINISTRATORS
WHO ARE WILLING TO GO OUT
AND SAY TO THEIR STUDENTS
AND SAY TO THEIR WORKERS, GO OUT
AND PROTEST THE HARRIS CUTS.
AND THEY'RE LOOKING TO
PEOPLE LIKE YOU, TOM,
WHO FAILED MISERABLY TO DO
THAT AND THAT'S WHY THE
UNIONS ARE STEPPING IN AND
THIS POPULAR MOVEMENT IS
DEVELOPING TO BE
ABLE TO PROTEST -

Paula turn to Tom and asks TOM, LET'S STAY FOCUSED FOR A
MOMENT ON WHAT WE'VE BEEN
TOLD IS LIKELY TO HAPPEN.
WE HAVE NOW HEARD FROM DAVID
GUNN, THE HEAD OF THE TTC,
THAT, IF IN FACT, IT
ISN'T BUSINESS AS USUAL,
HE'S CONSIDERING SUING.
WHAT DO YOU
THINK ABOUT THAT?

He answers WELL, I DON'T THINK THAT'S
THE REMEDY AND I DON'T THINK
THAT'S THE ANSWER AND, QUITE
FRANKLY, THE UNIONS WOULD BE
ABSOLUTE FOOLS IF THEY
ACTUALLY TRIED TO SHUT DOWN
THE SYSTEM AND TAKE THE
BRUNT OF THAT LEGAL ACTION.
ACCORDING TO SID THAT'S NOT
GOING TO HAPPEN SO WE DON'T
HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT IT.
IN FACT, A LOT OF THE THINGS
THAT I'VE BEEN WORRIED ABOUT
FOR THE LAST TWO WEEKS, I'M
NO LONGER WORRIED ABOUT
'CAUSE SID HAS JUST SAID
THAT'S NOT GONNA HAPPEN.

Paula looks at Sid and says SO, SID, IF YOU FIND OUT
THAT THE BUSES AREN'T RUNNING
AS NORMAL, AND THAT SERVICES
ARE BEING INTERRUPTED,
WHAT ARE YOU WILLING
TO DO ABOUT IT?

Sid says WHAT I'M SAYING IS THAT IT
IS EVERY EMPLOYEE'S RIGHT
TO PARTICIPATE IN
A LEGAL PROTEST.

Tom puts in NO ONE'S DENYING
YOU THAT.

Sid continues IT'S A POLITICAL PROTEST
AND WE'RE GOING TO ENCOURAGE
THOSE WORKERS TO JOIN
US ON OUR PICKET LINE.
NOBODY WILL BE FORCEFULLY
HELD OUT FROM WORK.
THAT MAY RESULT IN A
LOSS OF SERVICE, GRANTED,
NO QUESTION ABOUT IT.
I'M NOT DENYING THAT
FOR ONE SECOND.
AND IF WE'RE SUCCESSFUL IN
CONVINCING ALL OF OUR EMPLOYEES
TO JOIN US ON THE PICKET
LINE, THE END RESULT OF THAT
MAY BE THAT THE TTC WILL NOT
BE OPERATIONAL FOR 24 HOURS
AND WE'RE SAYING THAT'S AN
INCONVENIENCE TO THE PUBLIC,
GRANTED, FOR 24 HOURS.

Paula cross-questions him BUT AREN'T YOU IN THAT FACT
ADMITTING THAT YOU MAY BE
PREVENTING SOME PEOPLE
FROM GETTING TO WORK WHO
OTHERWISE WOULD LIKE TO GO.

Sid says AND AGAIN, I WANT TO
STRESS THE POINT
THAT THIS IS FOR
A 24-HOUR BASIS.
WHAT WE'RE TRYING
TO DO IS GET THE PUBLIC
TO PUT THEMSELVES INTO THE
SHOES, FOR INSTANCE,
OF THE DISABLED PEOPLE
WHOSE SERVICE HAS BEEN CUT
PERMANENTLY AND NO
POLITICIAN HAS STOOD UP
ON THEIR BEHALF
AND SPOKEN OUT.

Tom steps in and says YOU KNOW WHAT, I
GOTTA TELL YA.
FIRST OF ALL, I'M NOT GONNA
GET INTO A LONG DISCUSSION.
SID OBVIOUSLY HASN'T PAID
ATTENTION TO MY VOTING RECORD
BECAUSE HE WOULDN'T SAY ALL
THOSE NASTY THINGS ABOUT ME,
BUT LET ME BE MORE SUCCINCT
TO THE POINT HERE, OKAY.
YOU KNOW, SID, I THINK
IT'S A BIG MISTAKE TRYING
TO PULL PUBLIC SUPPORT
BY TELLING THE PUBLIC,
THE WORKING POOR THAT ARE
OUT THERE WHO DEPEND
ON THOSE PUBLIC
TRANSPORTATION SYSTEMS.
IT'S NOT GONNA BE THE BAY
STREET BOYS THAT ARE GONNA
BE TAKING THE
SUBWAY THAT MORNING.
IT'S GONNA BE THE
WORKING PEOPLE.

Sid answers DON'T YOU TALK TO ME
ABOUT THE WORKING POOR -

Tom goes on AND WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN -

Sid says I REPRESENT THE
WORKING POOR -

Tom shakes his head and says I DON'T THINK YOU DO.

Sid says THE AVERAGE

Tom interrupts NO, YOU DON'T.

Sid repeats THE AVERAGE,

Tom says again NO, YOU DON'T.

Paula steps in and says WE CAN ONLY HEAR YOU
ON AT A TIME, HOLD ON.
SID, GO AHEAD, SID

Sid goes on I REPRESENT THE
AVERAGE WORKING -

Tom says yet again YOU DON'T.

Sid says WE REPRESENT THE WORKING
POOR IN THIS PROVINCE.
26 thousand dollars PER YEAR IS
THE AVERAGE WAGE;
SOME OF THEM ARE 19 thousand dollars
IN THE CHILDCARE SECTOR.
SO DON'T YOU TELL ME
ABOUT THE WORKING POOR.
AND THOSE PEOPLE
ARE SAYING TO US,
THAT WE WOULD LIKE YOU TO
GO OUT THERE AND CONDUCT
A BROAD BASE PROTEST
AGAINST THE HARRIS CUTS
BECAUSE NOBODY ELSE IS
SPEAKING ON THEIR BEHALF.
AND WE'RE GOING TO HAVE
ABOUT 200 thousand PEOPLE
IN THE CITY OF
TORONTO DEMONSTRATING
ON THE SATURDAY AND
DON'T YOU TELL ME
THAT THAT'S NOT
PUBLIC SUPPORT.
NOBODY IN THIS COUNTRY HAS
EVER BEEN ABLE TO PULL
THAT KIND OF PUBLIC SUPPORT
BEHIND THEIR MOVEMENT AND
WE'RE DOING IT AND THAT'S
WHAT FRIGHTENS POLITICIANS
LIKE YOU, TOM, BECAUSE
THIS IS A MOVEMENT
AND MOVEMENTS FRIGHTEN
POLITICIANS LIKE YOU.

Paula says BUT, SID, 200 thousand PEOPLE
PROBABLY WON'T DO WHAT IT IS
YOU SAY YOU WANT, WHICH IS
TO GET RID OF, EVENTUALLY,
THE MIKE HARRIS GOVERNMENT.
ARE YOU AFRAID THAT YOU MIGHT
BE ALIENATING SOME PEOPLE
WHO MIGHT OTHERWISE
SUPPORT YOU BECAUSE
YOU ARE
INCONVENIENCING THEM?

Sid explains NO, THIS IS SHORT-TERM.
WE KNOW THE ELECTION IS
THREE YEARS DOWN THE ROAD.
WE'RE BUILDING A BROAD BASED
MOVEMENT HERE AND WE HAVE
PULLED TOGETHER - LET'S
LEAVE LABOUR OUT OF THIS FOR
A SECOND - WE HAVE PULLED
200 COMMUNITY GROUPS TOGETHER
AND THE INTERFAITH COMMUNITY,
THE ARTS COMMUNITY,
CHILDCARE ADVOCATES,
WOMEN'S ORGANIZATIONS -
RIGHT ACROSS THE
ENTIRE SPECTRUM.
NOBODY HAS EVER MANAGED TO PULL
THOSE PEOPLE TOGETHER BEFORE.
SO WE HAVE BUILT A VERY
BROAD BASED POPULAR MOVEMENT
THAT IS GOING TO BE POLITICIZED
IN TWO OR THREE YEARS' TIME
TO DELIVER THE RESULTS
THAT WE NEED AND THAT IS,
GET THOSE SCOUNDRELS
OUT OF QUEEN'S PARK
AND THEN TAKE A LOOK AT
INDIVIDUALS LIKE TOM AND
THEIR VOTING RECORD, AND
SEE IF THEY DESERVE THEIR
SUPPORT AND IF THEY DON'T?

He makes a popping sound and gestures that they’ll be kicked out of office.

Tom says WELL THAT SOUNDS LIKE
THE NDP'S LAST PLATFORM
PROVINCIALLY AND I
THINK IT KIND OF FAILED.
I HAVE TO SAY THAT, YOU
KNOW, AT THE END OF THE DAY,
THE PUBLIC WILL DECIDE.
THE PUBLIC WILL BE THE JUDGE
OF IT ALL AND I THINK
THAT INCONVENIENCING
PEOPLE IN THE PUBLIC,
TAKING AWAY BASIC SERVICES
WHICH THEY REQUIRE.
I'VE HEARD SID SAY, AND I
THINK YOU SHOULD BE COMMENDED
FOR IT, THAT ESSENTIAL
SERVICES WILL BE PROTECTED.
YOU KNOW, CHILDCARE
CENTRES HAVE CLOSED,
REGARDLESS OF THE FACT
OF WHETHER THE PARENTS
HAVE TO GO TO WORK THAT DAY
BECAUSE THEY MAY NOT BE
CIVIC EMPLOYEES OR
GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES.
NOT EVERYBODY IS A UNION
OR A GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEE.
WE SHOULDN'T
ASSUME SUCH.
THERE MAY BE A LOT
OF PEOPLE THAT ARE,
BUT NOT EVERYBODY IS, AND
A LOT OF THOSE PEOPLE
WHO AREN'T, THEY DON'T HAVE
THAT KIND OF PROTECTION
YOUR MEMBERS HAVE.
A LOT OF THOSE PEOPLE AREN'T
GONNA BE GIVEN THE DAY OFF -

Sid says TOM.

Tom goes on AND THEY'RE GONNA HAVE NO
WAY TO GETTING TO WORK
AND I THINK YOU'RE HURTING
THE WRONG PEOPLE, SID.

Paula asks ARE YOU GOING TO BE
PREVENTING - ARE YOU GOING
PROTECT ESSENTIAL SERVICES?

Sid says ABSOLUTELY, NO QUESTION.
WE'VE SAID IT -

Tom asks IS CHILDCARE ESSENTIAL?

Sid frown and says TOM, PLEASE.
HOSPITALS ARE GOING
TO BE PROTECTED,
NURSING HOMES ARE
GOING TO BE PROTECTED,
HOSTELS FOR HOMELESS WILL BE
PROTECTED, NURSING HOMES,
AND WE'LL ALSO EXTEND THAT
TO LOOKING AT WELFARE,
WHERE PEOPLE AND
HOMELESS PEOPLE, ET CETERA,
WILL NEED TO GET IN,
BUT I WANT SAY SOMETHING,

Paula asks BUT HOLD ON, WE'VE ALREADY
HEARD THOUGH, FOR EXAMPLE,
THAT ELECTIVE SURGERY HAS
BEEN CANCELLED AT HOSPITALS,
SO YOU'RE DRAWING YOUR LINES
WITHIN THE MEDICAL SERVICES?

Sid explains NO, WE'RE NOT TOUCHING
THE HOSPITALS AT ALL.
THE HOSPITALS HAVE DECIDED
THEMSELVES THAT THEY WANT
THEIR EMPLOYEES TO GO OUT
AND PROTEST THE CUTS
AND PROTEST THE
HOSPITAL CLOSURES.
SO THEY HAVE WORKED
OUT WITH THE EMPLOYEES,
ON A VOLUNTARY BASIS, THE
UNION'S NOT EVEN PART OF IT,
THEY SAID THEY WANT TO
GO DOWN TO MINIMUM
STAFFING LEVELS TO ALLOW OUR
EMPLOYEES TO GO OUT AND PROTEST.
BUT I WANT TO COME BACK
TO WHAT TOM WAS SAYING
A SECOND AGO AND THAT IS, TOM
MIGHT HAVE SOME CREDIBILITY
IF, IN FACT, HE WAS ALWAYS
STANDING UP AND PROTESTING
AGAINST CUTS AND SERVICES.
BUT I THINK IT'S SO PHONEY
TO BE SITTING HERE
AND SAYING THAT SOMEHOW HE
IS OUT THERE PROTECTING
THE SERVICES THAT'S
BEEN CUT FOR 24 HOURS,
WHEN HE SAID
ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ABOUT
THE PERMANENT CUTS THAT
HARRIS HAS MADE.
AND THAT'S THE POINT
THAT TOM KEEPS MISSING.
IF HE STOOD UP AND PROTESTED
THE HOSPITAL CUTS AND
CHILDCARE CUTS, THEN HE
MIGHT HAVE SOME CREDIBILITY.

Tom answers I DON'T HAVE, AND I DON'T
THINK WE HAVE AN HOUR
TONIGHT FOR ME TO GO THROUGH
EVERY RECORDED VOTE WHERE,
IN FACT, I HAVE VOICED MY
OPPOSITION OR MY CONCERN
OR MY OBJECTIONS
TO SOMETHING THAT
THE PROVINCIAL GOVERNMENT DID
UNDER MIKE HARRIS OR BOB RAE!
BUT YOU KNOW WHAT?

Sid says WHY DIDN'T YOU FILE AN
INJUNCTION IN THE COURTS
TO STOP THEM FROM MAKING THE
CUTS TO THE HOSPITALS?

Tom answers BECAUSE YOU
WOULDN'T LISTEN!
'CAUSE YOU WOULDN'T SAY
WHAT YOU'VE SAID TONIGHT.

Sid cross-questions him BUT WHY WOULDN'T YOU GO
AFTER THE -

Tom responds 'CAUSE YOU DIDN'T SAY WHAT
YOU'VE SAID TONIGHT.

Sid says YOU WENT AFTER THE UNIONS.

Tom says I'LL TELL YOU WHAT.

Sid continues TO TRY AND PREVENT US
FROM PROTECTING THEM.
WHY DIDN'T YOU FILE
AN INJUNCTION, TOM?

Tom says IF YOU, SID RYAN, IF YOU -

Sid raises his voice and demands ANSWER THE QUESTION!
WHY DIDN'T YOU
FILE AN INJUNCTION?

Tom exclaims SID, LET ME FINISH.
IF YOU, SID RYAN, BEFORE 10
O'CLOCK TOMORROW MORNING,
COME OUT AND PUT IN WRITING
WHAT YOU'VE SAID TONIGHT
AND YOU GET ALL YOUR OTHER
COLLEAGUES TO DO THE SAME -
TO SAY THAT YOU'RE NOT
GOING TO INTIMIDATE PEOPLE;
THAT YOU'RE NOT GONNA
THREATEN PEOPLE;
THAT YOU'RE GONNA HAVE THIS
PEACEFUL DEMONSTRATION
AND DO ALL THE THINGS THAT
YOU'VE SAID TONIGHT -
YOU DO IT, THERE'LL BE NO
INJUNCTION TOMORROW!
THERE'LL BE NO
INJUNCTION TOMORROW.

Sid says I'VE SAID IT ON THE
RECORD PUBLICLY,
I'VE SAID IT IN
THE NEWSPAPERS,
I'M SAYING IT TONIGHT
IN THIS PROGRAM,
TOM, AND IF YOU
WILL TOMORROW,
COME OUT AND FILE AN
INJUNCTION AGAINST HARRIS
FOR ALL THE CUTS AND FOR
ALL THE DEVASTATION
HE'S CAUSING TO THE POOR
IN THIS PROVINCE,
THEN YOU MIGHT HAVE SOME
CREDIBILITY IN COMING ON
TO THIS SHOW, PRETENDING
THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AFTER
THE INTEREST IN LOOKING
AFTER YOUR CONSTITUENTS.

Tom says I'M NOT RUNNING FOR
PROVINCIAL POLITICS.

Sid says WELL THEN WHY ARE YOU
INTERFERING THEN IN THE PROTEST?
WHY DON'T YOU TURN
AROUND AND SAY -

Tom asks LISTEN, IF YOUR FIGHTS
WITH MIKE HARRIS, TAKE IT!
WHY ARE YOU TAKING
ON CITY HALL?

Paula says GENTLEMEN, I'VE GOT A
FEW QUICK SECONDS LEFT.
FROM LISTENING TO YOU TONIGHT,
ARE WE TO HEAR THAT THERE
ISN'T ROOM FOR NEGOTIATIONS
BEFORE FRIDAY,
BETWEEN THE TWO OF YOU?

Sid says THERE'S ROOM FOR
NEGOTIATIONS.
WE'VE ALREADY GONE IN AND
NEGOTIATED WITH ALAN TONKS,
ALL OF THE EMERGENCY
SERVICES I'VE TALKED ABOUT,
AND IF THERE'S ANY OTHER
SERVICES EMERGENCY THAT
THEY THINK THEY NEED,
WE WILL TALK ABOUT IT.
IN TERMS OF PICKET
LINES AND INFORMATION
PICKET LINES GOING UP?
THEY'LL BE GOING UP,
NO QUESTION ABOUT IT.

Paula says OKAY.
WITH THAT, I'M GOING TO
HAVE TO LEAVE IT THERE.
WE'LL BE BACK WITH MORE
STUDIO 2
RIGHT AFTER THIS.
THANK YOU BOTH.

Watch: Toronto Shutdown?